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The fallacy of the Greens (Read 67626 times)

thegreatdivide

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #540 - May 20^th, 2023 at 4:56pm

lee wrote on May 20^th, 2023 at 1:48pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on May 20^th, 2023 at 11:15am:

...like the c. 10% living in poverty in Oz, while you have your head up your a*rs.

So once again it is feelings not facts. "relatively poor" is relative and not the same as poverty.

Both are unsupportable, but you are comfortable....

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BTW you misspelt a*se. Roll Eyes

Thanks.

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You are trying to tell the Chinese? How is that going? Grin

Hopefully better than with the dead-heads in our own central bank and treasury; a recent report in Global Times suggests the PBofC understand the real economy need not be constrained by fake 'debt' issues.

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Yes I do. But you still can't offer proof. Perhaps you don't have google. Roll Eyes

priceless; Ozpol is good for a laugh sometimes.

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So the Marxist countries only did it for love? Grin

Marx said: "workers of the world, unite"; but the bosses remained greedy....

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And yet you said all they had to do was put the solar panels "up in the air". Wind blown sand up to 1,000m and more would suggest that the notion is foolish; but you KNOW better. Grin

Ok I'll get you a proper job, cleaning the panels after a dust-storm.

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Ross Garnaut, definitely an economist, definitely not an engineer. Grin

Already had that argument re Steve Keen. btw the engineers are roaring to go in the OZ hot deserts; see the huge Sun Cable project. As usual, the barrier is fake debt concerns, not engineering. So the issue is finding the right deserts conditions around the world.

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Ah. See what happens when you explain exactly what you mean. So with free money everything is free? Don't need workers then. Roll Eyes

See what happens when blind TINA ideology cripples the capacity for rational analysis?

Only the essentials (which you kindly listed, with some omissions) should be paid for by the currency-issuing government; workers are always needed. Don't worry, you don't have the IQ to understand the difference - or more likely, your thinking is clouded by delusional ideology and ignorance of how money is created.

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Nope. Now you are talking about MMT again. You do get sidetracked easily. Grin

Dementia: you claimed I "want everthing for free", in response to my assertion central banks can fund essentials for "free".

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You haven't said anything about paying for goods, except of course to say it is all the capitalists fault for making people (and Countries) pay interest.

Making the currency-issuing govt. pay interest is the problem; "people" get themselves into debt as they choose , but requiring currency-issuing govts. to tax or borrow (by issuing debt) in order to spend IS the problem.

Listen Up : currency issuing govts can purchase whatever (goods and services) are available for sale in the nation's currency, without taxing or borrowing. Such governments have to balance supply of and demand for available resoures, not money or 'balanced budgets'.

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Your great hope China isn't doing it, and no they are not constrained by the IMF, World Bank or anyone else. Roll Eyes

The IMF ('Instant Misery Fund') and World Bank are overseeing a debt crises among poorer nations around the world, and blaming China...while the US is close to imploding because of fake debt concerns.

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lee

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #541 - May 20^th, 2023 at 6:10pm

thegreatdivide wrote on May 20^th, 2023 at 4:56pm:

Both are unsupportable, but you are comfortable....

You have absolutely no idea of my circumstances. I have super, a part old age pension and a small invalidity pension. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 20^th, 2023 at 4:56pm:

Hopefully better than with the dead-heads in our own central bank and treasury; a recent report in Global Times suggests the PBofC understand the real economy need not be constrained by fake 'debt' issues.

So no progress yet. I see you didn't link the article. Wink

thegreatdivide wrote on May 20^th, 2023 at 4:56pm:

priceless; Ozpol is good for a laugh sometimes.

And once again you show you don't have proof. Grin

thegreatdivide wrote on May 20^th, 2023 at 4:56pm:

Marx said: "workers of the world, unite"; but the bosses remained greedy....

now that is funny. Grin

.thegreatdivide wrote on May 20^th, 2023 at 4:56pm:

Ok I'll get you a proper job, cleaning the panels after a dust-storm.

Don't forget these are well paying jobs. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 20^th, 2023 at 4:56pm:

Already had that argument re Steve Keen. btw the engineers are roaring to go in the OZ hot deserts; see the huge Sun Cable project.

The Sun Cable project is running out of legs. Maybe they can use yours. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 20^th, 2023 at 4:56pm:

Blaming China? For allowing the poor countries to borrow or IMF, World Bank refusing them credit, except for "approved green projects", that you don't want China to use? Roll Eyes

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thegreatdivide

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #542 - May 22^nd, 2023 at 12:27pm

lee wrote on May 20^th, 2023 at 6:10pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on May 20^th, 2023 at 4:56pm:

Both are unsupportable, but you are comfortable....

You have absolutely no idea of my circumstances. I have super, a part old age pension and a small invalidity pension. Roll Eyes

Only a part pension? Obviously your financial circumstances are comfortable (assuming you own your own house).

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So no progress yet. I see you didn't link the article. Wink

The article was a week ago. Note: deluded Western "debt" fetishists have been predicting China's collapse for a decade....while gdp per capita has doubled.

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And once again you show you don't have proof. Grin

Take it from me: I have google.

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now that is funny. Grin

Any time..

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Don't forget these are well paying jobs. Roll Eyes

No.. above poverty (minimum wage) jobs; but don't worry, a properly functional government will be able to subsidize your necessities....

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The Sun Cable project is running out of legs.

because of a dispute between two profit-seeking 'titans of industry'. It should be a public sector project.

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Blaming China?

That's what YOU - and the IMF - are doing, did you forget?

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For allowing the poor countries to borrow

Poor countries ought to be given the support they need, not saddled with unapayable IMF debt. As for China's BRI, it is an offer of Chinese know-how to develop infrastructure in poor countries, on terms agreeable to both parties. Like I said, I'm trying the show the CCP how it can achieve this vital outcome without getting bogged down in fake 'debt' issues, given the Instant Misery Fund (IMF) and the World' Bank are a total waste of time.

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or IMF, World Bank refusing them credit, except for "approved green projects",

Poor countries need free credit for all necessary infrastructure.

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that you don't want China to use? Roll Eyes

I want China to transition to renewables ASAP, but China too is fiddling around with carbon taxes...

Notice I had to break your original paragraph into its many confused separate elements, to make some sense out of it....

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lee

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #543 - May 22^nd, 2023 at 2:00pm

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 12:27pm:

Only a part pension? Obviously your financial circumstances are comfortable (assuming you own your own house).

Ah assumptions, assumptions. Grin

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 12:27pm:

The article was a week ago. Note: deluded Western "debt" fetishists have been predicting China's collapse for a decade....while gdp per capita has doubled.

And still doubling down on coal. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 12:27pm:

Take it from me: I have google.

But you can't provide proof of ff causing anything, else you would post it. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 12:27pm:

No.. above poverty (minimum wage) jobs; but don't worry, a properly functional government will be able to subsidize your necessities....

But all the renewables "experts" say high paying jobs. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 12:27pm:

because of a dispute between two profit-seeking 'titans of industry'. It should be a public sector project.

I'd rather private capital do it. They canpobviously afford it.

"Sun Cable – considered to be the world’s biggest renewable energy export project – announced[1] this week it had entered voluntary administration following[2] “the absence of alignment” with shareholders. "

"Commentators have suggested the apparent disagreement is a reflection on the commercial and technical viability of the project itself. Matthew Warren, former chief executive of the Australian Energy Council, went so far as to describe[18] Sun Cable as “a quiet running joke inside the electricity industry” and that it:

reflected the ignorance, egos and quest for notoriety of its proponents rather than the needs of its prospective customers."

"Sun Cable is obviously a very ambitious project. Yet much too little information is publicly available to pronounce, with any certainty, on its commercial and technical viability. "

https://www.thetimes.com.au/world/19603-the-a$30-billion-sun-cable-crash-is-a-se...

Oops

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 12:27pm:

That's what YOU - and the IMF - are doing, did you forget?

What have I blamed China for. Be specific. Human rights abuses? Yep. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 12:27pm:

So still not going well. Maybe you should get Steve Keen on the job. Grin

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 12:27pm:

Poor countries need free credit for all necessary infrastructure.

But they won't give it for non-renewable power. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 12:27pm:

I want China to transition to renewables ASAP, but China too is fiddling around with carbon taxes...

So sad for you that are not listening to you. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 12:27pm:

Notice I had to break your original paragraph into its many confused separate elements, to make some sense out of it....

Only because you don't understand complex paragraphs. Roll Eyes

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thegreatdivide

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #544 - May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm

lee wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 2:00pm:

Ah assumptions, assumptions. Grin

"Cut off for full pension,

Single: Homeowner $280,000 Non-homeowner $504,500.

.. half a million bucks....

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And still doubling down on coal. Roll Eyes

Yes, in order to double gdp per capita again, to attain developed status ASAP, while transitioning to renewables ASAP (already explained to you...)

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But you can't provide proof of ff causing anything, else you would post it. Roll Eyes

Already did many times, as archived in this thread; your crippled brain doesn't accept what everyone else knows (including google).

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But all the renewables "experts" say high paying jobs. Roll Eyes

They are referring to all the jobs in construction and design, not suitable for low IQ people like yourself...pity about that.

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I'd rather private capital do it. They canpobviously afford it.

But being greedy, they fight among themselves, so nothing gets done...

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"Sun Cable – considered to be the world’s biggest renewable energy export project – announced[1] this week it had entered voluntary administration following[2] “the absence of alignment” with shareholders. "

"Commentators have suggested the apparent disagreement is a reflection on the commercial and technical viability of the project itself. Matthew Warren, former chief executive of the Australian Energy Council, went so far as to describe[18] Sun Cable as “a quiet running joke inside the electricity industry” and that it:
reflected the ignorance, egos and quest for notoriety of its proponents rather than the needs of its prospective customers."

Thanks for making my argument. As for "commentators have suggested" ...that is meaningless waffle by ff proponents.

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"Sun Cable is obviously a very ambitious project. Yet much too little information is publicly available to pronounce, with any certainty, on its commercial and technical viability. "

Er 10 PV panels on a roof, or millions in a desert farm...all the same technology.

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https://www.thetimes.com.au/world/19603-the-a$30-billion-sun-cable-crash-is-a-se...

Oops

Oops? Again you are arguing against yourself. "doesn-t-spell-the-end"...

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What have I blamed China for. Be specific. Human rights abuses? Yep. Roll Eyes

Which is hypocritical Western garbage; check out conditions in some black communities in Oz...

"poverty is the worst form of violence": Gandhi.

Whereas I want China to drop any connection to obsolete Western monetary orthodoxy.

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So still not going well. Maybe you should get Steve Keen on the job. Grin

I'll see what I can do....

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But they won't give it for non-renewable power.

The IMF won't give ANYTHING for ANYTHING, without burdensome debt repayments, masquerading as 'debt' relief'. The Chinese at least create beneficial infrastructure in poor countries.

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So sad for you that are not listening to you. Roll Eyes

Sad for the world, too. Remains to be seen how dysfunctional the global economy will become, while greedy private financiers deny currency-issuing governments the ability to finance public policy, resulting in poor nations being strangled by the IMF.

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Only because you don't understand complex paragraphs. Roll Eyes

Obvious idiocy; each element in it was wrong as I showed, so there's no way the totality could be correct.

« Last Edit: May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:10pm by thegreatdivide »

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lee

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #545 - May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:44pm

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

"Cut off for full pension,

Single: Homeowner $280,000 Non-homeowner $504,500.

.. half a million bucks....

That's the assets test dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

Yes, in order to double gdp per capita again, to attain developed status ASAP, while transitioning to renewables ASAP (already explained to you...)

So CO2 reduction is definitely not urgent. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

Already did many times, as archived in this thread; your crippled brain doesn't accept what everyone else knows (including google).

Nope. You made claims and they didn't mention Fossil Fuels. You made claims about pm2.5 that weren't based, in your terms, "real world data" because it was from statistical studies. No autopsies. You are a complete failure. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

They are referring to all the jobs in construction and design, not suitable for low IQ people like yourself...pity about that.

So those many highly skilled jobs aren't. Just a few. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

But being greedy, they fight among themselves, so nothing gets done...

Nope. They could go it alone. I mean everyone says it is so cheap. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

Thanks for making my argument. As for "commentators have suggested" ...that is meaningless waffle by ff proponents.

You highlighted the wrong bit.

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

"Commentators have suggested the apparent disagreement is a reflection on the commercial and technical viability of the project itself.

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

Er 10 PV panels on a roof, or millions in a desert farm...all the same technology.

Yes it is. With more of the restrictions. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

Oops? Again you are arguing against yourself. "doesn-t-spell-the-end"...

And it doesn't show any proof of concept at scale. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

Which is hypocritical Western garbage; check out conditions in some black communities in Oz...

Yeah. Remote communities where they bash teachers, health workers etc. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

I'll see what I can do....

The Green dream LIVES. Grin

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

The IMF won't give ANYTHING for ANYTHING, without burdensome debt repayments, masquerading as 'debt' relief'. The Chinese at least create beneficial infrastructure in poor countries.

Ah yes. "China’s ‘debt-trap diplomacy’ is about to challenge Papua New Guinea — and Australia"

and others. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

And the green blob on the path to nut zero. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

Obvious idiocy; each element in it was wrong as I showed, so there's no way the totality could be correct.

Nope. Your confirmation bias showed that. Roll Eyes

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thegreatdivide

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #546 - May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:13pm

lee wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:44pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 6:00pm:

"Cut off for full pension,

Single: Homeowner $280,000 Non-homeowner $504,500.

.. half a million bucks....

That's the assets test dummy. Roll Eyes

And you have too much in 'assets' to get the full pension

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So CO2 reduction is definitely not urgent. Roll Eyes

Both urgent, unlike in Oz which only has to deal with emissions reduction ASAP (since Oz is already wealthy) to maximise emissions reductions as part of a global effort, ASAP

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Nope.

Dementia, just to remind you this debate has progressed for more than a year. Try googling ffs and injury to health.

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So those many highly skilled jobs aren't. Just a few. Roll Eyes

Actually there are many well-paid jobs, for several decades, if governments piss the private sector off and pull their fingers out....NOW.

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Nope. They could go it alone. I mean everyone says it is so cheap. Roll Eyes

...if, as the private sector wants, the public fund the new grid and storage...say $40 trillion.....

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You highlighted the wrong bit.

Sorry to derail your emphasis, there is no technical barrier to establishing millions of PV panels.

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And it doesn't show any proof of concept at scale. Roll Eyes

Er.. if pv=1, 100pv = 100...oh, never mnd.

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Yeah. Remote communities where they bash teachers, health workers etc. Roll Eyes

owing to dysfuncytional communities mired in systemic poverty ie poverty entrenched by the state aka 'human rights' abuse: "poverty is the word form of violence" ( practiced by the state) : Gandhi

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The Green dream LIVES. Grin

You must be having a hard time watching the news lately, even the Italy floods are caused by climate change, the people say.

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Ah yes. "China’s ‘debt-trap diplomacy’ is about to challenge Papua New Guinea — and Australia"

and others. Roll Eyes

Show me ANYTHING produced by the US-led BRI-rival aka B3W...which has disappeard without trace while the Repubs are too busy cutting the US budget, forget investment in the rest of the world

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And the green blob on the path to nut zero. Roll Eyes

The world will be cleaner, greener, with affordable energy for eveyone.

Quote:

Nope. Your confirmation bias showed that. Roll Eyes

Nothing to do with all the wrong bits in your paragraph, unless you can show my error in each case.

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lee

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #547 - May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:57pm

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:13pm:

And you have too much in 'assets' to get the full pension

Wrong again, dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:13pm:

Both urgent, unlike in Oz which only has to deal with emissions reduction ASAP (since Oz is already wealthy) to maximise emissions reductions as part of a global effort, ASAP

Urgent, according to one IPCC report is 3 years, not 2035. So according to China not urgent. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:13pm:

Try googling ffs and injury to health.

Then why can't you find any? Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:13pm:

Actually there are many well-paid jobs, for several decades, if governments piss the private sector off and pull their fingers out....NOW.

Rubbish. Just like your MMT that even economists can't agree on its efficacy. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:13pm:

..if, as the private sector wants, the public fund the new grid and storage...say $40 trillion.....

The public doesn't know the full extent of the costs and pitfalls. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:13pm:

Sorry to derail your emphasis, there is no technical barrier to establishing millions of PV panels.

Just the cleaning of them, replacement of them; dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:13pm:

Er.. if pv=1, 100pv = 100...oh, never mnd.

And increased scale causes increased costs, dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:13pm:

owing to dysfuncytional communities mired in systemic poverty ie poverty entrenched by the state aka 'human rights' abuse: "poverty is the word form of violence" ( practiced by the state) : Gandhi

And yet you talk about relatively poor; which is not poverty, dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:13pm:

You must be having a hard time watching the news lately, even the Italy floods are caused by climate change, the people say.

Ah people. The great uneducated "people", dummy. Roll Eyes

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thegreatdivide

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #548 - May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:32pm

lee wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 10:57pm:

......

And you have too much in 'assets' to get the full pension.

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Wrong again, dummy. Roll Eyes

So you are poor, on a part pension..I suggest you see a finacial adviser.

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Urgent, according to one IPCC report is 3 years, not 2035. So according to China not urgent. Dummy. Roll Eyes

not urgent to deniers in the West despite the fact they are rich enough to urgently transition.

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Then why can't you find any? Dummy. Roll Eyes

Already have, archived in this thread. I don't repeat time-wasting exercises for deniers like you.

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Rubbish. Just like your MMT that even economists can't agree on its efficacy. Dummy. Roll Eyes

"Rubbish" is the capacity of your crippled conservative brain. As for MMT, recognition of the need for revolutionary change in economic orthodoxy is rapidly growing around the world (except for blind comfortable ideologues like you - who says he isn't comfortable on part pension; spend some money and you can get the full pension....)

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The public doesn't know the full extent of the costs and pitfalls. Dummy. Roll Eyes

They know it will 'cost' a lot, while foolishly hoping the private sector will fund the transition..

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Just the cleaning of them, replacement of them; dummy. Roll Eyes

No, that's a job for low IQ people like yourself; don't worry you won't be living in poverty, like the unemployed are now.

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...costs...

No, resources which we won't run out of.

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And yet you talk about relatively poor; which is not poverty, dummy. Roll Eyes

You are richer than 600 million people in China.

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Ah people. The great uneducated "people", dummy. Roll Eyes

Inclduding reps of all UN member states, and the IPCC...

« Last Edit: May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:39pm by thegreatdivide »

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lee

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #549 - May 23^rd, 2023 at 5:23pm

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:32pm:

And you have too much in 'assets' to get the full pension.

Nope. There is also the "income" test, which has nothing to do with the asset base. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:32pm:

So you are poor, on a part pension..I suggest you see a finacial adviser.

Oh. I thought you were the full book on economic stuff. A financial advisor can't help on the income test. dummy.

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:32pm:

not urgent to deniers in the West despite the fact they are rich enough to urgently transition.

It is not urgent to anyone. You can't even point to anything than a blanket "denier" label.Such a dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:32pm:

Already have, archived in this thread. I don't repeat time-wasting exercises for deniers like you.

Already didn't. Each of your "arguments" got shot down. dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:32pm:

As for MMT, recognition of the need for revolutionary change in economic orthodoxy is rapidly growing around the world (except for blind comfortable ideologues like you - who says he isn't comfortable on part pension; spend some money and you can get the full pension....)

Except for mainstream economists. Which says a lot about your "knowledge". dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:32pm:

They know it will 'cost' a lot, while foolishly hoping the private sector will fund the transition..

OOh a lot? How many zeroes in "a lot", dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:32pm:

No, that's a job for low IQ people like yourself; don't worry you won't be living in poverty, like the unemployed are now.

How noble. I guess you see yourself as one of the upper group, dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:32pm:

No, resources which we won't run out of.

Which resources would they be? Where is this fabled cornucopia? dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:32pm:

You are richer than 600 million people in China.

And again nothing to do with poverty. dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 22^nd, 2023 at 11:32pm:

Inclduding reps of all UN member states, and the IPCC...

Oh the UN? You mean like Figueres ""This is probably the most difficult task we have ever given ourselves, which is to intentionally transform the economic development model, for the first time in human history", Ms Figueres stated at a press conference in Brussels."

Or perhaps the Canadian Maurice Strong who got the UN into the climate business. The bloke who fled to China to escape prosecution. Dummy Roll Eyes

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thegreatdivide

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #550 - May 24^th, 2023 at 11:52am

lee wrote on May 23^rd, 2023 at 5:23pm:

Oh. I thought you were the full book on economic stuff. A financial advisor can't help on the income test. dummy.

so your income is too large for a full pension, and you are claiming you are poor... greedy, no?.....

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It is not urgent to anyone.

It's urgent to the UN, IPCC, developed and developing countries alike: yet we see a greedy fellow like you not making allowances for the differences in nations' wealth.

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Already didn't. Each of your "arguments" got shot down. dummy. Roll Eyes

Being "shot down" by a greedy, blind, conservative climate/polluting-ff denier is an oxymoron.

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Except for mainstream economists. Which says a lot about your "knowledge". dummy. Roll Eyes

Nah.. mainstreamers are only responding to where their bread is buttered, ie by "research grants" funded by the elite money-managers, not by any true understanding of money.

Listen up : money is created out of nothing.

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OOh a lot? How many zeroes in "a lot", dummy. Roll Eyes

Irrelevant: money is created out of nothing; the real issue is to make sure the money which the government needs to create is matched by the resources it wants to purchase, regardless of how many zeros in that quantity of money.

Keep up this debate, and you will eventually learn about the nature of money/what it is.

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How noble. I guess you see yourself as one of the upper group, dummy. Roll Eyes

"Life isn't fair" - a well-known conservative refrain; but be thankful I'm offering you an above poverty job commensurate with your abilties, something your gruesome mainstreamers won't offer you - the best they can offer is the below-poverty dole.

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Which resources would they be? Where is this fabled cornucopia? dummy. Roll Eyes

All the resources required to transition to a green economy.

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And again nothing to do with poverty. dummy. Roll Eyes

Says the greedy conservative complaining about life on a part pension.

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That UN, plus the UN which all nations are signed up to....

« Last Edit: May 24^th, 2023 at 3:05pm by thegreatdivide »

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lee

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #551 - May 24^th, 2023 at 10:51pm

thegreatdivide wrote on May 24^th, 2023 at 11:52am:

so your income is too large for a full pension, and you are claiming you are poor... greedy, no?.....

No petal. Under the income test it starts dropping from $336/fn. You really are a dummy.

thegreatdivide wrote on May 24^th, 2023 at 11:52am:

It's urgent to the UN, IPCC, developed and developing countries alike: yet we see a greedy fellow like you not making allowances for the differences in nations' wealth.

And yet the IPCC, UN etc aren't telling China they must drop emissions. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 24^th, 2023 at 11:52am:

Being "shot down" by a greedy, blind, conservative climate/polluting-ff denier is an oxymoron.

Being shot down by data. Something which you don't acknowledge. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 24^th, 2023 at 11:52am:

Nah.. mainstreamers are only responding to where their bread is buttered, ie by "research grants" funded by the elite money-managers, not by any true understanding of money.

And you KNOW because you were told so, and you BELIEVE. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 24^th, 2023 at 11:52am:

Irrelevant: money is created out of nothing; the real issue is to make sure the money which the government needs to create is matched by the resources it wants to purchase, regardless of how many zeros in that quantity of money.

So you don't know how many zeroes in your "lot". Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 24^th, 2023 at 11:52am:

The only way you can offer is to be one of the "haves". Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 24^th, 2023 at 11:52am:

All the resources required to transition to a green economy.

But where are they "all". You don't have any idea of the required resources, but blithely claim they will not "run out". Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 24^th, 2023 at 11:52am:

Says the greedy conservative complaining about life on a part pension.

Where exactly have I complained about life on the pension, be specific. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 24^th, 2023 at 11:52am:

That UN, plus the UN which all nations are signed up to...

The one that is governed by non-elected representatives. Dummy. Grin

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #552 - May 25^th, 2023 at 12:53pm

lee wrote on May 24^th, 2023 at 10:51pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on May 24^th, 2023 at 11:52am:

so your income is too large for a full pension, and you are claiming you are poor... greedy, no?.....

No petal. Under the income test it starts dropping from $336/fn. You really are a dummy.

..because your income bars you from the full pension

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And yet the IPCC, UN etc aren't telling China they must drop emissions. Dummy. Roll Eyes

Yes they are, while asking for assistance from rich countries for all developing countries, watch the greedy conservatives howling.

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Being shot down by data. Something which you don't acknowledge. Dummy. Roll Eyes

Stats showing ff-polluted urban air is injurious to health, dummy.

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And you KNOW because you were told so, and you BELIEVE. Dummy. Roll Eyes

Unlike theologians who can't prove the existence of God, smart economists - not beholden to the elite financial crooks controlling mainstream economics - CAN prove the errors of mainstream economics.

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So you don't know how many zeroes in your "lot". Dummy. Roll Eyes

Conservative crippled brain; I explained why the money number doesn't matter, resource mobilization does.

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The only way you can offer is to be one of the "haves". Dummy. Roll Eyes

Poor conservative brain fooled by smart mainstream econimists; currency-issuing governments can be authorized to be among the "haves".

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But where are they "all"? You don't have any idea of the required resources, but blithely claim they will not "run out". Dummy. Roll Eyes

In the earth's crust; I'll get you a job on a ming site - (toilet cleaners always required at a mining camp.

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Where exactly have I complained about life on the pension, be specific. Dummy. Roll Eyes

You reckon 600 million Chinese (receiving less than your income) shouldn't have their income raised ASAP, remember?

[quote]The one that is governed by non-elected representatives. Dummy. Grin

Election is no guarantee of ability...look at the Oz parliament.

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lee

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #553 - May 25^th, 2023 at 4:35pm

thegreatdivide wrote on May 25^th, 2023 at 12:53pm:

because your income bars you from the full pension

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Guilty, I get more than $400 dollars. Grin

thegreatdivide wrote on May 25^th, 2023 at 12:53pm:

Yes they are, while asking for assistance from rich countries for all developing countries, watch the greedy conservatives howling.

'No they aren't they are still giving them until 2060 to get to net zero. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 25^th, 2023 at 12:53pm:

Stats showing ff-polluted urban air is injurious to health, dummy.

Stats don't show anything without a certifiable database, eg autopsies, not made up numbers. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 25^th, 2023 at 12:53pm:

Unlike theologians who can't prove the existence of God, smart economists - not beholden to the elite financial crooks controlling mainstream economics - CAN prove the errors of mainstream economics.

Can they? Then why haven't they done so? Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 25^th, 2023 at 12:53pm:

Conservative crippled brain; I explained why the money number doesn't matter, resource mobilization does.

And resources won't "run out", you said. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 25^th, 2023 at 12:53pm:

Poor conservative brain fooled by smart mainstream econimists; currency-issuing governments can be authorized to be among the "haves".

So you want to be 0one of the "currency-issuing government. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 25^th, 2023 at 12:53pm:

In the earth's crust; I'll get you a job on a ming site - (toilet cleaners always required at a mining camp.

And you absolutely KNOW this. You really are a dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 25^th, 2023 at 12:53pm:

You reckon 600 million Chinese (receiving less than your income) shouldn't have their income raised ASAP, remember?

And that has nothing to do with me complaining about my pension. Another case of your poor overworked brain making sch!t up again. Dummy. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on May 25^th, 2023 at 12:53pm:

Election is no guarantee of ability...look at the Oz parliament.

One only has to look at the UN, the EU to see similar dummies to you. Roll Eyes

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thegreatdivide

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Re: The fallacy of the Greens
Reply #554 - May 26^th, 2023 at 12:28pm

lee wrote on May 25^th, 2023 at 4:35pm:

'No they aren't they are still giving them until 2060 to get to net zero. Dummy. Roll Eyes

And you are complaining about that concession for developing countries, while howling about assistance from rich countries re costs of transition - given your flat earth monetary economics; money can come from currency-issuing governents on a debt-free basis, so there really is no "cost" anyway.

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Stats don't show anything without a certifiable database, eg autopsies, not made up numbers. Dummy. Roll Eyes

Stats re illness from ICE and ff pollution in built up areas

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Can they? Then why haven't they done so? Dummy. Roll Eyes

They have; see Keen's articles listed in the MMT thread. eg
https://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1645944963/510#518
#507

But mainstreamers are stuck in their neoclassical 'flat earth' ideology, so it will take some time before the public work it out for themselves (with Keen's help), this lady being representative of a good proportion of the public... priceless

https://twitter.com/i/status/1661548182789328896

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And resources won't "run out", you said. Dummy. Roll Eyes

Not to complete the transition to renewables, even if nuclear energy is required to complete the job, globally.

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So you want to be 0one of the "currency-issuing government. Dummy. Roll Eyes

Crippled brain stuff re use of the word "you"; I can't pay to provide "you" (everyone) with a job, the currency-issuing government can: see the Job Guarantee.

More free education for you, the result of this debate.

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And you absolutely KNOW this. You really are a dummy. Roll Eyes

Addressed above.

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And that has nothing to do with me complaining about my pension. Another case of your poor overworked brain making sch!t up again. Dummy. Roll Eyes

I said China needs to be granted more time to reach net zero, you said "no, China is rich, and I am on a pension".

Dummy.

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One only has to look at the UN, the EU to see similar dummies to you. Roll Eyes

Desperate deflection; democratic elections - via the blind leading the blind - don't select on ability.

« Last Edit: May 26^th, 2023 at 12:40pm by thegreatdivide »

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