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Toleration (Read 184 times)
Frank
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Toleration
Jul 13th, 2025 at 12:59pm
 
In an essay called “The Self-Poisoning of the Open Society,” Kolakowski dilates on this basic antinomy of liberalism. Liberalism implies openness to other points of view, even (it would seem) those points of view whose success would destroy liberalism. But tolerance to those points of view is a prescription for suicide. Intolerance betrays the fundamental premise of liberalism, i.e., openness. As Robert Frost once put it, a liberal is someone who refuses to take his own part in an argument.

Kolakowski is surely right that our liberal, pluralist democracy depends for its survival not only on the continued existence of its institutions, but also “on a belief in their value and a widespread will to defend them.” The question is: Do we, as a society, still enjoy that belief? Do we possess the requisite will? Or was François Revel right when he said that “Democratic civilization is the first in history to blame itself because another power is trying to destroy it”?

..
The “openness” that liberal society rightly cherishes is not a vacuous openness to all points of view: it is not “value neutral.” It need not, indeed it cannot, say Yes to all comers, to the Islamofascist who after all has his point of view, just as much as the soccer mom, who has hers. American democracy, for example, affords its citizens great latitude, but great latitude is not synonymous with the proposition that “anything goes.”
https://newcriterion.com/article/after-the-suicide-of-the-west/



It is not 'phobic' to oppose and resist certain views, values and practices.
Not tolerating certain views and practices that are antithetical to a humane, enlightened society is not itself intolerance. It is an intellectiual, political immune system An immune system that does not detect and protect against destructive incursioins is defective.
A pseudo-liberal outlook that does not detect and protect against destructive incursiions of ideology is likewise a defective, suicidal outlook.
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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.
 
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Brian Ross
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Re: Toleration
Reply #1 - Jul 13th, 2025 at 9:18pm
 
Twilight Zone.  Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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It seems that I have upset a Moderator and are forbidden from using memes. So much for Freedom of Speech. Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
WWW  
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Frank
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Re: Toleration
Reply #2 - Jul 13th, 2025 at 9:21pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jul 13th, 2025 at 9:18pm:
Twilight Zone.  Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Oh, look!!

He's reasoning! He KNOWS what he's talking about! Look!!

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Jasin
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Re: Toleration
Reply #3 - Jul 14th, 2025 at 10:00am
 
I see it. I see it. His reasoning is like a krill who thinks it's as big as a whale.
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Dnarever
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Re: Toleration
Reply #4 - Jul 14th, 2025 at 10:41am
 
You know that at the top of that list of destructive incursions of ideology would sit Trumpism and the MAGA extremism?

The article isn't much more than word salad. It is built on false premise on top of false premise.

Logic needs a valid starting point in order to reach a valid conclusion.
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Frank
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Re: Toleration
Reply #5 - Jul 14th, 2025 at 11:02am
 
Dnarever wrote on Jul 14th, 2025 at 10:41am:
You know that at the top of that list of destructive incursions of ideology would sit Trumpism and the MAGA extremism?

The article isn't much more than word salad. It is built on false premise on top of false premise.

Logic needs a valid starting point in order to reach a valid conclusion.

Well, give us a better outline than Kolakowski's.

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Yadda
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Re: Toleration
Reply #6 - Jul 15th, 2025 at 4:14pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jul 13th, 2025 at 9:18pm:

Twilight Zone.  Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes Roll Eyes



brian's....default response to intellectual stimulation....from another living soul.



brian is......intellectually, impotent.


Yadda said.....
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1417591610/93#93


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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Yadda
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Re: Toleration
Reply #7 - Jul 15th, 2025 at 4:48pm
 

Re OP subject.....



On each trip into town, we passed, what seemed a large, strong, and majestic tree,
growing on the verge of the road.

We notice this tree, standing there, as a way-marker, day after day, and year after year.

A large, strong, and majestic looking tree.



Then a strong storm came through our area.

And on our next trip into town, we noticed, that large tree, laying flat on the ground.

A seeming victim of the passing storm.

We stopped to inspect the tree, and on close inspection, we noticed that the tree suffered a considerable white ant infestation, through the section of tree that had 'failed'.

So, we reasoned that it probably was not the storm alone,
which had caused that seemingly strong tree to fall.

In fact it was the weakness [when a strong wind came], present in that large, seemingly 'strong' tree, which had 'defeated' it.



.



"The problems we face today exist because the people who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living."
- ?


A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government.
It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury.
From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.
The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.
These nations have progressed through this sequence:
From bondage to spiritual faith;
From spiritual faith to great courage;
From courage to liberty;
From liberty to abundance;
From abundance to selfishness;
From selfishness to apathy;
From apathy to dependence;
From dependence back into bondage.
- Alexander Fraser Tytler (1747-1813)


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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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