Australian Politics Forum - Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs

Sprintcyclist

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #90 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:21pm

Its time wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 4:45pm:

Is there adequate assistance to get addicts off the gear these days ?

I believe not.

I believe the demand for assistance is much higher than the supply.

Resources not wasted in 'fighting the war on drugs' would be better utilised on helping victims of drug addiction

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Stratos Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 4725	Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs Reply #91 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:27pm matty wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:20pm: Well obviously. I meant in regards to recreational use. So the same drug in the same quantity has a different effect if it's used medically or recreationally? Why would you think one is safe and the other unsafe?
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GordyL

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #92 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:50pm

Option 1: Govt paid chemists concoct a perfect drug that gives the most euphoric high and can be tweaked once in a while to stop druggies getting bored. It also has an instantly acting antidote. (Hello Soma)

Will never happen.

Option 2: Total decriminalization

Will never happen

Option 3: Have discrete pill and drug testing sites for harm minimization.

Will happen

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mariacostel

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #93 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:55pm

Stratos wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 4:55pm:

mariacostel wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 4:36pm:

Stratos wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 1:20pm:

matty wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 10:24am:

skippy. wrote on Feb 19^th, 2016 at 9:27am:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Feb 19^th, 2016 at 8:37am:

I would almost vote for the greens on this policy alone.

Greenswin - convince me.
It won't take a lot.

Armchair would prefer to see our kids die as a result of prohibition.
Prohibition has always proven to be useless.
Kids will take ecstasy and other drugs if they are legal or illegal, at least if they are legal we can ensure they are safe for consumption.
It's a no brainer, unless you have no brains. Roll Eyes

Drugs safe for consumption is an oxymoron. And why should people who don't take drugs care about those who are stupid enough to take them?

Never been/had any close friends or relatives in hospital? Limited amounts of certain substances are fine. Addiction and overconsumption are where the problems lie, same with literally anything else (i.e. alcohol, fast food, gambling).

Mate of mine was on medical morphine to treat his asbestosis, helped him greatly. Would you call people in his situation "stupid"?

You are not seriously comparing medical use of narcotics and recreational (ab)use, are you?

In the context of Matty's argument yes. He said "Drugs safe for consumption is an oxymoron", which is bollocks.

Many drugs can be used safely, and are everyday in hospitals. Amphetamines, opiods, ketamine, laughing gas. Matty's wrong on that one.

To be fair, I think he assumed the reader would understand he meant RECREATIONAL use. He fell into the trap of assuming you would be intelligent in your response. It can be hard formulating an argument for a crowd of stupid people.

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mariacostel

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #94 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:56pm

Stratos wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:27pm:

matty wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:20pm:

Well obviously.

I meant in regards to recreational use.

So the same drug in the same quantity has a different effect if it's used medically or recreationally?

Why would you think one is safe and the other unsafe?

Ice and MDMA are used medically?

Please detail where that is true.

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mariacostel

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #95 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:57pm

GordyL wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:50pm:

Option 1: Govt paid chemists concoct a perfect drug that gives the most euphoric high and can be tweaked once in a while to stop druggies getting bored. It also has an instantly acting antidote. (Hello Soma)

Will never happen.

Option 2: Total decriminalization

Will never happen

Option 3: Have discrete pill and drug testing sites for harm minimization.

Will happen

Pill testing is a somewhat pointless exercise. What exactly is 'safe heroin'? It is a drug which is highly addictive and kills very easily - and that is its safe form.

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Stratos

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #96 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 6:17pm

mariacostel wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:56pm:

Ice and MDMA are used medically?

Please detail where that is true.

er, please post where I said they were?

However, since you asked so nicely, Methamphetamine is used for various treatments, mostly ADHD I believe (seems counter intuitive I know lol). I never claimed that MDMA was safe, and I'm not aware of any medical use.

mariacostel wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:57pm:

What exactly is 'safe heroin'?

Look up "opiods"

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Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:24pm:

Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act

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GordyL

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #97 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 6:50pm

mariacostel wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:57pm:

GordyL wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:50pm:

Option 1: Govt paid chemists concoct a perfect drug that gives the most euphoric high and can be tweaked once in a while to stop druggies getting bored. It also has an instantly acting antidote. (Hello Soma)

Will never happen.

Option 2: Total decriminalization

Will never happen

Option 3: Have discrete pill and drug testing sites for harm minimization.

Will happen

Pill testing is a somewhat pointless exercise. What exactly is 'safe heroin'? It is a drug which is highly addictive and kills very easily - and that is its safe form.

Harm minimization has nothing to do with making something safe. It's about making it safer.

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #98 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 7:37pm

... wrote on Feb 19^th, 2016 at 1:59pm:

One thing I don't agree with is providing "shooting galleries".

I'd rather licensed, commercial operations that source and test product, and provide a setting for users, not just a shed where any old nice person can come and use any old gear. In attaining a license, they assume responsibility for their patrons.

You can't bring your own piss to a pub, so why should you be able to bring your own heroin to a shooting gallery?

The only reason they exist is because drugs are illegal. Shooting galleries would have no need in a properly administered and regulated legal drug world.

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #99 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 7:40pm

matty wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 12:59pm:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 11:13am:

Matty - alevine is posting silly comments.
I don't bother to reply to such people.

Hi Sprint. I agree, no point.

Quite a big point actually. You claim to have christian values yet you dont want to care about people who take drugs because they took drugs. Either follow jebus properly or stop pretending to be a good natured alter boy.

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Its time

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #100 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 7:44pm

Sprintcyclist wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:21pm:

Its time wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 4:45pm:

Is there adequate assistance to get addicts off the gear these days ?

I believe not.

I believe the demand for assistance is much higher than the supply.

Resources not wasted in 'fighting the war on drugs' would be better utilised on helping victims of drug addiction

I did hear on radio that an ice addict sought treatment but was turned away because he wasn't addicted enough , his family ended up putting him in a private treatment facility

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #101 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 7:44pm

mariacostel wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 4:34pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 10:35am:

mariacostel wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 9:39am:

innocentbystander. wrote on Feb 19^th, 2016 at 1:18pm:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Feb 19^th, 2016 at 8:37am:

I would almost vote for the greens on this policy alone.

Greenswin - convince me.
It won't take a lot.

Me too, the war on drugs has been well and truly lost, all it is now is a war on people.

I'm glad you weren't in charge of the Allied Forces after Dunkirk. Surrender seems to come a little too easily.

I bet you think prohibition worked too.

I am glad my parents however decided to fight on and win the war. And guess what... they changed strategy, got some new weapons, but they NEVER GAVE UP.

I think youve officially lost it, longie.

Drugs on war is not a conventional war against enemies with big armies who wish to take over our lands etc. Its a stupid propoganda policy that tries to fight drug cartels in a very ineffective way. Has anyone ever done a cost benefit analysis on this pretend war? Perhspd theyll realise that a strategy of legalising drugs would not only end drug cartels, but also make drugs safer and raise money for government. Any liberal supporter who believes in cbo should froth at the idea.

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Melanias purse

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #102 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 8:04pm

Stratos wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 6:17pm:

mariacostel wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:56pm:

Ice and MDMA are used medically?

Please detail where that is true.

er, please post where I said they were?

However, since you asked so nicely, Methamphetamine is used for various treatments, mostly ADHD I believe (seems counter intuitive I know lol). I never claimed that MDMA was safe, and I'm not aware of any medical use.

Extasy was originally used in psychiatry. It's starting to be used now for patients with MS, but this is currently experimental.

They use dexamphetamine for ADHD (Ritalin, Concerta). Other amphetamines are used for weight loss. The main use for methamphetamine is in the military. It is often administered prior to battle.

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Melanias purse

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #103 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 8:13pm

Its time wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 7:44pm:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 5:21pm:

Its time wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 4:45pm:

Is there adequate assistance to get addicts off the gear these days ?

I believe not.

I believe the demand for assistance is much higher than the supply.

Resources not wasted in 'fighting the war on drugs' would be better utilised on helping victims of drug addiction

I did hear on radio that an ice addict sought treatment but was turned away because he wasn't addicted enough , his family ended up putting him in a private treatment facility

Depends what treatment he sought. Someone who uses ice would not need a medical detox facility. There's no danger from withdrawal symptoms, unlike alcohol and benzodiazapines.

Some form of rehab, however, is necessary.

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skippy.

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Re: Greens want decriminalisation of ice, other drugs
Reply #104 - Feb 20^th, 2016 at 8:25pm

So Matty goes on the list with longy armchair and co as those that would prefer our kids to die in the name of prohibition.
Next time you lot are getting pissed instead of knocking back some regular booze with the
Alcohol content listed on the bottle just drink some moonshine instead, it doesn't matter if you know the alcohol content because alcohol is legal so you can't die,right?

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