Australian Politics Forum - Greenpeace co founder on climate change

BatteriesNotIncluded

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Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change
Reply #15 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 10:24am

Stratos wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 9:36am:

Soren, CO2 can develop plant growth, and this has been scientifically demonstrated. However, there are several concerns with it, such as an increased amount of carbohydrate in the carbohydrate/protein ratio.

Then there is the much greater concern that rising temperatures and changing climate could have a catastrophic effect on worldwide crops that will far outweigh the benefits of having a greater plant growth from C02

He's pretending he doesn't understand complexity!

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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BatteriesNotIncluded

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Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change
Reply #16 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 10:29am

Rider wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 9:52am:

Stratos wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 9:36am:

Soren, CO2 can develop plant growth, and this has been scientifically demonstrated. However, there are several concerns with it, such as an increased amount of carbohydrate in the carbohydrate/protein ratio.

Then there is the much greater concern that rising temperatures and changing climate could have a catastrophic effect on worldwide crops that will far outweigh the benefits of having a greater plant growth from C02

How are those temperature rises working out for you?

Ever heard of a phase change diagram?

Resource bottlenecks are coming Wink

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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Stratos

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Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change
Reply #17 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 10:46am

Rider wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 9:52am:

How are those temperature rises working out for you?

I suggest you have a brief look the NASA website I'll link below. If you have any doubts about their claims, check the sources provided and compare them to wherever you are getting your information.

http://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/

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Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:24pm:

Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act

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Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change
Reply #18 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 11:54am

So according to NASA we still have a trend in warming at the same rate as 1970-1998? Or is it basically flat since? And all this with increasing CO2, the supposed 'Control Knob'. of Global Warming. The 'Control Knob' must be broken.

Arctic Sea Ice within about 1 standard deviation. 2012, the low point, due to storm (weather).

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Stratos Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 4725	Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change Reply #19 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 12:51pm Lee, did you check out any of the sources on the website? They have citations for all of their claims.
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Rider

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Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change
Reply #20 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 1:02pm

Stratos wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 10:46am:

Rider wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 9:52am:

How are those temperature rises working out for you?

I suggest you have a brief look the NASA website I'll link below. If you have any doubts about their claims, check the sources provided and compare them to wherever you are getting your information.

http://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/

Why?
Well they would...woundnt they?

NASA still displays the old 97% chestnut on this website Cheesy

So when are you going to admit that surface temps havent moved for the best part of 20 years?

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Stratos Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 4725	Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change Reply #21 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 1:08pm Rider wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 1:02pm: So when are you going to admit that surface temps havent moved for the best part of 20 years? According to which scientists?
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Rider Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 2669 OnTheRoad Gender:	Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change Reply #22 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 1:18pm Stratos wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 1:08pm: Rider wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 1:02pm: So when are you going to admit that surface temps havent moved for the best part of 20 years? According to which scientists? Oh a defer to authority and a waste my time red herring....too funny
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Stratos Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 4725	Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change Reply #23 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 1:23pm Rider wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 1:18pm: Oh a defer to authority and a waste my time red herring....too funny I don't get it. You make an unsubstantiated claim, and when asked you won't provide your source. Would you mind showing me your source so I can have a look?
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lee

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Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change
Reply #24 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 6:00pm

Stratos wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 12:51pm:

Lee, did you check out any of the sources on the website? They have citations for all of their claims.

From IPCC projections, from conjecture. But from empirical evidence? Excluding homogenised temperatures, of course, with 2.500 Sq Km grids. Because the temperature in those grids will be the same obviously. No variation due to air pressure, whether from height or weather.

So if we have a look at NOOA data, division of NASA, from 1998 to present, we see that it is fairly flat and moving sideways. Quite unlike 1970 to 1998.

http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/cag/time-series/global/globe/land_ocean/ytd/10/1880-201...

CO2 emissions have increased by about 1/3 since 1998, but as shown, the temps have not reflected that increase.

So, for a moment, ignore the citations,and simply use your eyes.

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Soren

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Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change
Reply #25 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 6:03pm

BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 10:29am:

Rider wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 9:52am:

Stratos wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 9:36am:

Soren, CO2 can develop plant growth, and this has been scientifically demonstrated. However, there are several concerns with it, such as an increased amount of carbohydrate in the carbohydrate/protein ratio.

Then there is the much greater concern that rising temperatures and changing climate could have a catastrophic effect on worldwide crops that will far outweigh the benefits of having a greater plant growth from C02

How are those temperature rises working out for you?

Ever heard of a phase change diagram?

Was the phase change diagram predicted or was it put there coz the models didn't work?

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Stratos

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Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change
Reply #26 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 6:21pm

lee wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 6:00pm:

So if we have a look at NOOA data, division of NASA, from 1998

Yes, lets start with the biggest outlier and go from there Roll Eyes

You should never start any analysis from an outlier as it can skew data immensely. Someone equally as dishonest could start from, say, 1985 and show that to skew the data the other direction.

lee wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 6:00pm:

CO2 emissions have increased by about 1/3 since 1998

Source?

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Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:24pm:

Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act

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lee

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Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change
Reply #27 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 6:59pm

Stratos wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 6:21pm:

Source?

https://scripps.ucsd.edu/programs/keelingcurve/wp-content/plugins/sio-bluemoon/g...

According to Mauna Loa chart the CO2 has increased from about 275 ppm since 1700, 125 ppm. And from approx. 350 to 400 since about 1998, 50 ppm. 50/125 = 0.4, slightly larger than 0.33.

But I said at the outset that it was basically flat since 1998. Suddenly, that's not good enough. How humorous.

And the control knob is not controlling. How do you explain that? How many excuses for the 'cause of the pause', so far?

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Stratos

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Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change
Reply #28 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 7:23pm

lee wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 6:59pm:

But I said at the outset that it was basically flat since 1998. Suddenly, that's not good enough. How humorous.

As I explained to you before:

Stratos wrote on Dec 10^th, 2014 at 6:21pm:

You should never start any analysis from an outlier as it can skew data immensely. Someone equally as dishonest could start from, say, 1985 and show that to skew the data the other direction.

As for global warming being paused, I haven't seen any data to suggest this is the case. If there is any scientific data to demonstrate this please let me know so I can check it out.

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Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:24pm:

Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act

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lee

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Re: Greenpeace co founder on climate change
Reply #29 - Dec 10^th, 2014 at 7:32pm

So you can't read a graph.

Look at the slope from 1970 -1998. That is the trend. Look at the graph from then until present. That trend is flat, unlike the trend from 1970-98. There is a stop in the trend. Whether that trend from 1970 -98 resumes or not, the trend has stopped. It depends on whether the next trend is up or down as to whether the trend is paused.

Of course if you want a longer time frame, you can always look back at the data prior to 1880 or therabouts.

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