Australian Politics Forum - The Liberal MP Was A Wing Nut On Penalty Rates

Swagman

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Re: The Liberal MP Was A Wing Nut On Penalty Rates
Reply #135 - Sep 9^th, 2014 at 8:33pm

Grappler Racist Filth wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 4:53pm:

Common sense dictates that it will not. No organisation will sell more coffee than it does, therefore no organisation will employ anyone more than it has to, regardless of the rate of pay to workers

Common sense dictates the opposite.

If just one business opens on Sunday and employs just one unemployed person at single time then your argument is a dud..... Cheesy

Also, the poll is also testimony to it. Huh

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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Liberal MP Was A Wing Nut On Penalty Rates
Reply #136 - Sep 9^th, 2014 at 8:39pm

Swagman wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 8:33pm:

Grappler Racist Filth wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 4:53pm:

Common sense dictates that it will not. No organisation will sell more coffee than it does, therefore no organisation will employ anyone more than it has to, regardless of the rate of pay to workers

Common sense dictates the opposite.

If just one business opens on Sunday and employs just one unemployed person at single time then your argument is a dud.....

An existing casual employee will do the work on Sunday.

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GOP = Guardians Of Paedophiles

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Swagman

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Re: The Liberal MP Was A Wing Nut On Penalty Rates
Reply #137 - Sep 9^th, 2014 at 8:53pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 8:39pm:

Swagman wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 8:33pm:

Grappler Racist Filth wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 4:53pm:

Common sense dictates that it will not. No organisation will sell more coffee than it does, therefore no organisation will employ anyone more than it has to, regardless of the rate of pay to workers

Common sense dictates the opposite.

If just one business opens on Sunday and employs just one unemployed person at single time then your argument is a dud.....

An existing casual employee will do the work on Sunday.

Not everywhere Greggy.

What about the places that didn't open at all?

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crocodile

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Re: The Liberal MP Was A Wing Nut On Penalty Rates
Reply #138 - Sep 9^th, 2014 at 9:12pm

Grappler Racist Filth wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 4:53pm:

.. then why are we discussing the silly and totally unfounded idea that reducing penalty rates will lead to more younger person employment? It is obvious that either it will or will not, but nobody knows for sure, but any lever to gain a profit for business while we have an Abbott-style government in will do.

Common sense dictates that it will not. No organisation will sell more coffee than it does, therefore no organisation will employ anyone more than it has to, regardless of the rate of pay to workers.

It is painfully obvious that this is nothing more than self-interested rhetoric from the employers union....

Thank you all for your input.

They certainly will if lowering prices shifts the demand vs margin in their favour. It would be poor business practice to not explore it.

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Very funny Scotty, now beam down my clothes.

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John Smith

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Re: The Liberal MP Was A Wing Nut On Penalty Rates
Reply #139 - Sep 9^th, 2014 at 9:58pm

crocodile wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 9:12pm:

Grappler Racist Filth wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 4:53pm:

.. then why are we discussing the silly and totally unfounded idea that reducing penalty rates will lead to more younger person employment? It is obvious that either it will or will not, but nobody knows for sure, but any lever to gain a profit for business while we have an Abbott-style government in will do.

Common sense dictates that it will not. No organisation will sell more coffee than it does, therefore no organisation will employ anyone more than it has to, regardless of the rate of pay to workers.

It is painfully obvious that this is nothing more than self-interested rhetoric from the employers union....

Thank you all for your input.

They certainly will if lowering prices shifts the demand vs margin in their favour. It would be poor business practice to not explore it.

and if it doesn't, are you going to re-instate penalty rates?

It's easy to gamble with other peoples money, you want to gamble, do it with your own

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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Dnarever

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Re: The Liberal MP Was A Wing Nut On Penalty Rates
Reply #140 - Sep 9^th, 2014 at 10:17pm

crocodile wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 3:54pm:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 2:52pm:

crocodile wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 12:55pm:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 10:03am:

crocodile wrote on Sep 9^th, 2014 at 9:51am:

At last, you're learning. The fella selling at $20 will make no money because his volume will be zilch. He has to drop his price. He will settle at the sweet spot where volume x margin yields the maximum profit. If there is any change in demand because of a price restructure the sweet spot will move.

By the way, do you think that the reduction in smoking over the years might just have a little bit to do with the price of a packet of fags.

At last, you're learning. The fella selling at $20 will make no money because his volume will be zilch

You are the one suggesting $20.

The problem isn't your market philosophy - it is just that it will not happen. They will just take the easy profit the lazy way with no risk associated.

If people are throwing money at you the best policy is to try to catch it.

I'm suggesting $20 for the exercise because Smithy intimated that demand is unaffected by price way back on page 2. You seem to suggest that all business owners are lazy sods that would do jack to look at ways of increasing profits.

You seem to suggest that all business owners are lazy sods that would do jack to look at ways of increasing profits

No I suggest that they are smart enough to take a zero cost zero effort profit in favour of starting a turf war where all lose. I am actually accusing them of being fairly smart.

Being a business owner myself I can assure you that I don't go knocking on the doors of my competitors and negotiate my sale prices. Neither do others come knocking on my door. Besides, collusive pricing is against the law.

Smithy intimated that demand is unaffected by price

It is unaffected by the type of marginal realistic price variations we would be talking about if there was any chance of it happening.

You don't know that for sure. Coffee was only an example. Penalties apply economy wide.

On the topic there has always existed absolutely zero evidence to suggest that the removal of penalty rates would lead to any increase in employment.

Unfortunately, most academic papers are promulgated by self interested parties. For every paper you find dismissing the penalties you'll find one supporting it.

Quote:

Being a business owner myself I can assure you that I don't go knocking on the doors of my competitors and negotiate my sale prices. Neither do others come knocking on my door. Besides, collusive pricing is against the law.

You wouldn't notice if a competitor was undercutting your prices and taking all your customers and then follow up by reducing your rates to compete ? This isn't collusion but it is the most likely outcome of anyone trying to take a commercial advantage in this type of situation.

Quote:

You don't know that for sure. Coffee was only an example. Penalties apply economy wide.

It is difficult to identify any realistic examples and coffee is not one of them. Any business which could be viable to operate on weekends are already in play and for anyone where the decision is so tight that penalty rates matter the decision should be to stay closed anyway because it isn't going to work.

The reality is that the only impact is less pay for employees and more profit for business.

Its a greedy money grab nothing more.

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Poll
Question: Would you work Late night or weekends for single time
Yes 4 (21.1%) No 15 (78.9%) Total votes: 19 « Created by: John S on: Sep 7^th, 2014 at 12:31am »