Australian Politics Forum - Has there been a more outrageous porky here?

Brian Ross

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #540 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:48pm

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:34pm:

Spanish killed over 30 million Native Americans.

And that's a rubbish stat because nobody knew the population count for these various people. And nobody knows how many of these died of disease. It's a bigger guess than all of the others. Including the holocaust.

Immaterial, Hammer. What is known is the numbers which roughly died from contact with Europeans. Roll Eyes

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Mr Hammer

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #541 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:55pm

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:48pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:34pm:

Spanish killed over 30 million Native Americans.

And that's a rubbish stat because nobody knew the population count for these various people. And nobody knows how many of these died of disease. It's a bigger guess than all of the others. Including the holocaust.

Immaterial, Hammer. What is known is the numbers which roughly died from contact with Europeans. Roll Eyes

So you feel guilty and responsible when you pass on the flu then?

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polite_gandalf

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #542 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 2:06pm

freediver wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 11:26am:

You claimed that they only started killing students after the US invaded.

No I didn't FD. This is how you fail - you just don't get the whole concept of burden of proof.

I never said the taliban only started killing students after the US invaded. All I have ever done is point out that you have not presented a shred of evidence that it happened. Big difference.

You do this time and time again, and it amazes me you never learn. You make a BS claim, I point out you have no evidence, you then flail around for 20+ pages giving me every debating trick you can think of - everything except providing me evidence - whether its falacious logical leaps, inferring meaning from what the sources don't say, and your favourite - personal attacks ("is this a muslim thing?"). I then continue pointing out you still have no evidence - and of course you have a hissy fit and scream that you have already provided it - which of course you haven't. This invariably refers to when you posted an article that contains no evidence whatsoever for your actual claim, but evidence of another claim you introduce into the discussion later. Case in point - the wiki article that contains not a single example or reference of a single school girl getting executed as per your claim.

Quote:

Other than that you barely disagree with the "outrageous porky". Would you like to start backpedaling?

Your "outrageous porky" was that the taliban had an actively enforced policy of shooting school girls for not going to school - and moreover that under 8 pre-schoolers were shot for reading non-Quranic material. It is totally 100% without any basis. You invented it all by yourself out of thin air - because you have no shred of factual basis for it. If you did, you would obviously have produced it by now - instead of relying on the ridiculously absurd reference to girls who "risked execution" and activities post Taliban regime. Thats what we call a lie, or an "outrageous porky". Let me know if you're still not keeping up FD.

Quote:

This is a peculiar strategy for defending the Taliban Gandalf. Why did you choose the US invasion for the starting point of your baseless claim?

Because you made the original claim in specific reference to why the US were right not to negotiate with the taliban post-9/11 - as an alternative to invasion. Thats what we were discussing. I said the taliban were up for negotiating, and that the whole nearly 20 years of bloodshed could have been avoided. You retorted by saying it would be an outrage to even give the regime the time of day - *BECAUSE* (among other things), they had an "actively enforced policy" of executing toddlers for reading non-Quranic material. It was therefore right and proper to invade.

Of course if you would like to take this opportunity of clarifying that you in fact didn't mean that the pre-2001 taliban regime that ruled Afghanistan had an "actively enforced policy" of lining up toddlers and school girls and shooting them in the back of the head - then go ahead. Somehow though I think you really did mean that - right?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #543 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 2:26pm

Here's a reminder of FD's BS, baseless claim:

The Taliban presented every girl over 8 in the regions they controlled with the death penalty for learning to read, and girls under 8 with the death penalty for learning to read anything other than the Quran. It was not an isolated incident, it was an actively enforced policy.

And here's a summary of the main "arguments" FD has used to maintain it - all of which expertly avoid the dilemma of producing any actual evidence for the claim:

- I read it somewhere, but I forget where
- here's a wiki article that a) vaguely mentions that school girls risked execution and b) anecdotes of some vaguely related incidents that happened long after the period in question - proof!
- by saying I have no evidence, you are actually saying it never happened - ergo, a baseless claim - ergo, the burden of proof is really on you, not me!
- are you seriously suggesting the wiki article is saying it didn't happen?? (yes, I kid you not - actual argument used)
- questioning my claim can only mean you are a filthy taliban sympathiser - why do you love the taliban so??
- sneaky muslim trickery!!

Have I missed anything?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Mr Hammer

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #544 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 2:53pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 2:26pm:

Here's a reminder of FD's BS, baseless claim:

The Taliban presented every girl over 8 in the regions they controlled with the death penalty for learning to read, and girls under 8 with the death penalty for learning to read anything other than the Quran. It was not an isolated incident, it was an actively enforced policy.

And here's a summary of the main "arguments" FD has used to maintain it - all of which expertly avoid the dilemma of producing any actual evidence for the claim:

- I read it somewhere, but I forget where
- here's a wiki article that a) vaguely mentions that school girls risked execution and b) anecdotes of some vaguely related incidents that happened long after the period in question - proof!
- by saying I have no evidence, you are actually saying it never happened - ergo, a baseless claim - ergo, the burden of proof is really on you, not me!
- are you seriously suggesting the wiki article is saying it didn't happen?? (yes, I kid you not - actual argument used)
- questioning my claim can only mean you are a filthy taliban sympathiser - why do you love the taliban so??
- sneaky muslim trickery!!

Have I missed anything?

wiki- Women seeking an education were forced to attend underground schools, where they and their teachers risked execution if caught.[5][6

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Brian Ross

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #545 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:24pm

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:55pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:48pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:34pm:

Spanish killed over 30 million Native Americans.

And that's a rubbish stat because nobody knew the population count for these various people. And nobody knows how many of these died of disease. It's a bigger guess than all of the others. Including the holocaust.

Immaterial, Hammer. What is known is the numbers which roughly died from contact with Europeans. Roll Eyes

So you feel guilty and responsible when you pass on the flu then?

You mean you don't? Do you do it deliberately? Roll Eyes

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freediver

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #546 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:29pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 2:26pm:

Here's a reminder of FD's BS, baseless claim:

The Taliban presented every girl over 8 in the regions they controlled with the death penalty for learning to read, and girls under 8 with the death penalty for learning to read anything other than the Quran. It was not an isolated incident, it was an actively enforced policy.

And here's a summary of the main "arguments" FD has used to maintain it - all of which expertly avoid the dilemma of producing any actual evidence for the claim:

- I read it somewhere, but I forget where
- here's a wiki article that a) vaguely mentions that school girls risked execution and b) anecdotes of some vaguely related incidents that happened long after the period in question - proof!
- by saying I have no evidence, you are actually saying it never happened - ergo, a baseless claim - ergo, the burden of proof is really on you, not me!
- are you seriously suggesting the wiki article is saying it didn't happen?? (yes, I kid you not - actual argument used)
- questioning my claim can only mean you are a filthy taliban sympathiser - why do you love the taliban so??
- sneaky muslim trickery!!

Have I missed anything?

You missed about 90% of the evidence I presented, but at least that is a step up from "missing" 100% of it.

Did you or did you not claim that the Taliban only started shooting students after the US invaded?

Quote:

You mean you don't? Do you do it deliberately?

Gandalf still blames white people for the flu.

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« Last Edit: Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:34pm by freediver »

People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Mr Hammer

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #547 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:35pm

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:24pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:55pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:48pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:34pm:

Spanish killed over 30 million Native Americans.

And that's a rubbish stat because nobody knew the population count for these various people. And nobody knows how many of these died of disease. It's a bigger guess than all of the others. Including the holocaust.

Immaterial, Hammer. What is known is the numbers which roughly died from contact with Europeans. Roll Eyes

So you feel guilty and responsible when you pass on the flu then?

You mean you don't? Do you do it deliberately? Roll Eyes

To you I would. Did the Spanish Conquistadors ?

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Brian Ross

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #548 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:44pm

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:35pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:24pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:55pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:48pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:34pm:

Spanish killed over 30 million Native Americans.

And that's a rubbish stat because nobody knew the population count for these various people. And nobody knows how many of these died of disease. It's a bigger guess than all of the others. Including the holocaust.

Immaterial, Hammer. What is known is the numbers which roughly died from contact with Europeans. Roll Eyes

So you feel guilty and responsible when you pass on the flu then?

You mean you don't? Do you do it deliberately? Roll Eyes

To you I would. Did the Spanish Conquistadors ?

The Flu? Doubtful. Smallpox? Yes, definitely. Roll Eyes

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Mr Hammer

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #549 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:48pm

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:44pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:35pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:24pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:55pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:48pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:34pm:

Spanish killed over 30 million Native Americans.

And that's a rubbish stat because nobody knew the population count for these various people. And nobody knows how many of these died of disease. It's a bigger guess than all of the others. Including the holocaust.

Immaterial, Hammer. What is known is the numbers which roughly died from contact with Europeans. Roll Eyes

So you feel guilty and responsible when you pass on the flu then?

You mean you don't? Do you do it deliberately? Roll Eyes

To you I would. Did the Spanish Conquistadors ?

The Flu? Doubtful. Smallpox? Yes, definitely. Roll Eyes

So these people were trudging around in the jungle thousands of miles from home walking around in contact small pox and risking getting it themselves.

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Brian Ross

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #550 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 4:29pm

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:48pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:44pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:35pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:24pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:55pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:48pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:34pm:

Spanish killed over 30 million Native Americans.

And that's a rubbish stat because nobody knew the population count for these various people. And nobody knows how many of these died of disease. It's a bigger guess than all of the others. Including the holocaust.

Immaterial, Hammer. What is known is the numbers which roughly died from contact with Europeans. Roll Eyes

So you feel guilty and responsible when you pass on the flu then?

You mean you don't? Do you do it deliberately? Roll Eyes

To you I would. Did the Spanish Conquistadors ?

The Flu? Doubtful. Smallpox? Yes, definitely. Roll Eyes

So these people were trudging around in the jungle thousands of miles from home walking around in contact small pox and risking getting it themselves.

There are other ways of infecting people with Smallpox, Hammer. Read up about it. Roll Eyes

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Mr Hammer

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #551 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 4:38pm

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 4:29pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:48pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:44pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:35pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:24pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:55pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:48pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:34pm:

Spanish killed over 30 million Native Americans.

And that's a rubbish stat because nobody knew the population count for these various people. And nobody knows how many of these died of disease. It's a bigger guess than all of the others. Including the holocaust.

Immaterial, Hammer. What is known is the numbers which roughly died from contact with Europeans. Roll Eyes

So you feel guilty and responsible when you pass on the flu then?

You mean you don't? Do you do it deliberately? Roll Eyes

To you I would. Did the Spanish Conquistadors ?

The Flu? Doubtful. Smallpox? Yes, definitely. Roll Eyes

So these people were trudging around in the jungle thousands of miles from home walking around in contact small pox and risking getting it themselves.

There are other ways of infecting people with Smallpox, Hammer. Read up about it. Roll Eyes

You need to read up on the Spanish in Central and South America. There's absolutely no evidence they did that.

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moses

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #552 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 6:38pm

The story so far:

So it's 2019 nearly 2020, we have the muzzies raping torturing and slaughtering innocent people.

----------bbbbbuuuutttt it's all right because we don't know for sure if the little girls killed were 8, 9 or 10 and hundreds of years ago colonizers around the globe killed people who were not immune to the common cold and small pox.

Oh boy the crap we have to endure from the muzzie loony left duo is getting stupider and stupider, I wonder will they ever wake up and start telling the truth?

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Brian Ross

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #553 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 7:54pm

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 4:38pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 4:29pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:48pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:44pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:35pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 3:24pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:55pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:48pm:

Mr Hammer wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 1:34pm:

Spanish killed over 30 million Native Americans.

And that's a rubbish stat because nobody knew the population count for these various people. And nobody knows how many of these died of disease. It's a bigger guess than all of the others. Including the holocaust.

Immaterial, Hammer. What is known is the numbers which roughly died from contact with Europeans. Roll Eyes

So you feel guilty and responsible when you pass on the flu then?

You mean you don't? Do you do it deliberately? Roll Eyes

To you I would. Did the Spanish Conquistadors ?

The Flu? Doubtful. Smallpox? Yes, definitely. Roll Eyes

So these people were trudging around in the jungle thousands of miles from home walking around in contact small pox and risking getting it themselves.

There are other ways of infecting people with Smallpox, Hammer. Read up about it. Roll Eyes

You need to read up on the Spanish in Central and South America. There's absolutely no evidence they did that.

Quote:

In April 1520, Spanish forces landed in what is now Veracruz, Mexico, unwittingly bringing along an African slave infected with smallpox. Two months later, Spanish troops entered the capital of the Aztec Empire, Tenochtitlán (shown above), and by mid-October the virus was sweeping through the city (depicted above in images from the Florentine codex, a document written by a 16th century Spanish friar), killing nearly half of the population, which scholars today estimate at 50,000 to 300,000 people. The dead included the Aztec ruler, Cuitláhuac, and many of his senior advisers. By the time Hernán Cortés and his troops began their final assault on Tenochtitlán, bodies lay scattered over the city, allowing the small Spanish force to overwhelm the shocked defenders.

[Source]

Quote:

Smallpox is believed to have arrived in the Americas in 1520 on a Spanish ship sailing from Cuba, carried by an infected African slave. As soon as the party landed in Mexico, the infection began its deadly voyage through the continent. Even before the arrival of Pizarro, smallpox had already devastated the Inca Empire, killing the Emperor Huayna Capac and unleashing a bitter civil war that distracted and weakened his successor, Atahuallpa.

In the era of global conquest which followed, European colonizers were assisted around the world by the germs which they carried. A 1713 smallpox epidemic in the Cape of Good Hope decimated the South African Khoi San people, rendering them incapable of resisting the process of colonization. European germs also wreaked devastation on the aboriginal communities of Australia and New Zealand.

More victims of colonization were killed by Eurasian germs, than by either the gun or the sword, making germs the deadliest agent of conquest.

[Source]

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Brian Ross

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Re: Has there been a more outrageous porky here?
Reply #554 - Nov 19^th, 2019 at 7:56pm

moses wrote on Nov 19^th, 2019 at 6:38pm:

The story so far:

So it's 2019 nearly 2020, we have the muzzies raping torturing and slaughtering innocent people.

----------bbbbbuuuutttt it's all right because we don't know for sure if the little girls killed were 8, 9 or 10 and hundreds of years ago colonizers around the globe killed people who were not immune to the common cold and small pox.

Oh boy the crap we have to endure from the muzzie loony left duo is getting stupider and stupider, I wonder will they ever wake up and start telling the truth?

Oh, dearie, dearie, me. Seems that Moses doesn't like to see his insane beliefs about persecuting people being questioned. Tsk, tsk. Roll Eyes

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