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Global warming, the science and the consequences (Read 29141 times)
TheFunPolice
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #45 - Apr 26th, 2017 at 11:50am
 
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......Australia has an illegitimate Government!
 
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lee
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #46 - Apr 26th, 2017 at 12:46pm
 
"Carbon 14 is formed in the atmosphere by collisions between cosmic rays and Nitrogen.  It has a very short half life (5,730 years)"

...

Oh, tree rings - never mind.

"More recent, high precision measurements show the decline in C14 continued after the end of atmospheric nuclear testing."

Actually it shows C14 increasing since nuclear testing.

...

So how do they determine that Natural CO2 is net negative.

You remember greening of the planet?

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« Last Edit: Apr 26th, 2017 at 12:58pm by lee »  
 
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TheFunPolice
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #47 - Apr 26th, 2017 at 1:32pm
 
Seriously  Grin
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......Australia has an illegitimate Government!
 
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #48 - Apr 26th, 2017 at 1:37pm
 
Now who is relying on SKS?  Wink
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lee
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #49 - Apr 26th, 2017 at 2:12pm
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 26th, 2017 at 1:37pm:
Now who is relying on SKS?  Wink


If you really had a clue you would see it was DRAH.

TheFunPolice wrote on Apr 26th, 2017 at 11:50am:
https://skepticalscience.com/anthrocarbon-brief.html
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #50 - Apr 26th, 2017 at 2:16pm
 
https://skepticalscience.com/pics/CO2massbalance.jpg

...
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lee
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #51 - Apr 26th, 2017 at 2:33pm
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 26th, 2017 at 2:16pm:
https://skepticalscience.com/pics/CO2massbalance.jpg

https://skepticalscience.com/pics/CO2massbalance.jpg


Yep certainly hilarious. Wink
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #52 - Apr 30th, 2017 at 3:42pm
 
Quote:
Climate Change 2007: Working Group I: The Physical Science Basis
Contents99.7
9.7 Combining Evidence of Anthropogenic Climate Change <>
The widespread change detected in temperature observations of the surface (Sections 9.4.1, 9.4.2, 9.4.3), free atmosphere (Section 9.4.4) and ocean (Section 9.5.1), together with consistent evidence of change in other parts of the climate system (Section 9.5), strengthens the conclusion that greenhouse gas forcing is the dominant cause of warming during the past several decades. This combined evidence, which is summarised in Table 9.4, is substantially stronger than the evidence that is available from observed changes in global surface temperature alone (Figure 3.6).

The evidence from surface temperature observations is strong: The observed warming is highly significant relative to estimates of internal climate variability which, while obtained from models, are consistent with estimates obtained from both instrumental data and palaeoclimate reconstructions. It is extremely unlikely (<5%) that recent global warming is due to internal variability alone such as might arise from El Niño (Section 9.4.1). The widespread nature of the warming (Figures 3.9 and 9.6) reduces the possibility that the warming could have resulted from internal variability. No known mode of internal variability leads to such widespread, near universal warming as has been observed in the past few decades. Although modes of internal variability such as El Niño can lead to global average warming for limited periods of time, such warming is regionally variable, with some areas of cooling (Figures 3.27 and 3.28). In addition, palaeoclimatic evidence indicates that El Niño variability during the 20th century is not unusual relative to earlier periods (Section 9.3.3.2; Chapter 6). Palaeoclimatic evidence suggests that such a widespread warming has not been observed in the NH in at least the past 1.3 kyr (Osborn and Briffa, 2006), further strengthening the evidence that the recent warming is not due to natural internal variability. Moreover, the response to anthropogenic forcing is detectable on all continents individually except Antarctica, and in some sub-continental regions. Climate models only reproduce the observed 20th-century global mean surface warming when both anthropogenic and natural forcings are included (Figure 9.5). No model that has used natural forcing only has reproduced the observed global mean warming trend or the continental mean warming trends in all individual continents (except Antarctica) over the second half of the 20th century. Detection and attribution of external influences on 20th-century and palaeoclimatic reconstructions, from both natural and anthropogenic sources (Figure 9.4 and Table 9.4), further strengthens the conclusion that the observed changes are very unusual relative to internal climate variability.

The energy content change associated with the observed widespread warming of the atmosphere is small relative to the energy content change of the ocean, and also smaller than that associated with other components such as the cryosphere. In addition, the solid Earth also shows evidence for warming in boreholes (Huang et al., 2000; Beltrami et al., 2002; Pollack and Smerdon, 2004). It is theoretically feasible that the warming of the near surface could have occurred due to a reduction in the heat content of another component of the system. However, all parts of the cryosphere (glaciers, small ice caps, ice sheets and sea ice) have decreased in extent over the past half century, consistent with anthropogenic forcing (Section 9.5.5, Table 9.4), implying that the cryosphere consumed heat and thus indicating that it could not have provided heat for atmospheric warming. More importantly, the heat content of the ocean (the largest reservoir of heat in the climate system) also increased, much more substantially than that of the other components of the climate system (Figure 5.4; Hansen et al., 2005; Levitus et al., 2005). The warming of the upper ocean during the latter half of the 20th century was likely due to anthropogenic forcing (Barnett et al., 2005; Section 9.5.1.1; Table 9.4). While the statistical evidence in this research is very strong that the warming cannot be explained by ocean internal variability as estimated by two different climate models, uncertainty arises since there are discrepancies between estimates of ocean heat content variability from models and observations, although poor sampling of parts of the World Ocean may explain this discrepancy. However, the spatial pattern of ocean warming with depth is very consistent with heating of the ocean resulting from net positive radiative forcing, since the warming proceeds downwards from the upper layers of the ocean and there is deeper penetration of heat at middle to high latitudes and shallower penetration at low latitudes (Barnett et al., 2005; Hansen et al., 2005). This observed ocean warming pattern is inconsistent with a redistribution of heat between the surface and the deep ocean.


Cont’d
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #53 - Apr 30th, 2017 at 3:46pm
 
Quote:
Thus, the evidence appears to be inconsistent with the ocean or land being the source of the warming at the surface. In addition, simulations forced with observed SST changes cannot fully explain the warming in the troposphere without increases in greenhouse gases (e.g., Sexton et al., 2001), further strengthening the evidence that the warming does not originate from the ocean. Further evidence for forced changes arises from widespread melting of the cryosphere (Section 9.5.5), increases in water vapour in the atmosphere (Section 9.5.4.1) and changes in top-of-the atmosphere radiation that are consistent with changes in forcing.

The simultaneous increase in energy content of all the major components of the climate system and the pattern and amplitude of warming in the different components, together with evidence that the second half of the 20th century was likely the warmest in 1.3 kyr (Chapter 6) indicate that the cause of the warming is extremely unlikely to be the result of internal processes alone. The consistency across different lines of evidence makes a strong case for a significant human influence on observed warming at the surface. The observed rates of surface temperature and ocean heat content change are consistent with the understanding of the likely range of climate sensitivity and net climate forcings. Only with a net positive forcing, consistent with observational and model estimates of the likely net forcing of the climate system (as used in Figure 9.5), is it possible to explain the large increase in heat content of the climate system that has been observed (Figure 5.4).


https://www.ipcc.ch/publications_and_data/ar4/wg1/en/ch9s9-7.html

Have a read of the whole chapter including the tables and figures.
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lee
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #54 - Apr 30th, 2017 at 4:31pm
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 30th, 2017 at 3:42pm:
The observed warming is highly significant relative to estimates of internal climate variability which, while obtained from models, are consistent with estimates obtained from both instrumental data and palaeoclimate reconstructions.


But the paleoclimate reconstructions don't have the small scale variations necessary for certainty. How do you determine a period of say 50-100 years from climate proxies that are measured in millions of years.

Apart from which you disbelieve the hiatus described in Box 9.2.

Seems you are cherry picking what you want to believe. Grin Grin Grin
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #55 - Apr 30th, 2017 at 4:33pm
 
What hiatus?
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lee
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #56 - Apr 30th, 2017 at 4:43pm
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 30th, 2017 at 4:33pm:
What hiatus?


Yep Exactly. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #57 - Apr 30th, 2017 at 4:50pm
 
So you don’t know what hiatus you are talking about?
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #58 - May 1st, 2017 at 9:07pm
 
Something about land clearance and the useless Emissions Reductions Fund.

https://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au/news/politics/2017/04/29/land-clearing-and-c...
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Global warming, the science and the consequences
Reply #59 - May 1st, 2017 at 10:37pm
 
Global warming and the sun:

https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Features/GlobalWarming/page4.php
Quote:
Scientists theorize that there may be a multi-decadal trend in solar output, though if one exists, it has not been observed as yet. Even if the Sun were getting brighter, however, the pattern of warming observed on Earth since 1950 does not match the type of warming the Sun alone would cause. When the Sun’s energy is at its peak (solar maxima), temperatures in both the lower atmosphere (troposphere) and the upper atmosphere (stratosphere) become warmer. Instead, observations show the pattern expected from greenhouse gas effects: Earth’s surface and troposphere have warmed, but the stratosphere has cooled.


So, not the sun but GHGs are causing the warming.
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