Forum

 
  Back to OzPolitic.com   Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
  Forum Home Album HelpSearch Recent Rules LoginRegister  
 

Pages: 1 ... 7 8 9 10 11 
Send Topic Print
Nukes (Read 9486 times)
Bobby.
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 113017
Melbourne
Gender: male
Re: Nukes
Reply #120 - Jan 30th, 2019 at 10:04pm
 
freediver wrote on Jan 30th, 2019 at 9:51pm:
So that's about a factor of 20 reduction. It might also explain Gandalf changing his mind from "hundreds" to "thousands" being necessary to wipe out humans.



14,485 warheads is more than enough to wipe us all out.

It's insane and in my opinion a crime against humanity to have so many nuclear weapons.

I hope they reduce them further but there seems to be another cold war right now.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Jasin
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 53070
Gender: male
Re: Nukes
Reply #121 - Jan 30th, 2019 at 11:13pm
 
A full blown nuclear war would leave this planet pumped with Radiation.
With humanity long gone and another mass extinction of 90% gone. The planet would be in a state of excessive mutations from the radiation like it has never experienced before .

Within a 1,000 years - life will be accelerating in evolution possibly 90% faster than it ever has before. It's like add cocaine, speed, steroids, adrenaline and all the other 'hypoids' to life. The Radiation Environment would be making everything evolutionise erratically, super fast and unpredictably due to multitude mutations which basically make the evolutionary process a mad-house of random anomalies and short-cuts.

In other words - evolution would be 'out of control'!  Shocked
Back to top
 

AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
IP Logged
 
polite_gandalf
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 20027
Canberra
Gender: male
Re: Nukes
Reply #122 - Jan 31st, 2019 at 10:33am
 
freediver wrote on Jan 30th, 2019 at 7:52pm:
Do you have any rational arguments, other than inserting LOL?


My arguments are rational incarnate FD.

Whats the polar opposite of rational is to suggest that if nuclear armed nations give up their nukes, we'll suddenly be faced with the existential threat of crazy muslims running around with nuclear laden trucks (LOL)

freediver wrote on Jan 30th, 2019 at 7:52pm:
BTW, I am not arguing it is a similar threat at the moment.


Never said you did. But nice attempt to worm out of the idiotic-on-stilts proposition that you *DID* make that removing the current existential threat we face from the current stock of thousands of nukes with their ICBM deliverry systems -  will necessarily create an equal (or worse) threat courtesy of crazy muslims and their nuclear-laden trucks (LOL) - and therefore we shouldn't do it.

Back to top
 

A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
IP Logged
 
freediver
Gold Member
*****
Offline


www.ozpolitic.com

Posts: 51302
At my desk.
Re: Nukes
Reply #123 - Jan 31st, 2019 at 12:24pm
 
No nukes have been used in war since WWII. How long do you think it would take a Muslim nation or some other tinpot dictatorship to develop and use them, if they were faced with the possibility of being the only nation on earth to wield them?
Back to top
 

People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Brian Ross
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Representative of me

Posts: 44684
Re: Nukes
Reply #124 - Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:13pm
 
freediver wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 12:24pm:
No nukes have been used in war since WWII. How long do you think it would take a Muslim nation or some other tinpot dictatorship to develop and use them, if they were faced with the possibility of being the only nation on earth to wield them?


Ask the US as that was, until 1949 the exact situation that faced it, FD.

What people appear to be forgetting is that nuclear weapons are "Weapons of Last Resort", not first, particularly when faced by the real possibility of retaliation from other nations for using them...   Roll Eyes
Back to top
 

It seems that I have upset a Moderator and are forbidden from using memes. So much for Freedom of Speech. Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Bobby.
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 113017
Melbourne
Gender: male
Re: Nukes
Reply #125 - Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:29pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:13pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 12:24pm:
No nukes have been used in war since WWII. How long do you think it would take a Muslim nation or some other tinpot dictatorship to develop and use them, if they were faced with the possibility of being the only nation on earth to wield them?


Ask the US as that was, until 1949 the exact situation that faced it, FD.

What people appear to be forgetting is that nuclear weapons are "Weapons of Last Resort", not first, particularly when faced by the real possibility of retaliation from other nations for using them...   Roll Eyes



Nuclear weapons could be used by Iran indirectly.

They could give one to Hezbollah to use on Israel
& then claim that they had nothing to do with it -
as Tel Aviv looked like Hiroshima.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Brian Ross
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Representative of me

Posts: 44684
Re: Nukes
Reply #126 - Jan 31st, 2019 at 8:38pm
 
Bobby. wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:29pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:13pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 12:24pm:
No nukes have been used in war since WWII. How long do you think it would take a Muslim nation or some other tinpot dictatorship to develop and use them, if they were faced with the possibility of being the only nation on earth to wield them?


Ask the US as that was, until 1949 the exact situation that faced it, FD.

What people appear to be forgetting is that nuclear weapons are "Weapons of Last Resort", not first, particularly when faced by the real possibility of retaliation from other nations for using them...   Roll Eyes



Nuclear weapons could be used by Iran indirectly.

They could give one to Hezbollah to use on Israel
& then claim that they had nothing to do with it -
as Tel Aviv looked like Hiroshima.



You seem to think that Iran is so crazy they'd trust Hezbollah with a nuke.  Hezbollah are pretty much under the control of Iran but they contain sufficient crazies that no one would trust them with a weapon like a nuke.   Terrorists are by their very nature unstable.

Then there is the problem of them getting their nuke from southern Lebanon to Tel Aviv, Bobby.   The border between the two nations is tighter than a fish's arsehole.   It is heavily guarded by Israel - nothing gets across.   Mossad is well aware of what is happening in southern Lebanon and would become aware, quite quickly of Hezbollah getting a hold of a nuke.   Roll Eyes
Back to top
 

It seems that I have upset a Moderator and are forbidden from using memes. So much for Freedom of Speech. Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Jasin
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 53070
Gender: male
Re: Nukes
Reply #127 - Jan 31st, 2019 at 8:39pm
 
SYDNEY TO BE BLOWN BY NUCLEAR DETONATION BY A SUICIDE BOMBER. 4 MILLION PEOPLE WILL DIE - INCLUDING MOSLEMS
.
Back to top
 

AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
IP Logged
 
Bobby.
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 113017
Melbourne
Gender: male
Re: Nukes
Reply #128 - Jan 31st, 2019 at 8:47pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 8:38pm:
Bobby. wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:29pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:13pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 12:24pm:
No nukes have been used in war since WWII. How long do you think it would take a Muslim nation or some other tinpot dictatorship to develop and use them, if they were faced with the possibility of being the only nation on earth to wield them?


Ask the US as that was, until 1949 the exact situation that faced it, FD.

What people appear to be forgetting is that nuclear weapons are "Weapons of Last Resort", not first, particularly when faced by the real possibility of retaliation from other nations for using them...   Roll Eyes



Nuclear weapons could be used by Iran indirectly.

They could give one to Hezbollah to use on Israel
& then claim that they had nothing to do with it -
as Tel Aviv looked like Hiroshima.



You seem to think that Iran is so crazy they'd trust Hezbollah with a nuke.  Hezbollah are pretty much under the control of Iran but they contain sufficient crazies that no one would trust them with a weapon like a nuke.   Terrorists are by their very nature unstable.

Then there is the problem of them getting their nuke from southern Lebanon to Tel Aviv, Bobby.   The border between the two nations is tighter than a fish's arsehole.   It is heavily guarded by Israel - nothing gets across.   Mossad is well aware of what is happening in southern Lebanon and would become aware, quite quickly of Hezbollah getting a hold of a nuke.   Roll Eyes



Hezbollah getting a hold of a nuke is
perhaps the greatest undeclared fear that Israel has.

Israel knows that Iran would never fire a nuke at them from Iran
as Iran wouldn't exist an hour later.

So - Israel is terrified of Iran giving terrorists a nuclear missile.

It could arrive on a simple 40 tonne lorry.
Just one truck could carry such a missile -
even in pieces ready for assembly.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
freediver
Gold Member
*****
Offline


www.ozpolitic.com

Posts: 51302
At my desk.
Re: Nukes
Reply #129 - Jan 31st, 2019 at 9:32pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:13pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 12:24pm:
No nukes have been used in war since WWII. How long do you think it would take a Muslim nation or some other tinpot dictatorship to develop and use them, if they were faced with the possibility of being the only nation on earth to wield them?


Ask the US as that was, until 1949 the exact situation that faced it, FD.

What people appear to be forgetting is that nuclear weapons are "Weapons of Last Resort", not first, particularly when faced by the real possibility of retaliation from other nations for using them...   Roll Eyes


So Muslims would never open with them?
Back to top
 

People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Jasin
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 53070
Gender: male
Re: Nukes
Reply #130 - Jan 31st, 2019 at 9:39pm
 
Bobby. wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 8:47pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 8:38pm:
Bobby. wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:29pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:13pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 12:24pm:
No nukes have been used in war since WWII. How long do you think it would take a Muslim nation or some other tinpot dictatorship to develop and use them, if they were faced with the possibility of being the only nation on earth to wield them?


Ask the US as that was, until 1949 the exact situation that faced it, FD.

What people appear to be forgetting is that nuclear weapons are "Weapons of Last Resort", not first, particularly when faced by the real possibility of retaliation from other nations for using them...   Roll Eyes



Nuclear weapons could be used by Iran indirectly.

They could give one to Hezbollah to use on Israel
& then claim that they had nothing to do with it -
as Tel Aviv looked like Hiroshima.



You seem to think that Iran is so crazy they'd trust Hezbollah with a nuke.  Hezbollah are pretty much under the control of Iran but they contain sufficient crazies that no one would trust them with a weapon like a nuke.   Terrorists are by their very nature unstable.

Then there is the problem of them getting their nuke from southern Lebanon to Tel Aviv, Bobby.   The border between the two nations is tighter than a fish's arsehole.   It is heavily guarded by Israel - nothing gets across.   Mossad is well aware of what is happening in southern Lebanon and would become aware, quite quickly of Hezbollah getting a hold of a nuke.   Roll Eyes



Hezbollah getting a hold of a nuke is
perhaps the greatest undeclared fear that Israel has.

Israel knows that Iran would never fire a nuke at them from Iran
as Iran wouldn't exist an hour later.

So - Israel is terrified of Iran giving terrorists a nuclear missile.

It could arrive on a simple 40 tonne lorry.
Just one truck could carry such a missile -
even in pieces ready for assembly
.


BINGO!
(BOOM!)
Back to top
 

AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
IP Logged
 
polite_gandalf
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 20027
Canberra
Gender: male
Re: Nukes
Reply #131 - Feb 1st, 2019 at 11:31am
 
freediver wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 12:24pm:
No nukes have been used in war since WWII.


Two episodes in history you may be interested in FD:

1. a computer malfunction incorrectly alerted the Russians to a US first strike nuclear attack - to which the Russian officers were obliged by standard protocol to order a retaliatory strike. This would normally have happened, but was thankfully averted by a quick-witted and entirely non-compliant Russian officer on duty at the time.

2. President Nixon one late night was drunk and reportedly ordered a nuclear strike against the Vietnamese - as is his absolute prerogative as President. White house staff present at the time were able to delay him long enough to wake up Secretary of State Kissinger and summon him to talk him out of it.

How long before another drunk president decides on a whim to exercise his right to press the button on any nation he pleases? Forgive me if I see this as a more pressing and greater concern than the far-off possibility that some low resourced tinpot dictator may develop a nuclear threat somewhere in the unforeseeable future.

freediver wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 12:24pm:
How long do you think it would take a Muslim nation or some other tinpot dictatorship to develop and use them, if they were faced with the possibility of being the only nation on earth to wield them?


There are so many problems with this argument. Firstly, why wouldn't they be hell-for-leather to develop them now? The nuclear deterrent you say? This makes no sense given that the non-nuclear deterrent is far more present and realistic, has demonstrated its devastating results many times before, and will not disappear with nukes.

Secondly, a point which I continually raise but you continually ignore, is the fact that no tin pot dictatorship are going to have the ability to build a viable nuclear threat without some sort of assistance from an existing nuclear power - no matter how fanatical or determined they are to do it. Their ability will be even more hampered in a world in which all previous nuclear powers - ie "nuclear knowledgable" not only won't help them, but will have a vested interested to actively thwart them.
Back to top
 

A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
IP Logged
 
freediver
Gold Member
*****
Offline


www.ozpolitic.com

Posts: 51302
At my desk.
Re: Nukes
Reply #132 - Feb 1st, 2019 at 12:17pm
 
Quote:
There are so many problems with this argument. Firstly, why wouldn't they be hell-for-leather to develop them now?


Because being the only nation on earth wielding nuclear weapons is a very different prospect to being one of many. Just like being the only one with guns is a very different prospect to being one of many.

Quote:
Secondly, a point which I continually raise but you continually ignore, is the fact that no tin pot dictatorship are going to have the ability to build a viable nuclear threat without some sort of assistance from an existing nuclear power - no matter how fanatical or determined they are to do it.


Are you arguing that hiring a few nuclear scientists and engineers is too complicated for Muslims to pull off?

Last time we had this argument it turned out you were actually talking about ICBMs, not nukes. Is that what you mean by me ignoring you? Are we going full circle again?
Back to top
 

People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Bobby.
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 113017
Melbourne
Gender: male
Re: Nukes
Reply #133 - Feb 1st, 2019 at 12:38pm
 
Jasin wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 9:39pm:
Bobby. wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 8:47pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 8:38pm:
Bobby. wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:29pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:13pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 12:24pm:
No nukes have been used in war since WWII. How long do you think it would take a Muslim nation or some other tinpot dictatorship to develop and use them, if they were faced with the possibility of being the only nation on earth to wield them?


Ask the US as that was, until 1949 the exact situation that faced it, FD.

What people appear to be forgetting is that nuclear weapons are "Weapons of Last Resort", not first, particularly when faced by the real possibility of retaliation from other nations for using them...   Roll Eyes



Nuclear weapons could be used by Iran indirectly.

They could give one to Hezbollah to use on Israel
& then claim that they had nothing to do with it -
as Tel Aviv looked like Hiroshima.



You seem to think that Iran is so crazy they'd trust Hezbollah with a nuke.  Hezbollah are pretty much under the control of Iran but they contain sufficient crazies that no one would trust them with a weapon like a nuke.   Terrorists are by their very nature unstable.

Then there is the problem of them getting their nuke from southern Lebanon to Tel Aviv, Bobby.   The border between the two nations is tighter than a fish's arsehole.   It is heavily guarded by Israel - nothing gets across.   Mossad is well aware of what is happening in southern Lebanon and would become aware, quite quickly of Hezbollah getting a hold of a nuke.   Roll Eyes



Hezbollah getting a hold of a nuke is
perhaps the greatest undeclared fear that Israel has.

Israel knows that Iran would never fire a nuke at them from Iran
as Iran wouldn't exist an hour later.

So - Israel is terrified of Iran giving terrorists a nuclear missile.

It could arrive on a simple 40 tonne lorry.
Just one truck could carry such a missile -
even in pieces ready for assembly
.


BINGO!
(BOOM!)


Israel is worried.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Brian Ross
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Representative of me

Posts: 44684
Re: Nukes
Reply #134 - Feb 1st, 2019 at 1:05pm
 
freediver wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 9:32pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 7:13pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 31st, 2019 at 12:24pm:
No nukes have been used in war since WWII. How long do you think it would take a Muslim nation or some other tinpot dictatorship to develop and use them, if they were faced with the possibility of being the only nation on earth to wield them?


Ask the US as that was, until 1949 the exact situation that faced it, FD.

What people appear to be forgetting is that nuclear weapons are "Weapons of Last Resort", not first, particularly when faced by the real possibility of retaliation from other nations for using them...   Roll Eyes


So Muslims would never open with them?


When you answer my questions, I might answer yours, FD.    Roll Eyes

Back to top
 

It seems that I have upset a Moderator and are forbidden from using memes. So much for Freedom of Speech. Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 ... 7 8 9 10 11 
Send Topic Print