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31,000 signatures (Read 7676 times)
muso
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Re: 31,000 signatures
Reply #30 - Dec 11th, 2009 at 9:20am
 
How does it feel to be strung along by deliberate propaganda?

Which group do you think are most likely to be able to fund a mass brainwashing campaign?  The Energy companies or the Renewable Energy sector?
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Paella
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Re: 31,000 signatures
Reply #31 - Dec 21st, 2009 at 5:50pm
 
Grendel, I suggest that you at least go to the trouble of looking up the Oregon Petition on Wikipedia before you hold yourself out as such an expert on it. Whilst there, see if you can find out how many of these "scientists" are pharmacists, GPs, civil engineers etc. Also, see if you can count the Greenpeace activists who have signed it to prove that you don't need t be a scientist at all to get your name on it. But never mind, you're the last in long, long list of people who have embarrassed themselves by quoting the Oregon petition.

It seems you haven't learned much since the days that you assured us that David Hicks was going to wreak havoc within hours of his release. Still waiting on that one, too.
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pjb05
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Re: 31,000 signatures
Reply #32 - Dec 21st, 2009 at 7:07pm
 
Paella wrote on Dec 21st, 2009 at 5:50pm:
Grendel, I suggest that you at least go to the trouble of looking up the Oregon Petition on Wikipedia before you hold yourself out as such an expert on it. Whilst there, see if you can find out how many of these "scientists" are pharmacists, GPs, civil engineers etc. Also, see if you can count the Greenpeace activists who have signed it to prove that you don't need t be a scientist at all to get your name on it. But never mind, you're the last in long, long list of people who have embarrassed themselves by quoting the Oregon petition.



On the subject of Wikipedia it would appear that it is not an impartial observer on this issue:

How Wikipedia’s green doctor rewrote 5,428 climate articles

By Lawrence Solomon

T he Climategate Emails describe how a small band of climatologists cooked the books to make the last century seem dangerously warm.

The emails also describe how the band plotted to rewrite history as well as science, particularly by eliminating the Medieval Warm Period, a 400 year period that began around 1000 AD.

The Climategate Emails reveal something else, too: the enlistment of the most widely read source of information in the world — Wikipedia — in the wholesale rewriting of this history.

The Medieval Warm Period, which followed the meanness and cold of the Dark Ages, was a great time in human history — it allowed humans around the world to bask in a glorious warmth that vastly improved agriculture, increased life spans and otherwise bettered the human condition.

But the Medieval Warm Period was not so great for some humans in our own time — the same small band that believes the planet has now entered an unprecedented and dangerous warm period. As we now know from the Climategate Emails, this band saw the Medieval Warm Period as an enormous obstacle in their mission of spreading the word about global warming. If temperatures were warmer 1,000 years ago than today, the Climategate Emails explain in detail, their message that we now live in the warmest of all possible times would be undermined. As put by one band member, a Briton named Folland at the Hadley Centre, a Medieval Warm Period “dilutes the message rather significantly.”

Even before the Climategate Emails came to light, the problem posed by the Medieval Warm Period to this band was known. “We have to get rid of the Medieval Warm Period” read a pre-Climategate email, circa 1995, as attested to at hearings of the U.S. Senate Committee on Environment & Public Works. But the Climategate transcripts were more extensive and more illuminating — they provided an unvarnished look at the struggles that the climate practitioners underwent before settling on their scientific dogma.

The Climategate Emails showed, for example, that some members of the band were uncomfortable with aspects of their work, some even questioning the need to erase the existence of the Medieval Warm Period 1,000 years earlier.

Said Briffa, one of their chief practitioners: “I know there is pressure to present a nice tidy story as regards ‘apparent unprecedented warming in a thousand years or more in the proxy data’ but in reality the situation is not quite so simple. … I believe that the recent warmth was probably matched about 1,000 years ago.” 

In the end, Briffa and other members of the band overcame their doubts and settled on their dogma. With the help of the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, the highest climate change authority of all, they published what became the icon of their movement — the hockey stick graph. This icon showed temperatures in the last 1,000 years to have been stable — no Medieval Warm Period, not even the Little Ice Age of a few centuries ago.

But the UN’s official verdict that the Medieval Warm Period had not existed did not erase the countless schoolbooks, encyclopedias, and other scholarly sources that claimed it had. Rewriting those would take decades, time that the band members didn’t have if they were to save the globe from warming.

Instead, the band members turned to their friends in the media and to the blogosphere, creating a website called RealClimate.org. “The idea is that we working climate scientists should have a place where we can mount a rapid response to supposedly ‘bombshell’ papers that are doing the rounds” in aid of “combating dis-information,” one email explained, referring to criticisms of the hockey stick and anything else suggesting that temperatures today were not the hottest in recorded time. One person in the nine-member Realclimate.org team — U.K. scientist and Green Party activist William Connolley — would take on particularly crucial duties.

Connolley took control of all things climate in the most used information source the world has ever known – Wikipedia. Starting in February 2003, just when opposition to the claims of the band members were beginning to gel, Connolley set to work on the Wikipedia site. He rewrote Wikipedia’s articles on global warming, on the greenhouse effect, on the instrumental temperature record, on the urban heat island, on climate models, on global cooling. On Feb. 14, he began to erase the Little Ice Age; on Aug.11, the Medieval Warm Period. In October, he turned his attention to the hockey stick graph. He rewrote articles on the politics of global warming and on the scientists who were skeptical of the band.
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pjb05
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Re: 31,000 signatures
Reply #33 - Dec 21st, 2009 at 7:08pm
 
Richard Lindzen and Fred Singer, two of the world’s most distinguished climate scientists, were among his early targets, followed by others that the band especially hated, such as Willie Soon and Sallie Baliunas of the Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics, authorities on the Medieval Warm Period.

All told, Connolley created or rewrote 5,428 unique Wikipedia articles. His control over Wikipedia was greater still, however, through the role he obtained at Wikipedia as a website administrator, which allowed him to act with virtual impunity. When Connolley didn’t like the subject of a certain article, he removed it — more than 500 articles of various descriptions disappeared at his hand. When he disapproved of the arguments that others were making, he often had them barred — over 2,000 Wikipedia contributors who ran afoul of him found themselves blocked from making further contributions. Acolytes whose writing conformed to Connolley’s global warming views, in contrast, were rewarded with Wikipedia’s blessings. In these ways, Connolley turned Wikipedia into the missionary wing of the global warming movement.

The Medieval Warm Period disappeared, as did criticism of the global warming orthodoxy. With the release of the Climategate Emails, the disappearing trick has been exposed. The glorious Medieval Warm Period will remain in the history books, perhaps with an asterisk to describe how a band of zealots once tried to make it disappear.


Read more: http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fpcomment/archive/2009/12/19/lawrence-solomon-wikipedia-s-climate-doctor.aspx#ixzz0aJROZ7dS
The Financial Post is now on Facebook. Join our fan community today.
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mozzaok
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Re: 31,000 signatures
Reply #34 - Dec 21st, 2009 at 7:35pm
 
Blahh, more denialist garbage.
Go back to claiming 9/11 was an inside job, or that AIDS is a big con, or that vaccinations cause autism, or sids, or whatever spurious claim you want.
We know there are scientists who agree with all of those things, they have a name;
"Ratbags"
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OOPS!!! My Karma, ran over your Dogma!
 
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Tom
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Re: 31,000 signatures
Reply #35 - Dec 21st, 2009 at 10:34pm
 
mozzoak you're responses are just infuriating.  Are you here just to crush any argument you don't like with your idiotic ranting?  Stop trying to intimidate other members of this forum.

Actually prove them wrong for once?  Can you manage it?  So far you havn't come close so it might take a little work.
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Paella
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Re: 31,000 signatures
Reply #36 - Dec 21st, 2009 at 11:12pm
 
I agree Wikipedia is no credible authority on the issue. Wikipedia is no credible authority for anything. My point is that Grendel did not even bother to attempt any sort of Cursory check, even a Wikipedia check, before getting sucked in by the Oregon petition. Grendel is usually quite fond of quoting wikipedia as an authority.

By the way, during the so called "medieval warming period", which I personally believe, assuming the data is accurate, WAS probably something MORE than a normal statistical variation, it was a lot cooler than it is now.

But please don't bother debating me on this. I do not debate evolution with born again Christians, I do not debate whether smoking causes lung cancer with tobacco lobbyists, and I don't debate global warming with climate change skeptics.  
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muso
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Re: 31,000 signatures
Reply #37 - Dec 22nd, 2009 at 8:44am
 
pjb05 wrote on Dec 21st, 2009 at 7:08pm:
Richard Lindzen and Fred Singer, two of the world’s most distinguished climate scientists, were among his early targets, followed by others that the band especially hated, such as Willie Soon and Sallie Baliunas of the Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics, authorities on the Medieval Warm Period.



Distinguished?

Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

Sorry, but I'm not going to waste my time on debunking that motley group. You forgot to mention 'Lord' Christopher Monckton.
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muso
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Re: 31,000 signatures
Reply #38 - Dec 22nd, 2009 at 2:13pm
 
Paella wrote on Dec 21st, 2009 at 11:12pm:
By the way, during the so called "medieval warming period", which I personally believe, assuming the data is accurate, WAS probably something MORE than a normal statistical variation, it was a lot cooler than it is now.
 


We could argue that point until the cows come home. Basically we're talking proxy data. The best (most complete, most representative)  proxy data we have is from Law Dome, using the Deuterium proxy. This shows a dip around 1500 to 1800 for the Little Ice Age. This is matched by a corresponding dip in CO2 readings.

As you quite rightly point out, the Medieval Warm Period is generally understood to be a regional effect.

Global temperature proxy records show that taken globally, the Earth may have been slightly cooler (by 0.03 degrees Celsius) during the 'Medieval Warm Period' than in the early- and mid-20th century, and was down about 0.4 degrees on more recent global temperatures.

Also from the IPCC TAR 2001:

Quote:
current evidence does not support globally synchronous periods of anomalous cold or warmth over this time frame, and the conventional terms of 'Little Ice Age' and 'Medieval Warm Period' appear to have limited utility in describing trends in hemispheric or global mean temperature changes in past centuries



Ref: How Warm Was the Medieval Warm Period? Thomas J. Crowley and Thomas S. Lowery Ambio, Vol. 29, No. 1 (Feb., 2000), pp. 51-54

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