Australian Politics Forum - Should taxpayer pay for private education?

freediver

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #225 - May 12^th, 2012 at 11:29am

Can you explain the mechanism?

You have not been arguing for 15 pages that it does not matter. You keep switching between arguing that you don't believe it and it doesn't matter. If we explain why it matters you say you don't believe it. If we explain why it is true you argue that it doesn't matter. Both of these aguments are fundamentally flawed, but you cannot stick to one of them for more than one post. All you can do is constantly change your mind about what your position is in an effort to avoid addressing the criticism of your argument.

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Soren

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #226 - May 12^th, 2012 at 11:48am

Annie Anthrax wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 11:13pm:

Soren wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 10:58pm:

Annie Anthrax wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 1:28pm:

Quote:

Throwing money won't change their genetic predisposition to intelligence. Throwing money at them won't make them want to learn.

Adequate resources will help everyone reach their full potential. That should be a basic right in a country like ours.

Look around the Lebs you know - do you think that state funding of education is holding them back and IF ONLY the state spent more on schools and teachers, they wouldn't be who they are?? They would be reading Italo Calvino and discoursing about the best way to get top marks in school and be useful in the community??

Take a trip out to any uni in Australia and see how many young Muslim women are getting an education.

Of course they couldn't read Calvino. That would be hypocritical of them.

Where did I advocate for more money to be spent?

"Adequate resources" is more money - or did you have more coal and iron ore in mind?

Everyone has the right to reach his full potential in this country. State funding of education is plentiful if you have a class room full of eager, motivated pupils.

Conversely, no additional resources will make the lazy and the grunty do better.

As for Muslims in education -I asked you to look around in your circle of Lebanese high achievers , like everyone else should look in their own circles, and tell me if anyone has been held back by lack of 'adequate resources' for state schools. (I didn't ask you to point out that Muslim girls and Lebo guys on campus stick out like a sore thumb because of their ridiculous garb.)

But this doesn't mean that creating the millau and the circumstances is entirely up to the state. A lot of people are held back by their own families, cultures or personal attitudes. No funding ill alter that.
As for Muslims in education, they seem a lot on campuses because they stick out like a sore thumb. Statistically

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Annie Anthrax

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #227 - May 12^th, 2012 at 11:58am

Soren wrote on May 12^th, 2012 at 11:48am:

"Adequate resources" is more money

I didn't say current resources are inadequate. I explained why they are important.

Quote:

State funding of education is plentiful if you have a class room full of eager, motivated pupils.

It is up to the teacher and the system to facilitate a good learning environment within the classroom. Eager, motivated pupils will only stay that way if they have a good teacher.

Quote:

As for Muslims in education -I asked you to look around in your circle of Lebanese high achievers , like everyone else should look in their own circles, and tell me if anyone has been held back by lack of 'adequate resources' for state schools.

No. They've all been very lucky and they're doing their best to reach their potential.

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Annie Anthrax Gold Member Offline Take the plan, spin it sideways Posts: 7057 Gender:	Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education? Reply #228 - May 12^th, 2012 at 12:00pm Quote: But this doesn't mean that creating the millau and the circumstances is entirely up to the state. A lot of people are held back by their own families, cultures or personal attitudes. I haven't argued differently.
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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #229 - May 12^th, 2012 at 12:00pm

freediver wrote on May 12^th, 2012 at 11:29am:

Can you explain the mechanism?

You have not been arguing for 15 pages that it does not matter. You keep switching between arguing that you don't believe it and it doesn't matter. If we explain why it matters you say you don't believe it. If we explain why it is true you argue that it doesn't matter. Both of these aguments are fundamentally flawed, but you cannot stick to one of them for more than one post. All you can do is constantly change your mind about what your position is in an effort to avoid addressing the criticism of your argument.

What mechanism?

I dont "change my mind" but basically (as i said in the last post and prolly several others already) the funding from the private schools can go towards the public schools to make them better. If it negatively impacts the private schools too bad they shouldn't be relying on govt funding and calling themselves private. If it costs a lil more to make the public schools it doesnt matter because its worth it to educate ALL children well rather than a select few.

SOB

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nairbe

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #230 - May 12^th, 2012 at 12:13pm

Soren wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 10:51pm:

nairbe wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 8:23pm:

Why would i pay tax so someone can send their child to Kings. we pay for public education if you want different pay for it.

They are paying more tax than you do, so they are not using any of your tax. PLUS they pay the fees for Kings.
What's your problem then?

They have freely chosen to move outside of the public system. Free country i am glad they have the choice and the wealth to pay for it. but they have chosen to be outside the public system so don't expect it to be paid for. Large sums of tax payers money goes to prop up what are predominately church schools, how about the church pay.

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freediver

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #231 - May 12^th, 2012 at 12:26pm

Quote:

What mechanism?

The one you claim to understand but it does not matter - whereby cutting funding to private schools has a negative impact on all students. I want you to explain it in your own words so we don't waste another 15 pages only to discover you still haven't even figured out what we are saying to you.

Note that this is the same approach I took with your argument.

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Soren

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #232 - May 12^th, 2012 at 12:30pm

Annie Anthrax wrote on May 12^th, 2012 at 11:58am:

Quote:

As for Muslims in education -I asked you to look around in your circle of Lebanese high achievers , like everyone else should look in their own circles, and tell me if anyone has been held back by lack of 'adequate resources' for state schools.

No. They've all been very lucky and they're doing their best to reach their potential.

Lucky??
Are you Chinese/Malaysian?

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #233 - May 12^th, 2012 at 12:36pm

freediver wrote on May 12^th, 2012 at 12:26pm:

Quote:

What mechanism?

The one you claim to understand but it does not matter - whereby cutting funding to private schools has a negative impact on all students. I want you to explain it in your own words so we don't waste another 15 pages only to discover you still haven't even figured out what we are saying to you.

Note that this is the same approach I took with your argument.

you completely ignored my post. Was that because you cant understand it?

SOB

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freediver

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #234 - May 12^th, 2012 at 12:40pm

I am not ignoring it. This is my response. Surely it is better to check whether you understand our argument than to try to come up with another way of explaining it. After all, you claim to understand it.

SOB can you demonstrate that you understand what people have been telling you for 16 pages about the negative consequences for both public and private school students?

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #235 - May 12^th, 2012 at 12:49pm

freediver wrote on May 12^th, 2012 at 12:40pm:

I am not ignoring it. This is my response. Surely it is better to check whether you understand our argument than to try to come up with another way of explaining it. After all, you claim to understand it.

SOB can you demonstrate that you understand what people have been telling you for 16 pages about the negative consequences for both public and private school students?

I am not going to explain your argument to you because its is invalid. It makes no difference if you think there will be too many students in public schools if some private schools close. It makes no difference if you think the current funding of private schools wouldn't cover the cost of assimilating the kids into public schools because the education of the public school kids is what is important not private school kids which have their own money. Its also stupid because private schools are crying for MORE money which means they dont have enough anyway and it would benefit public schools more .

whatever your "mechanism" is it has no bearing on reality.

SOB

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longweekend58

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #236 - May 12^th, 2012 at 1:48pm

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 12^th, 2012 at 11:20am:

freediver wrote on May 12^th, 2012 at 11:12am:

Quote:

The "negative consequences" will not be for ALL students. If there are negative consequences they will be for private school students.

SOB are you aware that we have been telling you for 15 pages that the negative consequences will be for public school students also, and that we have been explaining the mechanism, as well as providing evidence from the funding arrangements that support the argument?

Of course but i disagree. Are you aware that I have been telling you for 15 pages that it doesnt matter and public schools should be the focus of public money to make education better for more students?

SOB

In the world of borg 1+1=3. thats why explainingg that 1+1=2 elicits such an incomprehensible reply.

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longweekend58

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #237 - May 12^th, 2012 at 1:51pm

all borg wants is to punish private schools. that is the beginning and end of his argument. And it is hard to dismiss that summatino because it is the only thing that explains why he wants private schools to be denied funds and doesnt care one iota about the fallout from it.

He hates private schools.

the only other possible reason is that he is an imbecile and therfore logic and argument dont make sense to him.

either works.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #238 - May 12^th, 2012 at 1:56pm

longweekend58 wrote on May 12^th, 2012 at 1:51pm:

all borg wants is to punish private schools. that is the beginning and end of his argument. And it is hard to dismiss that summatino because it is the only thing that explains why he wants private schools to be denied funds and doesnt care one iota about the fallout from it.

He hates private schools.

the only other possible reason is that he is an imbecile and therfore logic and argument dont make sense to him.

either works.

Wow. You are a really pious xtian arent you. Look @ that "bearing false witness" and "loving thy neighbour" going on there. Woohoo!

SOB

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freediver

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #239 - May 12^th, 2012 at 2:57pm

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 12^th, 2012 at 12:49pm:

freediver wrote on May 12^th, 2012 at 12:40pm:

I am not ignoring it. This is my response. Surely it is better to check whether you understand our argument than to try to come up with another way of explaining it. After all, you claim to understand it.

SOB can you demonstrate that you understand what people have been telling you for 16 pages about the negative consequences for both public and private school students?

I am not going to explain your argument to you because its is invalid. It makes no difference if you think there will be too many students in public schools if some private schools close. It makes no difference if you think the current funding of private schools wouldn't cover the cost of assimilating the kids into public schools because the education of the public school kids is what is important not private school kids which have their own money. Its also stupid because private schools are crying for MORE money which means they dont have enough anyway and it would benefit public schools more .

whatever your "mechanism" is it has no bearing on reality.

SOB

Does it make a difference if the public school students end up worse off?

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Poll
Question: Should taxpayers money pay for private education ?
Yes 11 (35.5%) No 20 (64.5%) Total votes: 31 « Created by: Sir lastnail on: May 7^th, 2012 at 11:47am »