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Why Socialism By Albert Einstein (Read 9273 times)
ImSpartacus2
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Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Jan 5th, 2014 at 11:30pm
 
Years ago I read an article by Albert Einstein published in 1949 explaining why he was a socialist.  I read it again a few days ago and was amazed at how little it had dated.  Its not a very long article, though you might need to re-read a passage or 2 since the man was not writing in his first language.  Nevertheless the clarity of thought and sheer logic of his position comes through loud and clear.  Whether you're a socialist or not and especially if you're someone ardently opposed to socialism can you really afford not to challenge your current opinion with the thoughts of one of the most accomplished thinkers the world has ever seen.  I would think that anyone who regards themselves a free thinker would welcome the opportunity. Anyway, here's the link for those who are game enough. 

   

http://monthlyreview.org/2009/05/01/why-socialism
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Ex Dame Pansi
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #1 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 6:01am
 

It was obvious to Einstein, back in the forties, much like George Orwell......modern day prophets.
...................................................................

Private capital tends to become concentrated in few hands, partly because of competition among the capitalists, and partly because technological development and the increasing division of labor encourage the formation of larger units of production at the expense of smaller ones.

The result of these developments is an oligarchy of private capital the enormous power of which cannot be effectively checked even by a democratically organized political society. This is true since the members of legislative bodies are selected by political parties, largely financed or otherwise influenced by private capitalists who, for all practical purposes, separate the electorate from the legislature.

The consequence is that the representatives of the people do not in fact sufficiently protect the interests of the underprivileged sections of the population.

Moreover, under existing conditions, private capitalists inevitably control, directly or indirectly, the main sources of information (press, radio, education). It is thus extremely difficult, and indeed in most cases quite impossible, for the individual citizen to come to objective conclusions and to make intelligent use of his political rights.
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"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace." Hendrix
andrei said: Great isn't it? Seeing boatloads of what is nothing more than human garbage turn up.....
 
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cods
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #2 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 7:05am
 
theres an old saying..

A FOOL AND HIS MONEY ARE SOON PARTED..

if all the money on the planet was divided equally today..

it would be just as uneven tomorrow..

I WONDER WHY> Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


check how many lottery winners have lost or got rid of the lot...in very short time.. Cool
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ImSpartacus2
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #3 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 7:42am
 
cods wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 7:05am:
theres an old saying..

A FOOL AND HIS MONEY ARE SOON PARTED..

if all the money on the planet was divided equally today..

it would be just as uneven tomorrow..

I WONDER WHY> Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


check how many lottery winners have lost or got rid of the lot...in very short time.. Cool

Its like your view of socialism stopped in the 1960 with the cold war propaganda and you never bothered to actually research it yourself to see what it really is. I'm not saying that if you did some of your own research you would like it anymore but at least you would disagree with it for your own informed reasons instead of for misconceived reasons deliberately planted by others intent on deluding you. You really do need to do some reading otherwise you'll just continue looking foolish with comments like the one below. Socialism isn't about sharing $$$ equally.  Don't you feel silly hating an idea that someone in your formative years told you was "Bad" and yet in truth you know absolutely nothing about.  And if so how can you be confident that you are any less brainwashed then some poor North Korean, devoted to her or his Dear Leader.  Read about it and then hate it for what it is and you will be respected for that.
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cods
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #4 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 8:23am
 
ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 7:42am:
cods wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 7:05am:
theres an old saying..

A FOOL AND HIS MONEY ARE SOON PARTED..

if all the money on the planet was divided equally today..

it would be just as uneven tomorrow..

I WONDER WHY> Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


check how many lottery winners have lost or got rid of the lot...in very short time.. Cool

Its like your view of socialism stopped in the 1960 with the cold war propaganda and you never bothered to actually research it yourself to see what it really is. I'm not saying that if you did some of your own research you would like it anymore but at least you would disagree with it for your own informed reasons instead of for misconceived reasons deliberately planted by others intent on deluding you. You really do need to do some reading otherwise you'll just continue looking foolish with comments like the one below. Socialism isn't about sharing $$$ equally.  Don't you feel silly hating an idea that someone in your formative years told you was "Bad" and yet in truth you know absolutely nothing about.  And if so how can you be confident that you are any less brainwashed then some poor North Korean, devoted to her or his Dear Leader.  Read about it and then hate it for what it is and you will be respected for that. 



lucky for me I dont give a stuff what someone like you thinks.. all very nice being puffed up about what you consider to be socialism.. look in the real world.. and open your eyes.. it is but a dream....

why because you are greedy just like the capitalist you point your ugly finger at.....you want to be paid for every hour you toil.. not only that you want to be paid for the hours you dont toil..you want the govt to give you everything.. for FREE.. Einstein had a dream.. what he dint say was.. who was going to pay for the peasants who couldnt work those that are sick or get damaged

read it properly.. and you will see it is all about ME...as long as I have a job.get paid.do I really care if the other persons work is harder worse dirtier than mine.. of course not.. a miner should be equal with the cupcake maker...

if we all earn the same.. who will do the worst jobs... or wont they exist in your socialist world.. Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

I suggest you go and count the number of times the word economy is mentioned... as well.

sadly without $$$$$$ your perfect world wont exist for long.

but it is a fact.
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Swagman
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #5 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 8:53am
 
Can't agree with Albert.

The inherent dangers of Socialism far outweigh the drawbacks of Capitalism.

Quote:
how is it possible, in view of the far-reaching centralization of political and economic power, to prevent bureaucracy from becoming all-powerful and overweening? How can the rights of the individual be protected and therewith a democratic counterweight to the power of bureaucracy be assured?


In short.  It can't.

Quote:
This crippling of individuals I consider the worst evil of capitalism


The opposite is true.

Socialism cripples individualism and Capitalism embraces it.

Socialism is basically doomed unless all individuals are selfless which isn't going to happen naturally.

Selflessness in the main from an individual will be limited to their family and friends.

Quote:
Man is, at one and the same time, a solitary being and a social being. As a solitary being, he attempts to protect his own existence and that of those who are closest to him, to satisfy his personal desires, and to develop his innate abilities.


I have to wonder if Albert would write the same words today having witnessed the collapse of most of the socialist dictatorships going around.  Sad
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ImSpartacus2
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #6 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 8:55am
 
cods wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 8:23am:
ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 7:42am:
cods wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 7:05am:
theres an old saying..

A FOOL AND HIS MONEY ARE SOON PARTED..

if all the money on the planet was divided equally today..

it would be just as uneven tomorrow..

I WONDER WHY> Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


check how many lottery winners have lost or got rid of the lot...in very short time.. Cool

Its like your view of socialism stopped in the 1960 with the cold war propaganda and you never bothered to actually research it yourself to see what it really is. I'm not saying that if you did some of your own research you would like it anymore but at least you would disagree with it for your own informed reasons instead of for misconceived reasons deliberately planted by others intent on deluding you. You really do need to do some reading otherwise you'll just continue looking foolish with comments like the one below. Socialism isn't about sharing $$$ equally.  Don't you feel silly hating an idea that someone in your formative years told you was "Bad" and yet in truth you know absolutely nothing about.  And if so how can you be confident that you are any less brainwashed then some poor North Korean, devoted to her or his Dear Leader.  Read about it and then hate it for what it is and you will be respected for that. 



lucky for me I dont give a stuff what someone like you thinks.. all very nice being puffed up about what you consider to be socialism.. look in the real world.. and open your eyes.. it is but a dream....

why because you are greedy just like the capitalist you point your ugly finger at.....you want to be paid for every hour you toil.. not only that you want to be paid for the hours you dont toil..you want the govt to give you everything.. for FREE.. Einstein had a dream.. what he dint say was.. who was going to pay for the peasants who couldnt work those that are sick or get damaged

read it properly.. and you will see it is all about ME...as long as I have a job.get paid.do I really care if the other persons work is harder worse dirtier than mine.. of course not.. a miner should be equal with the cupcake maker...

if we all earn the same.. who will do the worst jobs... or wont they exist in your socialist world.. Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

I suggest you go and count the number of times the word economy is mentioned... as well.

sadly without $$$$$$ your perfect world wont exist for long.

but it is a fact.

Oh dear, you really blurt out all that 60s cold war garbage like it was yesterday and haven't done a thing since then to look into it anymore deeply.  I suppose you don't like to be distracted from your daily readings of your indoctrination pack from the Telegraph.  Lots of colour pics of your Dear Leader in that every day I bet.
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #7 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 9:01am
 
OF all the discredited ideologies, why's it always socialism that attracts the social outcasts?  Why not nazism, or...anything really?  It's hard to find a more bloodthirsty, murderous ideology than socialism.  Maybe the (erroneous) prospect of revenge on the cruel world is precisely what entices these bitter, disaffected losers.

Perhaps Einsteins folly can be explained and forgiven - the worst massacres of socialism came after this was written, and an aspie like him is bound to feel bitter and disaffected. 

Listen to him on matters of physics and the like, but you'd have to be a complete and utter moron to think an aspies commentary on social matters would be of any value.
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« Last Edit: Jan 6th, 2014 at 9:08am by ... »  

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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #8 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 9:14am
 
He describes all of history as a "predatory" phase and says socialism is better because it's goal is to overcome that, yet he does not bother to explain how it actually achieves that. We have enough problems with dole bludgers under our current system. I don't see how giving more to people and demanding less from them is going to improve that situation. If capitalism is predatory, socialism is parasitic. But we cannot all be parasites. He throws around some lofty ideals, but that's about it. I would not expect any great insight into physics from Keynes and I don't understand why people expect any insight from Einstein on economics or other random topics.
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #9 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 9:23am
 
The irony is that Einstein would not have been allowed an opinion in many of the socialist led governments of earlier years. Adolf was indeed a socialist (The Nationalist Socialist German Workers Party) and used the german economic crisis after WW1 to further his ambitions which would ultimately lead to Einstein seeking refuge in capitalist America, or alternatively returning to his homeland to be sent to a concentration camp.
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Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
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ImSpartacus2
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #10 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 9:30am
 
Swagman wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 8:53am:
Can't agree with Albert.

The inherent dangers of Socialism far outweigh the drawbacks of Capitalism.

Don't agree


Quote:
how is it possible, in view of the far-reaching centralization of political and economic power, to prevent bureaucracy from becoming all-powerful and overweening? How can the rights of the individual be protected and therewith a democratic counterweight to the power of bureaucracy be assured?


In short.  It can't.

IMO Einstein is right on the $$$ here.  But I think that recent history has shown that this is just as much a danger with capitalism as it is with socialism.  Obama gets into power and what does he do - Continue the same policies as Bush. Why? Because the people running the show there are the bureaucracy (under the direction of the $$$ elite of course) and a change of government means something at the edges but not a lot with regard to the substance.  And this is the same in the US, Italy japan and in virtually every modern capitalist state in the world.  So whats the solution. I believe it is direct democracy, where we make the decisions (not choose representatives to make them for us) and thereby protect ourselves from capitalist and socialist totalitarian rule


Quote:
This crippling of individuals I consider the worst evil of capitalism


The opposite is true. Socialism cripples individualism and Capitalism embraces it.

No can't agree.  The opposite is true IMO.


Socialism is basically doomed unless all individuals are selfless which isn't going to happen naturally.

You need to read Albert's article more closely. If you recall he was saying that we are a mixture of both and that nevertheless socialism is the better solution for us.  Of course he could be wrong but you need to say why rather then simply repeating an unsupported assertion that only selfless individuals can make socialism work (which IMO is a common misconception in people of our age group because of cold war propaganda that still remains with us today)


Selflessness in the main from an individual will be limited to their family and friends.

Not sure whether this is true or not but as i say socialism does nto depend on selflessness to make it work,


Quote:
Man is, at one and the same time, a solitary being and a social being. As a solitary being, he attempts to protect his own existence and that of those who are closest to him, to satisfy his personal desires, and to develop his innate abilities.


I have to wonder if Albert would write the same words today having witnessed the collapse of most of the socialist dictatorships going around. 

Of course he would write the same today since he was so spot on then about what would happen to capitalism and our pretend democratic systems run by the elite. If you don't want to re-read the article, read the quote that Pansi has reproduced in this thread. And don't forget that capitalism has collapsed at least twice in the last 80 years and the only reason we still have it today is because the rich pilfered the taxpayers coffers (a socialist solution BTW) and resuscitated it again. And our so called democratic system has been non existent for many years now. 
Sad

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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #11 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 9:35am
 
ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 8:55am:
cods wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 8:23am:
ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 7:42am:
cods wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 7:05am:
theres an old saying..

A FOOL AND HIS MONEY ARE SOON PARTED..

if all the money on the planet was divided equally today..

it would be just as uneven tomorrow..

I WONDER WHY> Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


check how many lottery winners have lost or got rid of the lot...in very short time.. Cool

Its like your view of socialism stopped in the 1960 with the cold war propaganda and you never bothered to actually research it yourself to see what it really is. I'm not saying that if you did some of your own research you would like it anymore but at least you would disagree with it for your own informed reasons instead of for misconceived reasons deliberately planted by others intent on deluding you. You really do need to do some reading otherwise you'll just continue looking foolish with comments like the one below. Socialism isn't about sharing $$$ equally.  Don't you feel silly hating an idea that someone in your formative years told you was "Bad" and yet in truth you know absolutely nothing about.  And if so how can you be confident that you are any less brainwashed then some poor North Korean, devoted to her or his Dear Leader.  Read about it and then hate it for what it is and you will be respected for that. 



lucky for me I dont give a stuff what someone like you thinks.. all very nice being puffed up about what you consider to be socialism.. look in the real world.. and open your eyes.. it is but a dream....

why because you are greedy just like the capitalist you point your ugly finger at.....you want to be paid for every hour you toil.. not only that you want to be paid for the hours you dont toil..you want the govt to give you everything.. for FREE.. Einstein had a dream.. what he dint say was.. who was going to pay for the peasants who couldnt work those that are sick or get damaged

read it properly.. and you will see it is all about ME...as long as I have a job.get paid.do I really care if the other persons work is harder worse dirtier than mine.. of course not.. a miner should be equal with the cupcake maker...

if we all earn the same.. who will do the worst jobs... or wont they exist in your socialist world.. Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

I suggest you go and count the number of times the word economy is mentioned... as well.

sadly without $$$$$$ your perfect world wont exist for long.

but it is a fact.

Oh dear, you really blurt out all that 60s cold war garbage like it was yesterday and haven't done a thing since then to look into it anymore deeply.  I suppose you don't like to be distracted from your daily readings of your indoctrination pack from the Telegraph.  Lots of colour pics of your Dear Leader in that every day I bet. 




TELL ME WHAT HAS CHANGED... FOR THE BETTERMENT OF MANKIND.. SINCE THE 60s????


JUST ONE THING WILL DO>>.



your judgemental ego wouldnt have thats for sure..
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #12 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 9:43am
 
viewpoint wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 9:23am:
The irony is that Einstein would not have been allowed an opinion in many of the socialist led governments of earlier years. Adolf was indeed a socialist (The Nationalist Socialist German Workers Party) and used the german economic crisis after WW1 to further his ambitions which would ultimately lead to Einstein seeking refuge in capitalist America, or alternatively returning to his homeland to be sent to a concentration camp.




ahhhh and he tried to exterminate the Jews who were considered the worst of capitalists..in the extreme..and NOW LOOK AT GERMANY.. Roll Eyes Roll Eyes.. its basically propping up Europe..how you ask?? oh thats right MONEY... not sharing the work so all can live equal..
in that perfect world.
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #13 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 9:56am
 
....
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« Last Edit: Jan 6th, 2014 at 10:17am by ImSpartacus2 »  
 
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ImSpartacus2
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Re: Why Socialism By Albert Einstein
Reply #14 - Jan 6th, 2014 at 10:11am
 
... wrote on Jan 6th, 2014 at 9:01am:
OF all the discredited ideologies, why's it always socialism that attracts the social outcasts?  Why not nazism, or...anything really?  It's hard to find a more bloodthirsty, murderous ideology than socialism.  Maybe the (erroneous) prospect of revenge on the cruel world is precisely what entices these bitter, disaffected losers.

Perhaps Einsteins folly can be explained and forgiven - the worst massacres of socialism came after this was written, and an aspie like him is bound to feel bitter and disaffected. 

Listen to him on matters of physics and the like, but you'd have to be a complete and utter moron to think an aspies commentary on social matters would be of any value.


Your confusing socialism (the economic system) with the totalitarian governments (the political systems) that have at times accompanied it.   It would be like me arguing that capitalism doesn't work because of all the brutal military capitalist totalitarian dictatorships that have existed in the world like Pinochet's Chile, Hitlers Germany(and there's very few more murderous then this guy), Hussain's Iraq, Papa Doc in Haiti and Idi Amin in Uganda and the list goes on.  At the same time quasi socialist states like Norway, Sweden, Switzerland have IMO functioned far better then this country and tend to be as wealthy if not wealthier and do not depend for their wealth on almost exclusively digging things out of the ground.    
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