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Action on AGW, is it enough? (Read 8839 times)
Jovial Monk
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #195 - Jul 14th, 2017 at 11:15pm
 
Oh, I think govts will be doing MUCH more rushing.

I think the breakup of Larsen C is a trigger for action on AGW.

If govts let things slide until the Thwaites glacier lets go. . .it will be too late.

There, I have said it. . .too late.

But it is NOT too late now!
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Emma
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #196 - Jul 14th, 2017 at 11:32pm
 
Jeez Jove..

I wish I could agree with you, but I can't.

We have big debts to pay, and they're going to come home hard.

Perhaps...
Some magic solution to fix the world will appear..??  because we are supreme.? Human genius will save the day?

I really do hope so..


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Jovial Monk
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #197 - Jul 14th, 2017 at 11:39pm
 
Once politicians can no longer dodge the reality of AGW I think enough will be done to avert the worst.

If action could start now it will be easier and a lot less expensive.

I think we won’t tackle it until nearly too late and it will be hellaciously expensive.

A bit like the NBN, the Libs run out a temporary network that doesn’t really work now so we have to spend more money and more time running out the network we need.
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Grendel
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #198 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 10:54am
 
...
So many appeals to authoritah.... eh monk.
Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #199 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 11:04am
 
The temperature data shows the warming, the spectroscopy data explains it.

I take what action I personally can: planting trees, building a strawbale house, not buying a huge SUV but an economical sedan and walking to any location under 5Km away.

But the BIG action has to come from the political sphere and that is beginning.

So for the science—no appeal to authority at all, roach.
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TheFunPolice
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #200 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 11:20am
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 14th, 2017 at 11:39pm:
Once politicians can no longer dodge the reality of AGW I think enough will be done to avert the worst.

If action could start now it will be easier and a lot less expensive.

I think we won’t tackle it until nearly too late and it will be hellaciously expensive.

A bit like the NBN, the Libs run out a temporary network that doesn’t really work now so we have to spend more money and more time running out the network we need.

G-19+1  Cheesy

Trump has always had two minds on climate change: he will have to regulate at some point I suspect but he just wanted to give the markets the confidence to work unhindered with all his previous rhetoric... He started back flipping, in words atleast, as soon as he won the election!

Market forces are always regulated so I don't see how it can't be done in the end: it's just a matter of getting the ball rolling and the sa battery and announcements by France and Volvo to get away from fossil fuelled cars fleshing out the moral law bone structure in my opinion!
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TheFunPolice
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #201 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 11:21am
 
Grendel wrote on Jul 15th, 2017 at 10:54am:

Why do you say agw isn't true again?
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #202 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 11:32am
 
TheFunPolice wrote on Jul 15th, 2017 at 11:21am:
Grendel wrote on Jul 15th, 2017 at 10:54am:

Why do you say agw isn't true again?

Why do you lie about what I say?
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #203 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 11:37am
 
Where we are:

Quote:
Our current emissions trajectory locks Earth into a carbon dioxide level of at least 450 ppm, Ralph Keeling says. And burning fossil fuels at the same increasing rates through 2050 would drive those levels to their highest point in 50 million years, according to an April study in Nature Communications. Add a few more centuries of similar emissions, and carbon dioxide levels rise to those not seen in 420 million years, causing unprecedented sea level rise.

Keeling doesn’t think it’ll come to that. New efficiency standards and cleaner energy are already reducing emissions in the U.S. and other countries. If such efforts register at Mauna Loa, it could show humans still have some control. “It’s been an alarm bell so far — the curve,” Keeling says. “But if we start to take positive steps, it can become a sign of progress and hope.”

However, new research shows that reducing emissions isn’t a complete fix. “If you just stop emitting cold turkey, the temperature drops a little, but it doesn’t drop too much,” says MIT atmospheric scientist Susan Solomon. “The temperature stays almost as hot for 700 years.”

That’s because the carbon dioxide remains trapped in the atmosphere — much of it lingers a millennium later — pumping more and more energy into the ocean. So temperatures stabilize, but the seas keep rising.

This means humans actually have to remove greenhouse gases to reach levels scientists consider safe, roughly 350 ppm. And even short-lived greenhouses gases — methane lasts about a decade — will still cause sea levels to rise for centuries.

The reason is fairly simple. Greenhouse gases trap extra heat in our atmosphere, and oceans suck most of it up. As the warmer water expands, it causes sea levels to rise. And like a hot bath, the ocean must radiate its heat back out — through the atmosphere and into space — for it to cool.

Former NASA scientist James Hansen, now at Columbia University, helped launch climate change into the public sphere with his 1988 testimony before Congress. “[A level of] 450 ppm would guarantee disaster,” Hansen says now. “If you leave it in place long enough, it would guarantee that you do lose the coastal cities.”


http://discovermagazine.com/2017/jul-aug/what-carbon-really-costs

So fossil fuel use is on a downward trajectory. Good. Energy efficiency, the low hanging fruit, can do a lot. Building materials could incorporate locking up carbon (strawbale is the extreme of this: it could be encouraged with design rules etc.

But we need to actually remove CO2. Easy way, plant lots of trees. Bamboo might be better as it is faster growing. Only good if used in permanent structures. Bamboo makes good flooring.

Maybe some chemical engineering? Heartbreaking task to consider: the huge amount of CO2 but algae could be cultured in tanks with air bubbled through so it absorbs the CO2 and turns it into more algae which is eventually turned into biodiesel. Have seen proposals for this, no idea how feasible. Anyway, biodiesel doesn’t keep CO2 out the air.

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Ajax
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #204 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 12:43pm
 
AND AGAIN.

Anthropogenic Global Warming = A storm in a tea cup.

95% of the greenhouse effect comes from water vapour.

3.7% of the greenhouse effect comes from CO2.

Man's contribution to the CO2 is about 3%.

So you are worried about 3% of 0.0037 = 0.000111

From 0.0037 man contributes 0.000111.

CO2 molecules have a life span of about 5 years in our atmosphere.

Our history shows that there is no correlation between CO2 and temperature.

All of the CO2 increase can be attributed to the current warming and the release of natural CO2 emissions which dwarf man made emissions.

And your going to let the oligarchy (a hand full of rich men) dictate to the whole world how and when we should use our energy and how much it will cost.

Seriously when the sh!t hits the fan because of the cost and people REALLY look into it, they will think believers in AGW were just plain STUPID IDIOTS.

Wake up FFS........................ Cheesy
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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #205 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 12:46pm
 
Ummm, Ajax, man’s contribution to CO2 is nearly 50% (410-280)*100/280. Let you work it out.

We see the West Antarctic rather hot. We have seen the Larsen C ice shelf have a big bit break off.

Read up on West Antarctica and Thwaites glacier there.
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Grendel
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #206 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 12:50pm
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 15th, 2017 at 12:46pm:
Ummm, Ajax, man’s contribution to CO2 is nearly 50% (410-280)*100/280. Let you work it out.

We see the West Antarctic rather hot. We have seen the Larsen C ice shelf have a big bit break off.

Read up on West Antarctica and Thwaites glacier there.

oh dear...
Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin
Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin
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Ajax
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #207 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 12:56pm
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 15th, 2017 at 12:46pm:
Ummm, Ajax, man’s contribution to CO2 is nearly 50% (410-280)*100/280. Let you work it out.

We see the West Antarctic rather hot. We have seen the Larsen C ice shelf have a big bit break off.

Read up on West Antarctica and Thwaites glacier there.


...
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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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Jovial Monk
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #208 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 12:59pm
 
Can’t read text that small.

We have added 46% more CO2. Not 3%

450ppm is the redline, we better start doing things before we let things deteriorate that far.


46% more CO2 in the atmosphere because of us, Ajax.
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Ajax
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Re: Action on AGW, is it enough?
Reply #209 - Jul 15th, 2017 at 1:00pm
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 15th, 2017 at 12:59pm:
Can’t read text that small.

We have added 46% more CO2. Not 3%

450ppm is the redline, we better start doing things before we let things deteriorate that far.


46% more CO2 in the atmosphere because of us, Ajax.


Sorry about that I was just being lazy.


Compared to natural CO2 emissions mans emissions of CO2 are just too small to register.

Notice the sharp rise in fossil fuel CO2 emissions after 2000.

After 2000 fossil fuel emissions were 3 times the amount of fossil fuel emissions in the prior decade to 2000, that is 3 times as much fossil fuel emission went into our atmosphere after 2000 than the decade before 2000.

But the average yearly increase after 2000 just like the decade prior to 2000, average increase in CO2 remains more or less steady at 2.1ppm per year.

Fossil fuel CO2 emissions at 2.3% of the total CO2 natural emissions are insignificant and get lost in the noise.

That's why the average yearly increase of CO2 has remained steady at 2.1ppm per year even though fossil fuel emissions have shot through the roof.

Again your argument is shot down.

Yes fossil fuels emissions contribute but the contribution is small at 2.3% of the total amount of natural CO2 that is emitted.
...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGZqWMEpyUM
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« Last Edit: Jul 15th, 2017 at 1:05pm by Ajax »  

1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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