Australian Politics Forum - Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim

Auggie

Gold Member

Offline

The Bull Moose

Posts: 8571

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #30 - Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:43pm

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:28pm:

Auggie wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:16pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:14pm:

So you would not say anything like this?

Auggie wrote on Sep 26^th, 2018 at 6:56pm:

The fact is that they are a minority, which is the important fact here.

Important in so far as their minority status informs on their theological differences with Sunnis.

Can you explain how something as incidental as their minority status informs on them and becomes the key fact?

Yes.

Back to top

The Progressive President

IP Logged

Yadda

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 22369
A cat with a view

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #31 - Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:43pm

Auggie wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:01pm:

Ahmadis denounce the usage of a sword or any other form of coercion as a method of the propagation of the Islamic faith. In contrast to some of the commonly held views that historically Islam was spread by force, Ahmadis maintain that early Muslims did not take up the sword in order to spread their faith, but rather for the preservation of religion. In particular, the founder of the movement, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad stated that when Islam began gaining converts upon its birth, there was an ever-increasing tension against the new converts by the pagans of Mecca, which resulted in them being severely persecuted for many years. After many years of patience, the Muslim converts migrated to the neighbouring city of Medina. This did not stop persecuting the Muslims. They were pursued by the Pagans and it was only then that the Muslims first took up the sword in order to defend their lives and preserve the religion.[3]

Ahmadis denounce the usage of a sword as an Islamic concept with support from the Qur'an which according to them categorically rejects any form of coercion in religion. The Qur'an states:
“ There is no compulsion in religion ”
— The Qur'an 2:256

The fourth Caliph, of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, Mirza Tahir Ahmad states:
“ As far as Islam is concerned, it categorically rejects and condemns every form of terrorism. It does not provide any cover or justification for any act of violence, be it committed by an individual, a group or a government..... I most strongly condemn all acts and forms of terrorism because it is my deeply rooted belief that not only Islam but also no true religion, whatever its name, can sanction violence and bloodshed of innocent men, women and children in the name of God ”
— Murder in the Name of Allah - Mirza Tahir Ahmad [4]

TAQIYYA

Google;

taqiyya - the muslim doctrine of deceit

Auggie,

The repudiation of the FALSE use of Qur'an 2:256 by the follower of ISLAM, is made here.....

------- >

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1300943110/233#233

Quote:

Freedom of conscience is laid down by the Qur'an itself: "There is no compulsion in religion. Truth stands out clearly from falsehood; whoever rejects evil and believes in God has grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold that never breaks. And God is All-Hearing and All-Knowing." (Qur'an 2:256)

There is a famous Koran verse, often offered to naive non-moslems, within non-moslem jurisdictions,
....'proving' ISLAM's 'tolerance' of other religions.

"Let there be no compulsion in religion......."

Koran 2:256

What moslems always portray in places where they are in the minority, is that that Koran verse proves that ISLAM is tolerant of other faiths.

But the blatant, and often violent disregard by moslems [within moslem jurisdictions], SHOW THAT ALL GOOD MOSLEMS ARE BARE FACED LIARS, in insisting they are tolerant of other faiths....

The darker interpretation on this 'soft' verse, AND AN 'INTERPRETATION' WHICH MILITANT MOSLEMS ACCEPT, IS,

"You can choose conversion to ISLAM, submission, or death.
.....THERE IS **NO COMPULSION**!

YOU CHOOSE."

EXAMPLE #1,

Iraq -
4 March 2007
Iraq's Mandaeans 'face extinction'
By Angus Crawford
The Sabian Mandaeans - one of the oldest religious groups in the world - are facing extinction, according to its leaders.
They claim that Islamic extremists in Iraq are trying to wipe them out through forced conversions, rape and murder.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6412453.stm

AND ON......

Back to top

"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

IP Logged

Auggie

Gold Member

Offline

The Bull Moose

Posts: 8571

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #32 - Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:46pm

Yadda wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:43pm:

taqiyya - the muslim doctrine of deceit

Incorrect, Taqiyya was developed as means by which a Muslim could conceal their identity as a Muslim in the face of a direct threat to life.

For e.g. if someone holds a gun to your head and says: "I will kill you if you are Muslim," then Taqiyyah means that you can lie in this specific circumstance in order to save your life.

The doctrine was developed by Shite theology in order to protect them from persecution.

So much for your understanding of complex ideas, Yadda.

Back to top

The Progressive President

IP Logged

moses

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 6353

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #33 - Sep 29^th, 2018 at 2:48pm

Augggie wrote: Reply #14 - Yesterday at 6:44pm

Quote:

moses wrote:
Quote:

Auggie have they completely purged the evil verses in the qur'an?

Auggie wrote:
Quote:

yes

Auggie do other muslims persecute them as hypocrites and corrupters who dare to question the qur'an?

Is there a copy of their revised edition of the qur'an available, how much did they actually leave in it?

Back to top

IP Logged

freediver

Gold Member

Offline

www.ozpolitic.com

Posts: 51343
At my desk.

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #34 - Sep 29^th, 2018 at 4:06pm

Auggie wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:43pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:28pm:

Auggie wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:16pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:14pm:

So you would not say anything like this?

Auggie wrote on Sep 26^th, 2018 at 6:56pm:

The fact is that they are a minority, which is the important fact here.

Important in so far as their minority status informs on their theological differences with Sunnis.

Can you explain how something as incidental as their minority status informs on them and becomes the key fact?

Yes.

What's wrong Auggie? Have you run out of BS?

Back to top

People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

IP Logged

Yadda

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 22369
A cat with a view

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #35 - Sep 29^th, 2018 at 4:44pm

Auggie wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:46pm:

Yadda wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:43pm:

taqiyya - the muslim doctrine of deceit

Incorrect, Taqiyya was developed as means by which a Muslim could conceal their identity as a Muslim in the face of a direct threat to life.

For e.g. if someone holds a gun to your head and says: "I will kill you if you are Muslim," then Taqiyyah means that you can lie in this specific circumstance in order to save your life.

The doctrine was developed by Shite theology in order to protect them from persecution.

So much for your understanding of complex ideas, Yadda.

Auggie,

I prefer this description of what Taqiyya is, and how it may be applied in the world....

Quote:

Taqiyya

“Speaking is a means to achieve objectives
.

If a praiseworthy aim is attainable through both telling the truth and lying, it is unlawful to accomplish it through lying because there is no need for it. When it is possible to achieve such an aim by lying but not by telling the truth, it is permissible to lie if attaining the goal is permissible..., and obligatory to lie if the goal is obligatory. ...One should compare the bad consequences entailed by lying to those entailed by telling the truth, and if the consequences of telling the truth are more damaging, one is entitled to lie…”

google

Google;

taqiyya - the muslim doctrine of deceit

Back to top

"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

IP Logged

moses

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 6353

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #36 - Sep 29^th, 2018 at 4:47pm

Ahmadi Muslim should forever reflect upon the hopes and expectations of the Promised Messiah (peace be upon him).”

Well Ahmidi most certainly are not a people for world peace and tolerance.

They believe in the promised muslim messiah who will return to break the cross and kill the swine.

The so called mardhi will force all Christians to convert to islam or be killed, the swine are referenced in the qur'an as Jews who allah transformed into pigs.

They apparently believe that this time is extremely close and they have no fear of dying for allah in the forthcoming battle with the worlds' non believers.

Back to top

IP Logged

Karnal

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 98973

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #37 - Sep 29^th, 2018 at 7:52pm

moses wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 4:47pm:

Ahmadi Muslim should forever reflect upon the hopes and expectations of the Promised Messiah (peace be upon him).”

Well Ahmidi most certainly are not a people for world peace and tolerance.

They believe in the promised muslim messiah who will return to break the cross and kill the swine.

The so called mardhi will force all Christians to convert to islam or be killed, the swine are referenced in the qur'an as Jews who allah transformed into pigs.

They apparently believe that this time is extremely close and they have no fear of dying for allah in the forthcoming battle with the worlds' non believers.

Guess which Messiah the Muslims believe will return, Moses.

That's right - Yeheshua, same as the Christians. Cunning, no?

You?

Back to top

IP Logged

Yadda

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 22369
A cat with a view

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #38 - Sep 29^th, 2018 at 9:57pm

moses wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 4:47pm:

Ahmadi Muslim should forever reflect upon the hopes and expectations of the Promised Messiah (peace be upon him).”

Well Ahmidi most certainly are not a people for world peace and tolerance.

They believe in the promised muslim messiah who will return to break the cross and kill the swine.

The so called mardhi will force all Christians to convert to islam or be killed, the swine are referenced in the qur'an as Jews who allah transformed into pigs.

They apparently believe that this time is extremely close and they have no fear of dying for allah in the forthcoming battle with the worlds' non believers.

You are truly a 'serpent' Karnal, from the garden.

And a follower of ISLAM. ....though i know you will deny that.

Karnal wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 7:52pm:

Guess which Messiah the Muslims believe will return, Moses.

That's right - Yeheshua, same as the Christians. Cunning, no?

You?

Yeah Karnal.

But why don't you reveal the rest of your story, about the 'moslem Jesus' ?

The 'moslem Jesus', returns at the end of teh world, as a jihadi, and returns to destroy disbelief, and to fight and to kill disbelievers.

Why didn't you reveal that moslem narrative Karnal ?

n.b

The 'moslem Jesus' < > Jesus of the Jewish and Christian bible. !!!

Google;
muslim jesus, is jihadi, will return to kill disbelievers

Quote:

Jesus ('Isa) (Upon whom be peace), just as all the other prophets, is a chosen slave of Allah....

Contrary to what most people believe, Jesus was not crucified and killed nor did he die....

The Quran tells us that they did not kill him and they did not crucify him and that Allah raised him up to Him.

Our Prophet also told us that Jesus will be sent back to earth and related that in that time, which is called "the end of time",....According to Islam, in this time, there will be the terrible trials of the Dajjal (Anti-Christ),

Bediuzzaman heralds that Jesus will come to earth at such a period when disbelief will dominate the earth. As stated in the following words of Bediuzzaman, in his second coming to earth, Jesus will rule with the Quran and eliminate all bigotry in Christianity. Uniting against disbelief, Christians who have embraced Islam and Muslims will prevail over the disbelieving ideologies by the guidance of the Quran.

https://www.islamicity.org/5640/jesus-will-return/

Genesis 3:14
And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:
15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Back to top

"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

IP Logged

Auggie

Gold Member

Offline

The Bull Moose

Posts: 8571

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #39 - Sep 30^th, 2018 at 1:05am

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 4:06pm:

Auggie wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:43pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:28pm:

Auggie wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:16pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:14pm:

So you would not say anything like this?

Auggie wrote on Sep 26^th, 2018 at 6:56pm:

The fact is that they are a minority, which is the important fact here.

Important in so far as their minority status informs on their theological differences with Sunnis.

Can you explain how something as incidental as their minority status informs on them and becomes the key fact?

Yes.

What's wrong Auggie? Have you run out of BS?

NO.

Back to top

The Progressive President

IP Logged

moses

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 6353

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #40 - Sep 30^th, 2018 at 2:23pm

Quote:

Guess which Messiah the Muslims believe will return, Moses.

That's right - Yeheshua, same as the Christians. Cunning, no?

You?

Well well, one more sick lie that muslims and their apologists tell.

The muslim Yeheshua is a prophet who supposedly came to earth with the *gospel* already revealed.

They believe this prophet is a muslim who will break the cross (destroys Christianity, forces Christians to convert to islam and kill those that don't) and kill the swine. (if we search the qur'an as to who is a pig it is taught that allah transformed Jews into swine).

muslims also say that their version was not killed and rose again to pay for the sins for all mankind

The muslim prophet is a man of bloodshed death and destruction (so what's new that's how muslims do it)

Conversely the Christians believe that the Messiah is the Son of God who came to earth to pay the price for the sins of mankind.

Christians also know the gospels did not start until decades after the death of their Christ.

The Christian messiah was a man of peace and love who died for his fellow man.

So the two while sharing a common name, are in fact two totally 100% different people.

Back to top

IP Logged

freediver

Gold Member

Offline

www.ozpolitic.com

Posts: 51343
At my desk.

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #41 - Sep 30^th, 2018 at 4:13pm

Auggie wrote on Sep 30^th, 2018 at 1:05am:

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 4:06pm:

Auggie wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:43pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:28pm:

Auggie wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:16pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:14pm:

So you would not say anything like this?

Auggie wrote on Sep 26^th, 2018 at 6:56pm:

The fact is that they are a minority, which is the important fact here.

Important in so far as their minority status informs on their theological differences with Sunnis.

Can you explain how something as incidental as their minority status informs on them and becomes the key fact?

Yes.

What's wrong Auggie? Have you run out of BS?

NO.

Of course not. Are you saving it up for a special occasion?

Back to top

People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

IP Logged

Frank Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 52973 Gender:	Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim Reply #42 - Sep 30^th, 2018 at 4:51pm He doesn't have to save it up, he the the Midas touch for BS. It's a gift, I tell ya. Bwian's apprentice.
Back to top	Estragon: I can’t go on like this. Vladimir: That’s what you think. IP Logged

Auggie

Gold Member

Offline

The Bull Moose

Posts: 8571

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #43 - Sep 30^th, 2018 at 5:39pm

freediver wrote on Sep 30^th, 2018 at 4:13pm:

Auggie wrote on Sep 30^th, 2018 at 1:05am:

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 4:06pm:

Auggie wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:43pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:28pm:

Auggie wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:16pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 29^th, 2018 at 12:14pm:

So you would not say anything like this?

Auggie wrote on Sep 26^th, 2018 at 6:56pm:

The fact is that they are a minority, which is the important fact here.

Important in so far as their minority status informs on their theological differences with Sunnis.

Can you explain how something as incidental as their minority status informs on them and becomes the key fact?

Yes.

What's wrong Auggie? Have you run out of BS?

NO.

Of course not. Are you saving it up for a special occasion?

I'm saving it up for a birthday present.

Back to top

The Progressive President

IP Logged

Karnal

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 98973

Re: Don't kid yourself Ahmadi moslems are not 'victim
Reply #44 - Sep 30^th, 2018 at 6:54pm

moses wrote on Sep 30^th, 2018 at 2:23pm:

Quote:

Guess which Messiah the Muslims believe will return, Moses.

That's right - Yeheshua, same as the Christians. Cunning, no?

You?

Well well, one more sick lie that muslims and their apologists tell.

The muslim Yeheshua is a prophet who supposedly came to earth with the *gospel* already revealed.

They believe this prophet is a muslim who will break the cross (destroys Christianity, forces Christians to convert to islam and kill those that don't) and kill the swine. (if we search the qur'an as to who is a pig it is taught that allah transformed Jews into swine).

muslims also say that their version was not killed and rose again to pay for the sins for all mankind

The muslim prophet is a man of bloodshed death and destruction (so what's new that's how muslims do it)

Conversely the Christians believe that the Messiah is the Son of God who came to earth to pay the price for the sins of mankind.

Christians also know the gospels did not start until decades after the death of their Christ.

The Christian messiah was a man of peace and love who died for his fellow man.

So the two while sharing a common name, are in fact two totally 100% different people.

Oh, I see. The Muslims are referring to another Jesus Christ who was born to a Mary and Joseph in Bethlehem, eh?

Cunning. The Christian messiah was a man of peace and love, you say?

Ee-gad, that must mean his followers are peaceful and loving too, no?

Back to top

IP Logged