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Dump The baby bonus ???? (Read 46683 times)

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #150 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:33pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:26pm:

... wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:20pm:

Is that so? Even if he didn't take a personal dcotor, he DID take his hairdresser, dessert chef and 4 photographers. But they're all essential aren't they?

Quote:

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd should downsize his Copenhagen bandwagon if he's serious about cutting emissions, says the federal opposition says.

Newly-appointed shadow minister for climate action, Greg Hunt, said Mr Rudd could do without a hairdresser, dessert chef and four photographers at the United Nations climate summit in Denmark.

"I would challenge Mr Rudd today to reduce the size of his bandwagon... by 25 per cent," Mr Hunt told Sky News' Sunday Agenda.

"If he wants to make a real reduction in emissions, reduce the size of your delegation Mr Rudd."

Mr Rudd on Friday defended the 114-strong Australian delegation against criticism that it was too large.

Mr Hunt said reports suggesting the contingent was staying in a hotel where a bowl of soup cost $50 showed Mr Rudd was wasting money."If he wants to make a real saving for the Australian budget, he probably doesn't want an extra 25 people paying $50 for a bowl of soup," he said.

"And I guess its probably $200 for a nice bottle of chardonnay that they'll sit down and have every evening.

"So be serious, reduce the size of the delegation, let's debate Tony Abbott before you go, and that way we can be focused on the real things, talk to Australian families about what will be the impact on them."

http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-national/pm-criticised-over-copenhagen-entourage-20091213-kpza.html

...so all you have is a statement made by ... Greg Hunt? Question: does he know what 100 km2 is yet?

I don't even know who Greg Hunt is, nor do I care. It doesn't change the fact that Rudd blew an absolute shitload of money on preening himself on the world stage. You can try to argue the fact, but that would be suicidal, because it's undeniably true. It isn't even central to the issue of the baby bonus. My point was simply that if people are worried about tax $$$ being wasted, you should look at what our elite are doing, rather than whinging that young, new families are getting a leg-up.

In the fullness of time...

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #151 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:35pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:30pm:

Mr Swan said the Government had spent $58,915.70 on return first-class flights for four staff from Canberra to London for the meeting.

FKING DISGRACEFUL

Less the cost of business class to which they were entitled.

Call it $30K.

Two nights in Rome or London hotels for John Howard, as I recall.

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #152 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:37pm

It is a load of baloney, a dumb idea from a pollie I liked, I wish he were back now, but it is still a crap idea that was just a vote buying scam that Labor are too weak to drop.

Any whose income is low enough that they need assistance can get it through a revised family payments system.
The supposed rationale behind having a bonus was to lift the birth rate, which is a debatable issue in itself, as to whether or not doing so is a good idea, but it did not even provide any ongoing benefit in that regard.

So it was an election gimmick, let's move on and hope they come up with something better.

OOPS!!! My Karma, ran over your Dogma!

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #153 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:38pm

... wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:33pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:26pm:

... wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:20pm:

Is that so? Even if he didn't take a personal dcotor, he DID take his hairdresser, dessert chef and 4 photographers. But they're all essential aren't they?

Quote:

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd should downsize his Copenhagen bandwagon if he's serious about cutting emissions, says the federal opposition says.

Newly-appointed shadow minister for climate action, Greg Hunt, said Mr Rudd could do without a hairdresser, dessert chef and four photographers at the United Nations climate summit in Denmark.

"I would challenge Mr Rudd today to reduce the size of his bandwagon... by 25 per cent," Mr Hunt told Sky News' Sunday Agenda.

"If he wants to make a real reduction in emissions, reduce the size of your delegation Mr Rudd."

Mr Rudd on Friday defended the 114-strong Australian delegation against criticism that it was too large.

Mr Hunt said reports suggesting the contingent was staying in a hotel where a bowl of soup cost $50 showed Mr Rudd was wasting money."If he wants to make a real saving for the Australian budget, he probably doesn't want an extra 25 people paying $50 for a bowl of soup," he said.

"And I guess its probably $200 for a nice bottle of chardonnay that they'll sit down and have every evening.

"So be serious, reduce the size of the delegation, let's debate Tony Abbott before you go, and that way we can be focused on the real things, talk to Australian families about what will be the impact on them."

http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-national/pm-criticised-over-copenhagen-entourage-20091213-kpza.html

...so all you have is a statement made by ... Greg Hunt? Question: does he know what 100 km2 is yet?

I don't even know who Greg Hunt is, nor do I care. It doesn't change the fact that Rudd blew an absolute shitload of money on preening himself on the world stage. You can try to argue the fact, but that would be suicidal, because it's undeniably true. It isn't even central to the issue of the baby bonus. My point was simply that if people are worried about tax $$$ being wasted, you should look at what our elite are doing, rather than whinging that young, new families are getting a leg-up.

Diplomatic relations and being a world player is very important. I loved the fact that whilst Howard hid and only ever licked Bush's a$$, Rudd went out there and tried to be central.

And if that meant spending money then so be it.

In any case, considering I don't have a problem with the baby bonus anymore because it will only be paid to basically the unemployed I don't really know why I'm bothering in this thread. Only to make note of your ridiculous quotes, that's all.

Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #154 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:39pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:31pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:02pm:

But there really, truly, ARE people out there who rote the welfare system....whether it's Newstart or DSP pensions...it DOES happen...

And when you see people who are, generally, semi-professional shoplifters walk into a shop, with a newborn in a 2nd hand pram, and buy 2 Xboxes, a DVD player, a big screen TV and 3 cartons of cigarettes with the 'baby bonus' money....it becomes incredibly obvious...

Costello made TWO fundamental ERRORS when he started the "Baby Bonus"

1/ It should have been means tested (or have been added to taxable income)

2/ It should have been either given in the form of ...

a/ Ten fortnightly payments of $500

or ...

b/ Vouchers redeemable at a wide range of baby supply and children's clothing outlets

1. I agree.

2. No, because anyone with children would know that these stores like pumpkin patch are ridiculously overpriced, and would be even more so if subsidised by the tax payer.
Most clothes for kids get worn once or twice, and then they grow out of them, so baby markets are the ideal way for parents of older kids to get rid of stuff they don't need, and for parents of younger kids to pick up nearly unused toys and clothes at a fraction of the price of new. But I guess in our throwaway society, it doesn't matter if things are perfectly good, if they don't still have a price tag on them, they belong in landfill...

In the fullness of time...

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buzzanddidj

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #155 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:39pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:30pm:

Mr Swan said the Government had spent $58,915.70 on return first-class flights for four staff from Canberra to London for the meeting.

FKING DISGRACEFUL

And the SAME arrangements were used under PREVIOUS governments
But being a LABOR government, it was a NATURAL for the front page of "The Australian"

'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.
Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #156 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:41pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:39pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:30pm:

Mr Swan said the Government had spent $58,915.70 on return first-class flights for four staff from Canberra to London for the meeting.

FKING DISGRACEFUL

And the SAME arrangements were used under PREVIOUS governments
But being a LABOR government, it was a NATURAL for the front page of "The Australian"

Shame my story is from The Age then isn't it?

If I recall rightly you refused to say it was a waste of taxpayer money - did you not?

Bias much?
Grin

Grin

Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #157 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:43pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 2:48pm:

Quote:

Yes, and Rudd flying 100+ cronies, including his personal hairstylist to copenhagen for the climate wankfest. But we couldn't touch that could we? Nar...better to deny young families a few bob to assist raising their children, than to deny the PM a hairdresser for a week

CHRIST - you people are full of CRAP !

Rudd broke TWO traditions, for PM's travelling overseas

1/ He doesn't take his own personal doctor along
He would use a consulate or embassy doctor, if required

2/ He stays at Australian embassies, rather than expensive hotels

LOL YOU WISH.... IN FACT THE VERY FIRST FLIGHT HE TOOK OVERSEAS... HE REFUSED TO TAKE A DOCTOR... he was going to save us money remember...HOWEVER SOMEONE ON THE PLANE WAS TAKEN ILL.. SO FROM THEN ON HE ALWAYS TOOK A DOCTOR..

btw he also travelled I believe more than any PM...as for staying at an Embassy again I think that was during his heady first days...all very much publicised...Washington I believe such hardship.

now he still thinks he is PM>.. and demands to be treated likewise...and as we all know rudd can be very demanding.when this guy finally leaves politics he is going to cost us a motza...

personally I dont care what the PM has or hasnt got... it goes with the job they should always have whats the best we have to offer..

the others well not always..

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #158 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:43pm

Quote:

In any case, considering I don't have a problem with the baby bonus anymore because it will only be paid to basically the unemployed I don't really know why I'm bothering in this thread. Only to make note of your ridiculous quotes, that's all.

So you're being a cock, for the sake of being a cock.
Yep, that's our alevine.

In the fullness of time...

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #159 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:45pm

... wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:43pm:

Quote:

In any case, considering I don't have a problem with the baby bonus anymore because it will only be paid to basically the unemployed I don't really know why I'm bothering in this thread. Only to make note of your ridiculous quotes, that's all.

So you're being a cock, for the sake of being a cock.
Yep, that's our alevine.

In a nutshell you have described our Russian friend to a tee.

Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

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buzzanddidj

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #160 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:50pm

Please delete wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:35pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:30pm:

Mr Swan said the Government had spent $58,915.70 on return first-class flights for four staff from Canberra to London for the meeting.

FKING DISGRACEFUL

Less the cost of business class to which they were entitled.

Call it $30K.

Two nights in Rome or London hotels for John Howard, as I recall.

And $30K is a "drop in the bucket" considering it was a working office" - all the way - in last minute preparation and fine tuning for the GFC crisis meeting of OECD countries

Considering the way AUSTRALIA fared through it, I'd say it was a good investment

'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.
Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'

- Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #161 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:52pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:31pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:02pm:

But there really, truly, ARE people out there who rote the welfare system....whether it's Newstart or DSP pensions...it DOES happen...

And when you see people who are, generally, semi-professional shoplifters walk into a shop, with a newborn in a 2nd hand pram, and buy 2 Xboxes, a DVD player, a big screen TV and 3 cartons of cigarettes with the 'baby bonus' money....it becomes incredibly obvious...

Costello made TWO fundamental ERRORS when he started the "Baby Bonus"

1/ It should have been means tested (or have been added to taxable income)

2/ It should have been either given in the form of ...

a/ Ten fortnightly payments of $500

or ...

b/ Vouchers redeemable at a wide range of baby supply and children's clothing outlets

Yes, or 1/ used as a 0.50c on the dollar reduction of whatever benefit the person was on.. (like a lump sum advance)

"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #162 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:52pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:50pm:

Please delete wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:35pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:30pm:

Mr Swan said the Government had spent $58,915.70 on return first-class flights for four staff from Canberra to London for the meeting.

FKING DISGRACEFUL

Less the cost of business class to which they were entitled.

Call it $30K.

Two nights in Rome or London hotels for John Howard, as I recall.

And $30K is a "drop in the bucket" considering it was a working office" - all the way - in last minute preparation and fine tuning for the GFC crisis meeting of OECD countries

Considering the way AUSTRALIA fared through it, I'd say it was a good investment

Post hoc ergo propter hoc.

Try again.

In the fullness of time...

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buzzanddidj

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #163 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:55pm

cods wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:43pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 2:48pm:

Quote:

Yes, and Rudd flying 100+ cronies, including his personal hairstylist to copenhagen for the climate wankfest. But we couldn't touch that could we? Nar...better to deny young families a few bob to assist raising their children, than to deny the PM a hairdresser for a week

CHRIST - you people are full of CRAP !

Rudd broke TWO traditions, for PM's travelling overseas

1/ He doesn't take his own personal doctor along
He would use a consulate or embassy doctor, if required

2/ He stays at Australian embassies, rather than expensive hotels

LOL YOU WISH.... IN FACT THE VERY FIRST FLIGHT HE TOOK OVERSEAS... HE REFUSED TO TAKE A DOCTOR... he was going to save us money remember...HOWEVER SOMEONE ON THE PLANE WAS TAKEN ILL.. SO FROM THEN ON HE ALWAYS TOOK A DOCTOR..

btw he also travelled I believe more than any PM...as for staying at an Embassy again I think that was during his heady first days...all very much publicised...Washington I believe such hardship.

And you can VERIFY that ?
Or just ANOTHER of your "furfies"

'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.
Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'

- Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Dump The baby bonus ????
Reply #164 - Apr 29^th, 2011 at 4:05pm

... wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:39pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:31pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Apr 29^th, 2011 at 3:02pm:

But there really, truly, ARE people out there who rote the welfare system....whether it's Newstart or DSP pensions...it DOES happen...

And when you see people who are, generally, semi-professional shoplifters walk into a shop, with a newborn in a 2nd hand pram, and buy 2 Xboxes, a DVD player, a big screen TV and 3 cartons of cigarettes with the 'baby bonus' money....it becomes incredibly obvious...

Costello made TWO fundamental ERRORS when he started the "Baby Bonus"

1/ It should have been means tested (or have been added to taxable income)

2/ It should have been either given in the form of ...

a/ Ten fortnightly payments of $500

or ...

b/ Vouchers redeemable at a wide range of baby supply and children's clothing outlets

1. I agree.

2. No, because anyone with children would know that these stores like pumpkin patch are ridiculously overpriced, and would be even more so if subsidised by the tax payer.
Most clothes for kids get worn once or twice, and then they grow out of them, so baby markets are the ideal way for parents of older kids to get rid of stuff they don't need, and for parents of younger kids to pick up nearly unused toys and clothes at a fraction of the price of new. But I guess in our throwaway society, it doesn't matter if things are perfectly good, if they don't still have a price tag on them, they belong in landfill...

"2. No, because anyone with children would know that these stores like pumpkin patch are ridiculously overpriced, and would be even more so if subsidised by the tax payer. "

It's not really necessary to shop at professional baby stores...K'mart or Big W would do...

"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat

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