Australian Politics Forum - The Decline in Poverty

Captain Nemo Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 15931 Melbourne Gender:	Re: The Decline in Poverty Reply #15 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 9:13am
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Gnads Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 33546 Gender:	Re: The Decline in Poverty Reply #16 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 9:58am freediver wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 8:14am: Quote: Remember Bob Hawke saying "By 1990 no Australian child will be living in poverty"? 30 years later and successive govts from both sides there still are........ Still are what? Are you deliberately being obtuse? What does the quote refer to?
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Gnads

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #17 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:01am

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 8:15am:

aquascoot wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 6:56am:

Brendon wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 6:42am:

Thank God for communist China. It is the driving force of the world's economy today.

indeed.

very industrious people who have patience and collaboration built into their DNA from generations of tending to their rice paddies.

arabs in the middle east with goats or africans with hunting or americans with ranching have aggression and competition built into their DNA because a neighbour can always steal your cows or goats (but he cant steal your rice paddy).

hence why china is a better model for a world that is at peace and the americans and the middle eastern goat herders or the mexican cowboys are always looking for a revenge attack

Good point, but the rice paddies are down in South East Asia. Most of China lives off wheat, a totally different method of farming.

But I agree about cooperation. East Asians are highly communal people. Getting along with your family neighbours is a fundamental value in communities that live so close together.

Northern China's quite different. There, people are descended more from nomads. They don't bow down to social norms and rules so easily.

In China today, people are moving into apartment complexes in the cities. Village life is largely gone. People are changing because of this.

Yes matchbox size apartments where you cant swing a cat.

Saw an ABC story the other day from Hongkong .....

and how much it costs to even get into one of those.

Our millennials have nothing to whinge about with housing affordability.

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aquascoot

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #18 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:11am

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 9:11am:

Not at all. Communism was held by Marx to be the values you espouse. Socialism was just a means to get there.

The Soviets never reached the stage of communism - it was always just around the corner.

socialism works really well at the family level.
of course you share the meals equally with the kids
of course you make sure all the kids have a sport they play and if one gets a birthday party, they all do.

it just doesnt scale.

we are hardwired to only care about 100 to 150 people

above that, its all virtue signalling.

i hear about a massacre in rwanda and , to be honest, i am far more concerned for the life of my dog or cat.
i will spend money on their vet bills i wouldnt spend on a rwandan ,
does that make me a freak.
nope
just honest.

when i see politicians wringing their hands over syria or gaza, i know its a virtue signal.
thats not how humans dna is wired.

they are trying to increase their status by virtue signalling that they are morally superior but its fake.

same as the poor guy who tries to be all humble and lacking in ambition as if hes better then the greedy business man.
he's not.

dont ever let people claim moral superiority because they "pretend' they dont want piles of cash,
all those mediocre people want it just as bad
just look at the queues of people trying to win powerball.
they all want it .

own that sh***T Wink

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Dirty Paki Khunt

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #19 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:13am

Gnads wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:01am:

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 8:15am:

aquascoot wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 6:56am:

Brendon wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 6:42am:

Thank God for communist China. It is the driving force of the world's economy today.

indeed.

very industrious people who have patience and collaboration built into their DNA from generations of tending to their rice paddies.

arabs in the middle east with goats or africans with hunting or americans with ranching have aggression and competition built into their DNA because a neighbour can always steal your cows or goats (but he cant steal your rice paddy).

hence why china is a better model for a world that is at peace and the americans and the middle eastern goat herders or the mexican cowboys are always looking for a revenge attack

Good point, but the rice paddies are down in South East Asia. Most of China lives off wheat, a totally different method of farming.

But I agree about cooperation. East Asians are highly communal people. Getting along with your family neighbours is a fundamental value in communities that live so close together.

Northern China's quite different. There, people are descended more from nomads. They don't bow down to social norms and rules so easily.

In China today, people are moving into apartment complexes in the cities. Village life is largely gone. People are changing because of this.

Yes matchbox size apartments where you cant swing a cat.

Saw an ABC story the other day from Hongkong .....

and how much it costs to even get into one of those.

Our millennials have nothing to whinge about with housing affordability.

Indeed.

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Dirty Paki Khunt

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #20 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:31am

aquascoot wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:11am:

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 9:11am:

Not at all. Communism was held by Marx to be the values you espouse. Socialism was just a means to get there.

The Soviets never reached the stage of communism - it was always just around the corner.

socialism works really well at the family level.
of course you share the meals equally with the kids
of course you make sure all the kids have a sport they play and if one gets a birthday party, they all do.

it just doesnt scale.

we are hardwired to only care about 100 to 150 people

above that, its all virtue signalling.

i hear about a massacre in rwanda and , to be honest, i am far more concerned for the life of my dog or cat.
i will spend money on their vet bills i wouldnt spend on a rwandan ,
does that make me a freak.
nope
just honest.

when i see politicians wringing their hands over syria or gaza, i know its a virtue signal.
thats not how humans dna is wired.

they are trying to increase their status by virtue signalling that they are morally superior but its fake.

same as the poor guy who tries to be all humble and lacking in ambition as if hes better then the greedy business man.
he's not.

dont ever let people claim moral superiority because they "pretend' they dont want piles of cash,
all those mediocre people want it just as bad
just look at the queues of people trying to win powerball.
they all want it .

own that sh***T Wink

I believe we're hard wired to work in groups of 7. Apparently teams lose focus after this. They gave telephone numbers 7 digits for similar reasons. People forget more than that.

This is why the state is required to assist. States cover entire populations. Where you or I can work in a team of 7 people, the state's there to cover the rest, but do you know?

Most people don't want piles of money. They want families, communities, good health and housing, good schools for their kids.

The lust for piles of money is just capitalist ideology - your durp state. No one needs a penthouse full of fake Louis XVI furniture. No one needs a helipad, a gold toilet or a fake Renoir.

Warren Buffett has one car and a house in the suburbs. He admits he needs no more than that.

Eradicating poverty worldwide requires this acknowledgement. Live simply so that others may simply live. These are, essentially, socialist values. Thrift, modesty, selflessness. While we focus on our families and our small collection of friends and colleagues, the state does the rest - in cooperation with the free market.

I can't see why anyone would see this as a bad thing.

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Sir lastnail

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #21 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:48am

aquascoot wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 6:56am:

Brendon wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 6:42am:

Thank God for communist China. It is the driving force of the world's economy today.

indeed.

very industrious people who have patience and collaboration built into their DNA from generations of tending to their rice paddies.

arabs in the middle east with goats or africans with hunting or americans with ranching have aggression and competition built into their DNA because a neighbour can always steal your cows or goats (but he cant steal your rice paddy).

hence why china is a better model for a world that is at peace and the americans and the middle eastern goat herders or the mexican cowboys are always looking for a revenge attack

that's why they are coming here to steal our real estate and land from us. Yes how very industrious of them Sad

And what industries are they bringing to Australia ? Ahhh lets see. Two dollar shops, coffee shops, fish and chip shops and milk bars Cheesy

LOL Yes very industrious when they come to Australia Cheesy

LOL

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aquascoot

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #22 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 11:06am

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:31am:

aquascoot wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:11am:

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 9:11am:

Not at all. Communism was held by Marx to be the values you espouse. Socialism was just a means to get there.

The Soviets never reached the stage of communism - it was always just around the corner.

socialism works really well at the family level.
of course you share the meals equally with the kids
of course you make sure all the kids have a sport they play and if one gets a birthday party, they all do.

it just doesnt scale.

we are hardwired to only care about 100 to 150 people

above that, its all virtue signalling.

i hear about a massacre in rwanda and , to be honest, i am far more concerned for the life of my dog or cat.
i will spend money on their vet bills i wouldnt spend on a rwandan ,
does that make me a freak.
nope
just honest.

when i see politicians wringing their hands over syria or gaza, i know its a virtue signal.
thats not how humans dna is wired.

they are trying to increase their status by virtue signalling that they are morally superior but its fake.

same as the poor guy who tries to be all humble and lacking in ambition as if hes better then the greedy business man.
he's not.

dont ever let people claim moral superiority because they "pretend' they dont want piles of cash,
all those mediocre people want it just as bad
just look at the queues of people trying to win powerball.
they all want it .

own that sh***T Wink

I believe we're hard wired to work in groups of 7. Apparently teams lose focus after this. They gave telephone numbers 7 digits for similar reasons. People forget more than that.

This is why the state is required to assist. States cover entire populations. Where you or I can work in a team of 7 people, the state's there to cover the rest, but do you know?

Most people don't want piles of money. They want families, communities, good health and housing, good schools for their kids.

The lust for piles of money is just capitalist ideology - your durp state. No one needs a penthouse full of fake Louis XVI furniture. No one needs a helipad, a gold toilet or a fake Renoir.

Warren Buffett has one car and a house in the suburbs. He admits he needs no more than that.

Eradicating poverty worldwide requires this acknowledgement. Live simply so that others may simply live. These are, essentially, socialist values. Thrift, modesty, selflessness. While we focus on our families and our small collection of friends and colleagues, the state does the rest - in cooperation with the free market.

I can't see why anyone would see this as a bad thing.

young men in particular should be encouraged to hustle and try to succeed (the silicon valley method , the venture capital method)

to retire to byron bay in your 20's and say "i want to live simply, so others may simply live" is "fake spirituality " that is actually just "apathy and laziness".

if you live in tibet, go be spiritual, there isnt a lot going on.

but in australia, there is so much opportunity.
you can hustle and succeed and THEN you can go be a philanthropist and help those poor kiddies once you have reached the paradigm of success.

because that paradigm is only reached by taking massive action and once you are in action taking momentum, its as addictive as being an apathetic socialist hippie.

take action, never stop , once you lose momentum in life, youre screwed
the paradigm shifts never stop.
Cheesy

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Dirty Paki Khunt

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #23 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 12:25pm

aquascoot wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 11:06am:

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:31am:

aquascoot wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:11am:

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 9:11am:

Not at all. Communism was held by Marx to be the values you espouse. Socialism was just a means to get there.

The Soviets never reached the stage of communism - it was always just around the corner.

socialism works really well at the family level.
of course you share the meals equally with the kids
of course you make sure all the kids have a sport they play and if one gets a birthday party, they all do.

it just doesnt scale.

we are hardwired to only care about 100 to 150 people

above that, its all virtue signalling.

i hear about a massacre in rwanda and , to be honest, i am far more concerned for the life of my dog or cat.
i will spend money on their vet bills i wouldnt spend on a rwandan ,
does that make me a freak.
nope
just honest.

when i see politicians wringing their hands over syria or gaza, i know its a virtue signal.
thats not how humans dna is wired.

they are trying to increase their status by virtue signalling that they are morally superior but its fake.

same as the poor guy who tries to be all humble and lacking in ambition as if hes better then the greedy business man.
he's not.

dont ever let people claim moral superiority because they "pretend' they dont want piles of cash,
all those mediocre people want it just as bad
just look at the queues of people trying to win powerball.
they all want it .

own that sh***T Wink

I believe we're hard wired to work in groups of 7. Apparently teams lose focus after this. They gave telephone numbers 7 digits for similar reasons. People forget more than that.

This is why the state is required to assist. States cover entire populations. Where you or I can work in a team of 7 people, the state's there to cover the rest, but do you know?

Most people don't want piles of money. They want families, communities, good health and housing, good schools for their kids.

The lust for piles of money is just capitalist ideology - your durp state. No one needs a penthouse full of fake Louis XVI furniture. No one needs a helipad, a gold toilet or a fake Renoir.

Warren Buffett has one car and a house in the suburbs. He admits he needs no more than that.

Eradicating poverty worldwide requires this acknowledgement. Live simply so that others may simply live. These are, essentially, socialist values. Thrift, modesty, selflessness. While we focus on our families and our small collection of friends and colleagues, the state does the rest - in cooperation with the free market.

I can't see why anyone would see this as a bad thing.

young men in particular should be encouraged to hustle and try to succeed (the silicon valley method , the venture capital method)

to retire to byron bay in your 20's and say "i want to live simply, so others may simply live" is "fake spirituality " that is actually just "apathy and laziness".

if you live in tibet, go be spiritual, there isnt a lot going on.

but in australia, there is so much opportunity.
you can hustle and succeed and THEN you can go be a philanthropist and help those poor kiddies once you have reached the paradigm of success.

because that paradigm is only reached by taking massive action and once you are in action taking momentum, its as addictive as being an apathetic socialist hippie.

take action, never stop , once you lose momentum in life, youre screwed
the paradigm shifts never stop.
Cheesy

That's just activity for activity's sake.

We ex-puritans have a work ethic. It made sense when people needed to make things with their hands. It makes little sense today.

The modern equivalent of the Protestant work ethic is getting rich for Jesus. It's a ridiculous idea and has nothing to do with the Calvinism that proceeded it.

The notion of a gold toilet is fundamentally obscene. Or a Ferrari when the speed limit's 120. Or owning the world's most expensive luxury yacht when you get seasick.

These are things who's only value is to express wealth. This is not the spirit of the Protestant work ethic - far from it. In Anglo culture in particular, displays of obscene wealth are seen as attention-seeking, vain and shallow. These are grave vices in our culture.

I'm not sure why you'd say people should strive to become rich so they can give to charity, dear. You started this thread to show how useless charity is in reducing poverty.

And yes, we all tend to agree.

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minarchist

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #24 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 2:00pm

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 8:05am:

Older Chinese have told me they look back fondly on the days of the Great Leap Forward. They felt a sense of shared purpose that doesn't exist in China today.

I'd be interested in knowing where those elderly Chinese people lived during the Great Leap Forward. There are numerous books on how disastrous the period was thanks to Mao's downright stupid policies. The famine caused by his policies are estimated to have killed between 20 to 45 million people.

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People accuse Capitalism of being a "dog eat dog" system, yet it was the Communists who ate each other when they were starving!

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Dirty Paki Khunt

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #25 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 2:05pm

minarchist wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 2:00pm:

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 8:05am:

Older Chinese have told me they look back fondly on the days of the Great Leap Forward. They felt a sense of shared purpose that doesn't exist in China today.

I'd be interested in knowing where those elderly Chinese people lived during the Great Leap Forward. There are numerous books on how disastrous the period was thanks to Mao's downright stupid policies. The famine caused by his policies are estimated to have killed between 20 to 45 million people.

True. I believe they lived in the city.

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Sir lastnail

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #26 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 2:55pm

aquascoot wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 11:06am:

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:31am:

aquascoot wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 10:11am:

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 9:11am:

Not at all. Communism was held by Marx to be the values you espouse. Socialism was just a means to get there.

The Soviets never reached the stage of communism - it was always just around the corner.

socialism works really well at the family level.
of course you share the meals equally with the kids
of course you make sure all the kids have a sport they play and if one gets a birthday party, they all do.

it just doesnt scale.

we are hardwired to only care about 100 to 150 people

above that, its all virtue signalling.

i hear about a massacre in rwanda and , to be honest, i am far more concerned for the life of my dog or cat.
i will spend money on their vet bills i wouldnt spend on a rwandan ,
does that make me a freak.
nope
just honest.

when i see politicians wringing their hands over syria or gaza, i know its a virtue signal.
thats not how humans dna is wired.

they are trying to increase their status by virtue signalling that they are morally superior but its fake.

same as the poor guy who tries to be all humble and lacking in ambition as if hes better then the greedy business man.
he's not.

dont ever let people claim moral superiority because they "pretend' they dont want piles of cash,
all those mediocre people want it just as bad
just look at the queues of people trying to win powerball.
they all want it .

own that sh***T Wink

I believe we're hard wired to work in groups of 7. Apparently teams lose focus after this. They gave telephone numbers 7 digits for similar reasons. People forget more than that.

This is why the state is required to assist. States cover entire populations. Where you or I can work in a team of 7 people, the state's there to cover the rest, but do you know?

Most people don't want piles of money. They want families, communities, good health and housing, good schools for their kids.

The lust for piles of money is just capitalist ideology - your durp state. No one needs a penthouse full of fake Louis XVI furniture. No one needs a helipad, a gold toilet or a fake Renoir.

Warren Buffett has one car and a house in the suburbs. He admits he needs no more than that.

Eradicating poverty worldwide requires this acknowledgement. Live simply so that others may simply live. These are, essentially, socialist values. Thrift, modesty, selflessness. While we focus on our families and our small collection of friends and colleagues, the state does the rest - in cooperation with the free market.

I can't see why anyone would see this as a bad thing.

young men in particular should be encouraged to hustle and try to succeed (the silicon valley method , the venture capital method)

to retire to byron bay in your 20's and say "i want to live simply, so others may simply live" is "fake spirituality " that is actually just "apathy and laziness".

if you live in tibet, go be spiritual, there isnt a lot going on.

but in australia, there is so much opportunity.
you can hustle and succeed and THEN you can go be a philanthropist and help those poor kiddies once you have reached the paradigm of success.

because that paradigm is only reached by taking massive action and once you are in action taking momentum, its as addictive as being an apathetic socialist hippie.

take action, never stop , once you lose momentum in life, youre screwed
the paradigm shifts never stop.
Cheesy

The problem with aussies is that they have been brainwashed into believing that the roads to riches are through wheeling and dealing in property only. As such they have become risk averse and always expecting to at least break even on a deal. This means that the risk averse appetite of Silicon Valley where 9 out of 10 ventures fail is out of the question for them. The result is that we have no technology industries of any measurable size. Just small pockets of token efforts and lots of lip-service payed by politicians how we are so inventive because we built the Hills hoist 50 years ago and haven't really done much since Sad

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aquascoot

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #27 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 3:19pm

its a good point Nail.

as an example , i see Trump bouncing back from 2 bankruptcies as a success story.
try, fail, try again, fail, try again.

but in about 10,000 posts, gweggie, bojack, karnal , sad skippy and their colleagues want to point out that he is unfit to be president because he has had a couple of failures.

go check it out and see the vitriol they dump on the guy and the sh**t talking because he stumbled a few times.

Oz has got to get that out of that sort of "limiting belief".

you have to be a fool before you can be a master.

thats better then being some mediocre little virtue signalling "nice guy" who never has the balls to try anything and expects kudos because he "lives simply" Roll Eyes

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Prime Minister for Canyons

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #28 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 3:22pm

aquascoot wrote on Apr 8^th, 2019 at 3:19pm:

its a good point Nail.

as an example , i see Trump bouncing back from 2 bankruptcies as a success story.
try, fail, try again, fail, try again.

but in about 10,000 posts, gweggie, bojack, karnal , sad skippy and their colleagues want to point out that he is unfit to be president because he has had a couple of failures.

)

Thats because you're not using the definition of the bankruptcy in the sense Trump did

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In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)

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Prime Minister for Canyons

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Re: The Decline in Poverty
Reply #29 - Apr 8^th, 2019 at 3:27pm

See for instance, Trump has never filed for personal bankruptcy, but his businesses have filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy. It essentially means his businesses cant' pay off its debts, because essentially it sucked, so the reorganisation occurs to save assets.

My point about this, is that Trump flouts his supposed business acumen. The fact that his hotel and casino businesses filed for bankruptcy six times between 91 and 2009 begs the question is he actually that good at business?

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In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)

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