Australian Politics Forum - freedom of speech or madness

polite_gandalf

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #15 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:04am

statement from the Opera House:

Quote:

"It is clear from the public reaction that the title has given the wrong impression of what Mr Badar intended to discuss. Neither Mr Badar, the St James Ethics Centre, nor Sydney Opera House in any way advocates honour killings or condones any form of violence against women."

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/festival-of-dangerous-ideas-honour-killings-talk-cancelled-20140624-3arlb.html#ixzz35bIzOvkR

The tele is just flat out lying.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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cods

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #16 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:06am

____ wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:03am:

cods wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 8:56am:

tickleandrose wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 8:09am:

Actually, I have been reading this topic this morning. From abc, it appeared that the person involved did not choose the topic. The topic was actually chosen for him by... someone. And that he indicated that his content would not be condoning killing of innocent woman / children.

I am actually quiet curious on what he have to say, see if he got any bright ideas, rather than quoting passages from the scripture, or blaming everything on local tradition. When I first read the topic: Honour Killings Are Morally Justified - I was think that he may tackle this from these point of view:
- Cultural or religious definition of innocent - there is alot of material that can be covered there.
- Historical context of honour killings Vs what was happening at the time.
- Cultural or religious definition of morality, and its application in modern secular society.

Its a shame, I really like controversial debates.

the trouble is.........as you can see on this thread alone...

not everyone takes what is said in the same way..

for this speech call it what you will... it is usually directed at those with extreme issues...

and can be turned into anything..even if that wasnt the intention.......look at those who are now wearing t/shirts and jackets applauding what is going on overseas.....they hold no fear...yet if someone walked around with a jacket condemning Islam... they would be dead I am sure...

this is where I fear our double standards will come back to bite us...

I am against anyone who bring their cultural hatreds to our shores..

You mean like the cultural hatred applied to Aboriginals by the british?

WHERE IS THAT HAPPENING... AND WHEN...

Meanwhile Tim Wilson, that hard right human rights commissioner selected by the abbott mob believes in opening everyone up to abuse in the name of human rights.

For once cods, you are out of step with the abbott mob.

[b]YOU SPREAD HATRED... UGLY[/b]

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Kytro

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #17 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:09am

Well the event was called "The festival of dangerous ideas".

If it was a true academic approach, it is important to understand the motivation and ideas behind something - why they propagate and how they do. If was just a propaganda piece it would be less interesting.

Still, probably should have called the event The festival of slightly controversial ideas if you going to exclude dangerous ideas.

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____

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #18 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:10am

cods wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:06am:

____ wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:03am:

cods wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 8:56am:

tickleandrose wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 8:09am:

Actually, I have been reading this topic this morning. From abc, it appeared that the person involved did not choose the topic. The topic was actually chosen for him by... someone. And that he indicated that his content would not be condoning killing of innocent woman / children.

I am actually quiet curious on what he have to say, see if he got any bright ideas, rather than quoting passages from the scripture, or blaming everything on local tradition. When I first read the topic: Honour Killings Are Morally Justified - I was think that he may tackle this from these point of view:
- Cultural or religious definition of innocent - there is alot of material that can be covered there.
- Historical context of honour killings Vs what was happening at the time.
- Cultural or religious definition of morality, and its application in modern secular society.

Its a shame, I really like controversial debates.

the trouble is.........as you can see on this thread alone...

not everyone takes what is said in the same way..

for this speech call it what you will... it is usually directed at those with extreme issues...

and can be turned into anything..even if that wasnt the intention.......look at those who are now wearing t/shirts and jackets applauding what is going on overseas.....they hold no fear...yet if someone walked around with a jacket condemning Islam... they would be dead I am sure...

this is where I fear our double standards will come back to bite us...

I am against anyone who bring their cultural hatreds to our shores..

You mean like the cultural hatred applied to Aboriginals by the british?

WHERE IS THAT HAPPENING... AND WHEN...

Meanwhile Tim Wilson, that hard right human rights commissioner selected by the abbott mob believes in opening everyone up to abuse in the name of human rights.

For once cods, you are out of step with the abbott mob.

[b]YOU SPREAD HATRED... UGLY[/b]

The white australia policy was based on this british hatred of aboriginal culture.

How can you attack muslims while ignoring the acts of british christians which were exactly the same

Invade and overthrow.

Live by the sword etc etc

And part two, I repeat the name Tim Wilson, Cod you are out of step with the abbott mob's agenda.

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King FriYAY II Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 2109	Re: freedom of speech or madness Reply #19 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:12am Why does the topic even need to be discussed in Australia?
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austranger

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #20 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:12am

cods wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 8:59am:

austranger wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 8:39am:

When one is "free" to speak only within certain boundaries and "acceptable" guidelines then there is no freedom of speech, by definition.
True freedom of speech is best defined by the old quote.
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"
(Evelyn Beatrice Hall)
If one refuses to even listen to an opposing view then one is inevitably reduced to acting without full knowledge, and making errors of judgement thereby.

it doesnt work both ways though does it..

have you made any comments about ISLAM in the media of late... and had a jihad placed on you...?

thereby lays the difference....

they have got us all scared witless to say anything in public .... AND THEY KNOW IT.

Two wrongs don't make a right, do they?
Just because "they" repress free speech it's OK for us to do so too?
The trick has always been to oppose ones enemies without effectively becoming them, and we appear to be failing that test, unfortunately.

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OldnCrusty

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #21 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:15am

What a typical 'storm in a tea cup'. The speech is titled "Honour Killings are Morally Justified" but the stated aim was "examining whether honour killings can be morally justified".

Personally I would love to hear some one try argue for the positive of "examining whether honour killings can be morally justified". I would dearly love to hear some one cite God as justification for killing another of God's living creatures, in any situation let alone without just cause or any process to establish a just cause.

My only rider they can only use provable justification and not rely on any belief system or the unverified words of a 'witness' more than a 1000 years old.

My other rider is that the speech is pre published and there is an immediate counter argument allowed without any restriction on the questioning of the 'witness'.

Come on fuukwits, bring it on. Give me your justifications that a family member can kill another family member for any reason other than self defense. Bring it on fuukwits, bring it on.

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austranger

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #22 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:17am

The white australia policy was based on this british hatred of aboriginal culture.

Good grief, go and learn some history, the WAP was about immigration, and was "based" in the racial prejudice common across the entire planet at that time.
If you could define a common "British" attitude to Aboriginals it would most likely be pity, not hatred.

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Any day with a smile in it is a good day

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tickleandrose

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #23 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:17am

re Cod

Quote:

the trouble is.........as you can see on this thread alone...

not everyone takes what is said in the same way..

for this speech call it what you will... it is usually directed at those with extreme issues...

and can be turned into anything..even if that wasnt the intention.......look at those who are now wearing t/shirts and jackets applauding what is going on overseas.....they hold no fear...yet if someone walked around with a jacket condemning Islam... they would be dead I am sure...

this is where I fear our double standards will come back to bite us...

I am against anyone who bring their cultural hatreds to our shores..

I suppose there are gullible people out there who would believe in anything. But luckily these people are far and few in between. Gullible people can be influenced by many things, even violent movies or video games. So just how far do we go in restriction to prevent this? I guess, the line had to be drawn somewhere.

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____

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #24 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:19am

OldnCrusty wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:15am:

What a typical 'storm in a tea cup'. The speech is titled "Honour Killings are Morally Justified" but the stated aim was "examining whether honour killings can be morally justified".

Personally I would love to hear some one try argue for the positive of "examining whether honour killings can be morally justified". I would dearly love to hear some one cite God as justification for killing another of God's living creatures, in any situation let alone without just cause or any process to establish a just cause.

My only rider they can only use provable justification and not rely on any belief system or the unverified words of a 'witness' more than a 1000 years old.

My other rider is that the speech is pre published and there is an immediate counter argument allowed without any restriction on the questioning of the 'witness'.

Come on fuukwits, bring it on. Give me your justifications that a family member can kill another family member for any reason other than self defense. Bring it on fuukwits, bring it on.

If your brother was to enact a terrorism attack that could cost thousands of lives, lets say a dirty bomb, would you kill him if that was the only path to stop him?

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austranger

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #25 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:19am

OldnCrusty wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:15am:

What a typical 'storm in a tea cup'. The speech is titled "Honour Killings are Morally Justified" but the stated aim was "examining whether honour killings can be morally justified".

Personally I would love to hear some one try argue for the positive of "examining whether honour killings can be morally justified". I would dearly love to hear some one cite God as justification for killing another of God's living creatures, in any situation let alone without just cause or any process to establish a just cause.

My only rider they can only use provable justification and not rely on any belief system or the unverified words of a 'witness' more than a 1000 years old.

My other rider is that the speech is pre published and there is an immediate counter argument allowed without any restriction on the questioning of the 'witness'.

Come on fuukwits, bring it on. Give me your justifications that a family member can kill another family member for any reason other than self defense. Bring it on fuukwits, bring it on.

See this?
THIS is what freedom of speech is really about, The Ancient One has nailed it!
Onya Mate, great post!

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Any day with a smile in it is a good day

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austranger

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #26 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:21am

____ wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:19am:

OldnCrusty wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:15am:

What a typical 'storm in a tea cup'. The speech is titled "Honour Killings are Morally Justified" but the stated aim was "examining whether honour killings can be morally justified".

Personally I would love to hear some one try argue for the positive of "examining whether honour killings can be morally justified". I would dearly love to hear some one cite God as justification for killing another of God's living creatures, in any situation let alone without just cause or any process to establish a just cause.

My only rider they can only use provable justification and not rely on any belief system or the unverified words of a 'witness' more than a 1000 years old.

My other rider is that the speech is pre published and there is an immediate counter argument allowed without any restriction on the questioning of the 'witness'.

Come on fuukwits, bring it on. Give me your justifications that a family member can kill another family member for any reason other than self defense. Bring it on fuukwits, bring it on.

If your brother was to enact a terrorism attack that could cost thousands of lives, lets say a dirty bomb, would you kill him if that was the only path to stop him?

What on earth has THAT got to do with Freedom of SPEECH? Shocked

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Any day with a smile in it is a good day

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Stratos Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 4725	Re: freedom of speech or madness Reply #27 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:21am austranger wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:17am: If you could define a common "British" attitude to Aboriginals it would most likely be pity, not hatred. So all these were mercy killings or something? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres_of_Indigenous_Australians
Back to top	Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:24pm: Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act IP Logged

____

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #28 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:22am

austranger wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:17am:

The white australia policy was based on this british hatred of aboriginal culture.

Good grief, go and learn some history, the WAP was about immigration, and was "based" in the racial prejudice common across the entire planet at that time.
If you could define a common "British" attitude to Aboriginals it would most likely be pity, not hatred.

Go back then to the claim of terra nullius from the invading british christians ... british hatred of the aboriginal peoples.

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____

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Re: freedom of speech or madness
Reply #29 - Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:23am

austranger wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:21am:

____ wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:19am:

OldnCrusty wrote on Jun 25^th, 2014 at 9:15am:

What a typical 'storm in a tea cup'. The speech is titled "Honour Killings are Morally Justified" but the stated aim was "examining whether honour killings can be morally justified".

Personally I would love to hear some one try argue for the positive of "examining whether honour killings can be morally justified". I would dearly love to hear some one cite God as justification for killing another of God's living creatures, in any situation let alone without just cause or any process to establish a just cause.

My only rider they can only use provable justification and not rely on any belief system or the unverified words of a 'witness' more than a 1000 years old.

My other rider is that the speech is pre published and there is an immediate counter argument allowed without any restriction on the questioning of the 'witness'.

Come on fuukwits, bring it on. Give me your justifications that a family member can kill another family member for any reason other than self defense. Bring it on fuukwits, bring it on.

If your brother was to enact a terrorism attack that could cost thousands of lives, lets say a dirty bomb, would you kill him if that was the only path to stop him?

What on earth has THAT got to do with Freedom of SPEECH? Shocked

I was responding to the last paragraph of crusty's

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