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Why are people against gun ownership? (Read 51829 times)
nasus
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Why are people against gun ownership?
Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm
 
Looking at the two post re gun laws in Australia I am trying to get my head around why there are a FEW anti gun owners on this continent. Why do they think firearms are evil, will reducing or eliminating gun ownership reduce crime, if so offer empirical evidence. Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?
If we make firearms illegal will all criminals promise to hand in all their weapons so not only the population at large are unarmed, but also them, a level playing ground. Or will only law abiding citizens become unarmed, and violent crime sky rocket?
What is it that scares people about firearms and not about crack or other drugs, does anyone actually think drugs on our streets is good. So why do drug dealers need firearms, they from all police reports seem to have a fine collect. Guess they will hand them into a police station if they are banned?
Does anyone actually own a firearm? Has any knowledge of firearms? What are they? Where are they kept?
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greggerypeccary
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #1 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:51pm
 
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?



As surprising as this may be for you, no guns = no people being injured by firearms.




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John Smith
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #2 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:54pm
 
Why are people against gun ownership?

ignorance
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Lionel Edriess
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #3 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:55pm
 
I really see no reason to replicate the previous threads about this subject.

All that will happen is that the already fruitless arguments by both sides will be further complicated by another thread, and no consensus will be reached. It'll be merely another debate (?) ad infinitum.

As far as your requirements regarding experience with firearms, there a plenty here who have extensive experience yet hold a firm anti-gun stance. There are also those who have no, or little, experience that hold pro-gun attitudes.

Rational discussion on the issues facing gun ownership in this country tend to swamped by headlines in the news and repeated references to the American model.

In short, at the end of a contentious and repeatedly trolled thread, you'll be none the wiser.

If you wish to persist, I'd respectfully suggest that you take the considerable time needed to read the other threads in their entirety - and then form your own opinion.

nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
... Does anyone actually own a firearm? Has any knowledge of firearms? What are they? Where are they kept? ...


Are you a policeman?  Cool

Or merely genuinely interested?



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John Smith
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #4 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:55pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:51pm:
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?



As surprising as this may be for you, no guns = no people being injured by firearms.



no knives means no one gets stabbed either, no cars mean no car accidents, no water means no drownings (except for the fish, they'll all drown) no work means no workplace accidents

why don't you ban all of those?
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greggerypeccary
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #5 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:59pm
 
John Smith wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:55pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:51pm:
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?



As surprising as this may be for you, no guns = no people being injured by firearms.



no knives means no one gets stabbed either, no cars mean no car accidents, no water means no drownings (except for the fish, they'll all drown) no work means no workplace accidents

why don't you ban all of those?



None of them, apart from guns, were originally designed to kill.

Any other questions?
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Lionel Edriess
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #6 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 9:10pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:59pm:
John Smith wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:55pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:51pm:
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?



As surprising as this may be for you, no guns = no people being injured by firearms.



no knives means no one gets stabbed either, no cars mean no car accidents, no water means no drownings (except for the fish, they'll all drown) no work means no workplace accidents

why don't you ban all of those?



None of them, apart from guns, were originally designed to kill.

Any other questions?


One wonders whether that first sharp implement was used for stabbing - or picking/cutting up food.

What do you reckon, Greggery?

Weapon or tableware?

Grin

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nasus
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #7 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 9:13pm
 
Lionel Edriess wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:55pm:
I really see no reason to replicate the previous threads about this subject.
All that will happen is that the already fruitless arguments by both sides will be further complicated by another thread, and no consensus will be reached. It'll be merely another debate (?) ad infinitum.
As far as your requirements regarding experience with firearms, there a plenty here who have extensive experience yet hold a firm anti-gun stance. There are also those who have no, or little, experience that hold pro-gun attitudes.
Rational discussion on the issues facing gun ownership in this country tend to swamped by headlines in the news and repeated references to the American model.
In short, at the end of a contentious and repeatedly trolled thread, you'll be none the wiser.
If you wish to persist, I'd respectfully suggest that you take the considerable time needed to read the other threads in their entirety - and then form your own opinion.
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
... Does anyone actually own a firearm? Has any knowledge of firearms? What are they? Where are they kept? ...

Are you a policeman?  Cool
Or merely genuinely interested?



Thanks for your post, I am genuinely interested. Much in the past few weeks reflects the question being asked.  I have read other topics where certain members keep quoting that civilised societies don't and this is on numerous threads. They here already make there point, even if unconsidered. We are defenceless and vulnerable, it appears to be a hobby, interest to many. From what I have read some 2.7 million firearms and some 750 licenced shooters, no small number. HENCE, why the hysteria, the negative response, the idiotic statement that if there are no firearms by legal owners there would be no need for police or an army with firearms. All would walk the planet holding hands and singing and passing out flowers. You have some knowledge on this topic?
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buzzanddidj
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #8 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 9:15pm
 
John Smith wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:55pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:51pm:
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?



As surprising as this may be for you, no guns = no people being injured by firearms.



no knives means no one gets stabbed either ...





I can just imagine
Martin Bryant 
murdering 35 people and injuring 23 others in the
Port Arthur massacre
- with a
Wiltshire Stay-Sharp
- before he was over-powered





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John Smith
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #9 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 9:19pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:59pm:
John Smith wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:55pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:51pm:
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?



As surprising as this may be for you, no guns = no people being injured by firearms.



no knives means no one gets stabbed either, no cars mean no car accidents, no water means no drownings (except for the fish, they'll all drown) no work means no workplace accidents

why don't you ban all of those?



None of them, apart from guns, were originally designed to kill.

Any other questions?


and that means what exactly?

knives were designed for? bows and arrows for? spears? how many of them are banned?
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I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
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nasus
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #10 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 9:25pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:59pm:
John Smith wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:55pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:51pm:
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?

As surprising as this may be for you, no guns = no people being injured by firearms.

no knives means no one gets stabbed either, no cars mean no car accidents, no water means no drownings (except for the fish, they'll all drown) no work means no workplace accidents
why don't you ban all of those?

None of them, apart from guns, were originally designed to kill.
Any other questions?


You appear to be an intelligent individual, you appear to use the same quote on various postings.
Guns were originally designed to kill. I take exception to that.
In the beginning MAN hunted, food was the objective, I am not certain of the order, however primitive man must of used rocks and then other projectiles to kill game, FOR FOOD. Then spears and the bow and arrow.
Man the invented gun powder, the Chinese I believe, to use in mortal combat, NO, but for fireworks.
Firearms are just a better hunting tool, not designed to KILL, as you wrote.
The nuclear energy was originally envisaged to assist mankind, designed to create nuclear power, for the GOOD of mankind, not create a nuclear bomb. Hence you argument sucks.

When you are disarmed and defenceless, whom do you want to protect you from those who want what you posses?
How do you stop a foreign nation from coming to take what your country possesses, kind words and offerings will do nothing to appease those who want what is most dear to you.
Hence, please explain the methods of safeguarding what you hold dear, as there are MANY in the world who are possibly are not as charitable as you.
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John Smith
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #11 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 9:28pm
 
buzzanddidj wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 9:15pm:
John Smith wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:55pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:51pm:
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?



As surprising as this may be for you, no guns = no people being injured by firearms.



no knives means no one gets stabbed either ...





I can just imagine
Martin Bryant 
murdering 35 people and injuring 23 others in the
Port Arthur massacre
- with a
Wiltshire Stay-Sharp
- before he was over-powered




Luis Garavito was responsible for the murder of up to 400 people, usually killing them with a knife

John Wayne Gacy killed over 33 people, all but one with a torniquet

Gennady Mikhasevich over 44, strangulation

Daniel Camargo over 150, strangulation

mad people will do mad things, with or without a gun. Sure, we need to keep guns away from lunatics as much as possible, but there is no need to ban them
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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
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nasus
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #12 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 9:34pm
 
buzzanddidj wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 9:15pm:
John Smith wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:55pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:51pm:
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?

As surprising as this may be for you, no guns = no people being injured by firearms.

no knives means no one gets stabbed either ...


I can just imagine
Martin Bryant 
murdering 35 people and injuring 23 others in the
Port Arthur massacre
- with a
Wiltshire Stay-Sharp
- before he was over-powered



Martin Bryant from what you post had an IQ of 66. He obtained it is alleged an AR15, without being a licence holder, and not licenced to own a weapon as that. He held no drivers licence, but allegedly drove to Port Arthur.
So we have an unlicensed owner of a firearm, owning a prohibited weapon, and ammunition??? from bloody well where?  Hence stricter gun laws will do nothing to resolve the issue. THOSE intent on harming others will fins a way, usually they import illegal firearms and are unlicensed, so you argument goes out the window.   
Not sure Martin Bryant had the capabilities and training to do what he is alleged to have done, but when he did, HE WAS in possession of an illegal firearm at the time, who sold him the firearm, are they in prison? Who trained Bryant in the use of the firearm, are they in Prison. Why would someone own an AR15, why would someone sell this type of military rifle to an unlicensed buyer? How many day prior to the event did Bryant buy the firearm? Lots of questions/.
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"I may not believe in what you say, however I will defend unto death your right to say it". Attributed to Voltaire. Freedom of speech a right we must regain.
 
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Bobby.
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #13 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 9:45pm
 
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
Looking at the two post re gun laws in Australia I am trying to get my head around why there are a FEW anti gun owners on this continent. Why do they think firearms are evil, will reducing or eliminating gun ownership reduce crime, if so offer empirical evidence. Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?
If we make firearms illegal will all criminals promise to hand in all their weapons so not only the population at large are unarmed, but also them, a level playing ground. Or will only law abiding citizens become unarmed, and violent crime sky rocket?
What is it that scares people about firearms and not about crack or other drugs, does anyone actually think drugs on our streets is good. So why do drug dealers need firearms, they from all police reports seem to have a fine collect. Guess they will hand them into a police station if they are banned?
Does anyone actually own a firearm? Has any knowledge of firearms? What are they? Where are they kept?



This must be the 100th thread on this topic.

Same answer.
32,000 Americans die every year from fire arms.

That's 86 tragedies every day or 3.6  people on average per hour.
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gizmo_2655
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Re: Why are people against gun ownership?
Reply #14 - Jan 19th, 2015 at 10:01pm
 
Bobby. wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 9:45pm:
nasus wrote on Jan 19th, 2015 at 8:20pm:
Looking at the two post re gun laws in Australia I am trying to get my head around why there are a FEW anti gun owners on this continent. Why do they think firearms are evil, will reducing or eliminating gun ownership reduce crime, if so offer empirical evidence. Is there a correlation between the lack of firearms in society and violent crime, or the reverse?
If we make firearms illegal will all criminals promise to hand in all their weapons so not only the population at large are unarmed, but also them, a level playing ground. Or will only law abiding citizens become unarmed, and violent crime sky rocket?
What is it that scares people about firearms and not about crack or other drugs, does anyone actually think drugs on our streets is good. So why do drug dealers need firearms, they from all police reports seem to have a fine collect. Guess they will hand them into a police station if they are banned?
Does anyone actually own a firearm? Has any knowledge of firearms? What are they? Where are they kept?



This must be the 100th thread on this topic.

Same answer.
32,000 Americans die every year from fire arms.


That's 86 tragedies every day or 3.6  people on average per hour.


And actually Bobby, in 2010, it was a total of 30, 470 people died from firearms, 11,078 were homicides..and in 2012 it was only 8,855 firearm homicides...so I think your claim of '32,000 every year' might be a little bit exaggerated hmmm??
ok, try this as an answer Bobby..
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« Last Edit: Jan 19th, 2015 at 10:08pm by gizmo_2655 »  

"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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