Australian Politics Forum - The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...

Gnads

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #75 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:09pm

mothra wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:56pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:54pm:

Of course, removing the stigma for welfare is a step beyond us as a species just yet.

Pure assumption.

The DSP is a complete other matter .... & that could happen to someone early in there working life or later on ... much to do with compensation cases.

besides it's also another benefit open to rorting by dole blugers ... & those with alcohol & drug habits.

People laid off are again another matter.....

and no .... no separation for those instances.

Lumping people on the pension - for which they've paid ...

and to which I pay .... even though I also pay into Superannuation ....

is not Welfare .... they've fecken earned it. Roll Eyes

Quote:

Sorry to break it to you, Gnads, but it is indeed welfare.

there is nothing wrong with welfare.

You're just going to have to quietly nurse your prejudices whilst being aware of just how wrong you are.

How in this discussion is stating that those who have worked & contributed to their pension eligibility are not welfare recipients prejudiced?

You're like a cracked record with your .... I'm right & you're wrong blather.

Welfare application is not a dirty word ... but it is not applicable to the case I state.

Just because some numbnuts with the same mentality as yourself came along & did away with the pension provision fund & the classed retired pensioners as welfare recipients it is not right.

This over inflates the real welfare figures & is used as a political football to control or attack the levels of pension payments - up & down in budgets to people in the situation I mention.

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Gnads

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #76 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:11pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:04pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:59pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:49pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:47pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:42pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:37pm:

A retired worker being on the Age Pension was not classed as being on welfare/the dole.

The Age Pension is for people older than the working age.

The Dole is for the unemployed.

They are both welfare.

Pedantic Peccarhead.

If you reached retirement age & qualified for the Pension it was not classed as welfare and it shouldn't be now.

And I have explained why.

I'm not being pedantic.

I'm just stating the facts: the Age Pension is welfare.

And, for the third time, 'welfare' is NOT a dirty word.

BS ... if you've paid into something your whole working life .... just like a savings account ...

when you reach retirement age you're entitled to collect.

It's not fecken welfare .....

they aren't looking after you & they are not being benevolent/charitible.

It has nothing to do with "welfare" being a dirty word or not.

Answer me this: if you don't work your entire life, are you still entitled to the Age Pension when you reach retirement age?

People have to meet certain assessment criteria do they not?

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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #77 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:12pm

mothra wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:06pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:04pm:

Answer me this: if you don't work your entire life, are you still entitled to the Age Pension when you reach retirement age?

I think we need a new classification for those people, Greg. Bludgers just seems so mean.

I'm guessing the answer to my question is 'yes'. Yes?

So, one can never work a day in their life, and then receive the Age Pension when they reach retirement age.

Is this correct, Gnads?

If so, how have they paid?

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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #78 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:14pm

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:11pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:04pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:59pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:49pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:47pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:42pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:37pm:

A retired worker being on the Age Pension was not classed as being on welfare/the dole.

The Age Pension is for people older than the working age.

The Dole is for the unemployed.

They are both welfare.

Pedantic Peccarhead.

If you reached retirement age & qualified for the Pension it was not classed as welfare and it shouldn't be now.

And I have explained why.

I'm not being pedantic.

I'm just stating the facts: the Age Pension is welfare.

And, for the third time, 'welfare' is NOT a dirty word.

BS ... if you've paid into something your whole working life .... just like a savings account ...

when you reach retirement age you're entitled to collect.

It's not fecken welfare .....

they aren't looking after you & they are not being benevolent/charitible.

It has nothing to do with "welfare" being a dirty word or not.

Answer me this: if you don't work your entire life, are you still entitled to the Age Pension when you reach retirement age?

People have to meet certain assessment criteria do they not?

I assume so.

Is one of them a history of employment?

Or, can you live your entire life without ever working, and then claim the Age Pension when you reach retirement age?

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John Smith

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #79 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:18pm

Lord Herbert wrote on Oct 10^th, 2017 at 3:59pm:

John Smith wrote on Oct 10^th, 2017 at 12:05pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Oct 10^th, 2017 at 12:05am:

John Smith wrote on Oct 9^th, 2017 at 11:20pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Oct 9^th, 2017 at 11:13pm:

Who are you kidding?

what makes you think I'm kidding?

only people i might baulk at are real estate agents and horse trainers (irrespective of race).
They make terrible tenants.

Some teachers aren't that far behind either, although other teachers are brilliant.

Curry cooking smells that last for years are no problem, right?

I don't have to live there. As long as they pay the rent who gives a sh1t?

The next prospective tenants?

Durrrr?

I've never never had a complaint from those that have gone in next. What makes you think they'll give a poo? Have they complained to you?

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 77853 Gender:	Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ... Reply #80 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:23pm Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:11pm: People have to meet certain assessment criteria do they not? criteria they must meet is age, value of assets, residency status past employment history has nothing to do with it.
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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #81 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:36pm

John Smith wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:23pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:11pm:

People have to meet certain assessment criteria do they not?

criteria they must meet is age, value of assets, residency status

past employment history has nothing to do with it.

That's what I thought.

So, you can go through life without ever working a day, and never paying a cent in tax, and still receive the Age Pension when you reach retirement age.

Not a bad welfare system we have.

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Gnads

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #82 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:22pm

John Smith wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:23pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:11pm:

People have to meet certain assessment criteria do they not?

criteria they must meet is age, value of assets, residency status

past employment history has nothing to do with it.

I was talking of going on a pension prior to reaching the age eligibility.

The assessment criteria for that would be varied, involve doctors etc. etc.

And my point has been about how the pension for retirees was separately funded & how that has been done away with & lumped all under one banner of social welfare.

People who have contributed by holding down a job then qualifying for a pension on reaching retirement age & are eligible don't see it as being on welfare ...

they believe they earned it.

The other scenarios being thrown up are not the same.

You & Peccarhead ... if you don't have Super .... will have your working life extended to 70 yrs old to qualify.

Good old LNP. Roll Eyes

My eligibility has been extended to 66.5 yrs old thanks to Kevin Rudd.

Politicians ey Angry

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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 146719 Gender:	Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ... Reply #83 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:27pm Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:22pm: People who have contributed by holding down a job then qualifying for a pension on reaching retirement age & are eligible don't see it as being on welfare ... Maybe. It's still welfare, though. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
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Gnads

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #84 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:29pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:27pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:22pm:

People who have contributed by holding down a job then qualifying for a pension on reaching retirement age & are eligible don't see it as being on welfare ...

Maybe.

It's still welfare, though.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Why?

Don't you think they earned it & contributed to it ...

despite you harping on that it's still welfare because that's what the system now says.

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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #85 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:30pm

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:29pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:27pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:22pm:

People who have contributed by holding down a job then qualifying for a pension on reaching retirement age & are eligible don't see it as being on welfare ...

Maybe.

It's still welfare, though.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Why?

Don't you think they earned it & contributed to it ...

despite you harping on that it's still welfare because that's what the system now says.

Why? Because it's welfare.

Earned it? Sure.

I'm not bagging pensioners.

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Bobby.

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #86 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:33pm

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:22pm:

John Smith wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:23pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:11pm:

People have to meet certain assessment criteria do they not?

criteria they must meet is age, value of assets, residency status

past employment history has nothing to do with it.

I was talking of going on a pension prior to reaching the age eligibility.

The assessment criteria for that would be varied, involve doctors etc. etc.

And my point has been about how the pension for retirees was separately funded & how that has been done away with & lumped all under one banner of social welfare.

People who have contributed by holding down a job then qualifying for a pension on reaching retirement age & are eligible don't see it as being on welfare ...

they believe they earned it.

The other scenarios being thrown up are not the same.

You & Peccarhead ... if you don't have Super .... will have your working life extended to 70 yrs old to qualify.

Good old LNP. Roll Eyes

My eligibility has been extended to 66.5 yrs old thanks to Kevin Rudd.

Politicians ey Angry

I'd like a pension -
at least I could get a small percentage of my tax back.

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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 77853 Gender:	Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ... Reply #87 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:34pm Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:22pm: I was talking of going on a pension prior to reaching the age eligibility. even disability pensioners don't need to have worked to be eligible.
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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #88 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:36pm

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:22pm:

John Smith wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:23pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 1:11pm:

People have to meet certain assessment criteria do they not?

criteria they must meet is age, value of assets, residency status

past employment history has nothing to do with it.

I was talking of going on a pension prior to reaching the age eligibility.

The assessment criteria for that would be varied, involve doctors etc. etc.

And my point has been about how the pension for retirees was separately funded & how that has been done away with & lumped all under one banner of social welfare.

People who have contributed by holding down a job then qualifying for a pension on reaching retirement age & are eligible don't see it as being on welfare ...

they believe they earned it.

The other scenarios being thrown up are not the same.

You & Peccarhead ... if you don't have Super .... will have your working life extended to 70 yrs old to qualify.

Good old LNP. Roll Eyes

My eligibility has been extended to 66.5 yrs old thanks to Kevin Rudd.

Politicians ey Angry

I think mine is 67.

Not sure who to blame.

Islam?

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Karnal

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Re: The Dole Sink-Holes in Australia ...
Reply #89 - Oct 11^th, 2017 at 2:38pm

mothra wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:56pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 11^th, 2017 at 12:54pm:

Of course, removing the stigma for welfare is a step beyond us as a species just yet.

Pure assumption.

The DSP is a complete other matter .... & that could happen to someone early in there working life or later on ... much to do with compensation cases.

besides it's also another benefit open to rorting by dole blugers ... & those with alcohol & drug habits.

The DSP is nearly impossible to rort. A Centrelink doctor has to agree with your GP that you can't work 12 hours a week for the next 5 years. The onus is on the applicant to prove it. Drug and alcohol problems can't be used as a reason - detox or maintenance is the treatment for this. Payments are medically reviewed every 5 years.

I could be wrong, but I believe Herbie's application was knocked back. Many are.

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