Australian Politics Forum - "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho

Panther

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #30 - Jan 15^th, 2015 at 12:01pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 15^th, 2015 at 9:26am:

.......Hospitals and doctors weren't originally designed to kill.

Hospitals and doctors weren't originally designed to kill, but they do, don't they?

Malpractice is at an all time high, or are you going to deny that?

And firearms were only designed to kill.

Good.....

Something, thank God, that works!!!

But, unlike you, they don't discriminate, they kill bad guys too, & in that way they save quite a few lives.

Probably more than you're willing to admit.

But again, you won't admit that either, will you?

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greggerypeccary

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #31 - Jan 15^th, 2015 at 12:29pm

Panther wrote on Jan 15^th, 2015 at 12:01pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 15^th, 2015 at 9:26am:

.......Hospitals and doctors weren't originally designed to kill.

Hospitals and doctors weren't originally designed to kill, but they do, don't they?
Yes.

Malpractice is at an all time high, or are you going to deny that?
I'll take your word for it.

And firearms were only designed to kill.
Yes.

Good.....
No, it's bad.

Something, thank God, that works!!!
Doctors and hospitals work too, or are you suggesting that they don't save any lives?

But, unlike you, they don't discriminate, they kill bad guys too, & in that way they save quite a few lives.
True.

Probably more than you're willing to admit.
I'll admit to whatever the actual figure is. Do they save more than they take?

But again, you won't admit that either, will you?
Yes, I would.

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Vuk11

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #32 - Jan 15^th, 2015 at 3:58pm

"Only gun homicides are relevant to the OP"

I beg to differ, the whole point of the legal use of a means of self defence whether it be lethal or non-lethal is to reduce all violent crime as conceal carry permits have done in the oh so crazy US....70% in what was it 13 years or so?

Howard cherry picks one statistic...gun homicides which makes sense in a narrow simplistic view of the issue ignoring the whole point of self defence.

Though they aren't asking much....self defence is legal however one can already own a firearm and use it in self defence the issue is they'll be treated as a criminal. Surely our courts can manage to rule whether someonr fires a firearm in self defence or not the same way they do now with our fists....only lethal and non-lethal means are pretty illegal atm and that needs to change in order to be consistent with the idea of a persons right to self defence.

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Life_goes_on Gold Member Offline Posts: 4772 400kms south of Yobsville, Qld Gender:	Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho Reply #33 - Jan 15^th, 2015 at 4:08pm It's Australia, not downtown Detroit. We have less than 400 homicides a year. I certainly don't feel unsafe walking the streets at nights. You can defend yourself with a weapon. That in itself is not illegal.
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Vuk11

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #34 - Jan 15^th, 2015 at 5:57pm

Life_goes_on wrote on Jan 15^th, 2015 at 4:08pm:

It's Australia, not downtown Detroit.

We have less than 400 homicides a year.

I certainly don't feel unsafe walking the streets at nights.

You can defend yourself with a weapon. That in itself is not illegal.

You may feel safe that doesn't mean we don't have violent crime. What weapons are legal in self-defence? Even sticks aren't.....if you use a firearm that's illegal. If you buy pepper spray/a taser that's illegal...this is Australia remember.

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Life_goes_on

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #35 - Jan 15^th, 2015 at 7:45pm

Vuk11 wrote on Jan 15^th, 2015 at 5:57pm:

Life_goes_on wrote on Jan 15^th, 2015 at 4:08pm:

It's Australia, not downtown Detroit.

We have less than 400 homicides a year.

I certainly don't feel unsafe walking the streets at nights.

You can defend yourself with a weapon. That in itself is not illegal.

You may feel safe that doesn't mean we don't have violent crime. What weapons are legal in self-defence? Even sticks aren't.....if you use a firearm that's illegal. If you buy pepper spray/a taser that's illegal...this is Australia remember.

You can use whatever you have at hand... pool cue, cricket bat, kitchen knife etc.... if you have a firearm and they come at you with a firearm then that's fine too.

You'll be interviewed by the cops who will attempt to work out if the story you tell is the truth and that you didn't use unnecessary force - or chase the culprit down once the danger was gone etc

If you use an illegal weapon it won't affect whether or not you get charged for assault etc - all it will do is probably get you an "illegal possession of...." charge.

If all is ok then you'll hear nothing more about it - otherwise, get lawyered up and you'll have a chance to explain your case in court.

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Baronvonrort

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #36 - Jan 16^th, 2015 at 10:32am

Dnarever wrote on Jan 15^th, 2015 at 6:10am:

Sorry but I disagree, A figure around 180 people in Australia die as a result of gun shot each year, I suspect that this constitutes a danger.

1,648 Australians died from accidental falls in 2010 according to ABS stats.

864 Australians died from accidental poisoning in the same year.

Does falling over or accidentally poisoning yourself account for far more deaths hence danger?

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Baronvonrort

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #37 - Jan 16^th, 2015 at 10:33am

Baronvonrort wrote on Jan 9^th, 2015 at 12:09pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Jan 8^th, 2015 at 9:05pm:

What are your thoughts on this guy deciding to end his own life Bobby, is he guilty of any crime?
www.duckworksmagazine.com/09/reports/bolger/index.htm

Would this guys suicide have been more acceptable if he used a rope or jumped from a height instead of using a gun?

Any of the anti gun bigots want to comment on how it was wrong for Mr Bolger to take his own life?

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #38 - Jan 19^th, 2015 at 10:43am

Baronvonrort wrote on Jan 16^th, 2015 at 10:33am:

Baronvonrort wrote on Jan 9^th, 2015 at 12:09pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Jan 8^th, 2015 at 9:05pm:

What are your thoughts on this guy deciding to end his own life Bobby, is he guilty of any crime?
www.duckworksmagazine.com/09/reports/bolger/index.htm

Would this guys suicide have been more acceptable if he used a rope or jumped from a height instead of using a gun?

Any of the anti gun bigots want to comment on how it was wrong for Mr Bolger to take his own life?

Wasn't wrong for him to take his own life - as long as his choice was free and fair. The method leaves a great to be desired. Why blow your brains out or hang yourself or any of the other methods when you can down the pub score some smack and go out on a high? Grin

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Prime Minister for Canyons Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 26906 Canberra Gender:	Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho Reply #39 - Jan 19^th, 2015 at 10:53am I would wager that our lesson of increased gun ownership versus decreased crime couldn't be used in the states, since our regulations re storage are generally tougher.
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ian

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #40 - Jan 19^th, 2015 at 11:19am

Vuk11 wrote on Jan 15^th, 2015 at 5:57pm:

Life_goes_on wrote on Jan 15^th, 2015 at 4:08pm:

It's Australia, not downtown Detroit.

We have less than 400 homicides a year.

I certainly don't feel unsafe walking the streets at nights.

You can defend yourself with a weapon. That in itself is not illegal.

You may feel safe that doesn't mean we don't have violent crime. What weapons are legal in self-defence? Even sticks aren't.....if you use a firearm that's illegal. If you buy pepper spray/a taser that's illegal...this is Australia remember.

thats pure nonsense, the law allows you to defend yourself using equivalent force and anything available to use as a weapon if required.

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ian Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 9451	Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho Reply #41 - Jan 19^th, 2015 at 11:20am Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Jan 19^th, 2015 at 10:53am: I would wager that our lesson of increased gun ownership versus decreased crime couldn't be used in the states, since our regulations re storage are generally tougher. what lesson? Its an equation that cant add up.
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Prime Minister for Canyons

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #42 - Jan 19^th, 2015 at 11:32am

ian wrote on Jan 19^th, 2015 at 11:20am:

Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Jan 19^th, 2015 at 10:53am:

I would wager that our lesson of increased gun ownership versus decreased crime couldn't be used in the states, since our regulations re storage are generally tougher.

what lesson? Its an equation that cant add up.

Someone had posted a link of a reference showing that even though our gun crime had decreased, legal gun ownership had increased.

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In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)

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Dnarever

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #43 - Jan 19^th, 2015 at 2:47pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Jan 16^th, 2015 at 10:32am:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 15^th, 2015 at 6:10am:

Sorry but I disagree, A figure around 180 people in Australia die as a result of gun shot each year, I suspect that this constitutes a danger.

1,648 Australians died from accidental falls in 2010 according to ABS stats.

864 Australians died from accidental poisoning in the same year.

Does falling over or accidentally poisoning yourself account for far more deaths hence danger?

They should not be encouraged either ? what is the point ?

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Baronvonrort

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Re: "We need fewer guns in society, not more." John Ho
Reply #44 - Feb 2^nd, 2015 at 1:36pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Jan 16^th, 2015 at 10:33am:

Baronvonrort wrote on Jan 9^th, 2015 at 12:09pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Jan 8^th, 2015 at 9:05pm:

What are your thoughts on this guy deciding to end his own life Bobby, is he guilty of any crime?
www.duckworksmagazine.com/09/reports/bolger/index.htm

Would this guys suicide have been more acceptable if he used a rope or jumped from a height instead of using a gun?

Any of the anti gun bigots want to comment on how it was wrong for Mr Bolger to take his own life?

Dnarever or Rabbitoh or peccahead want to comment on Phil Bolger taking his own life?

The Greens are hypocrites who are all for assisted suicide, as long as you don't use a gun.

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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