Australian Politics Forum - The Evolution of Islam

Yadda

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #150 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 10:55am

Karnal wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 10:52am:

Yadda wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 2:11am:

Karnal wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 12:34am:

polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 28^th, 2013 at 9:03pm:

Yadda wrote on Jun 28^th, 2013 at 7:55pm:

The 'Palestinians' are ethnic Jordanians.

The 'Palestinians' have a homeland.

And, so do the Jewish people.

Yadda, serious question: what are your feelings of the Palestinian christian population who have been the caretakers of christendom's most holy sites for hundreds of years - many of whom have been forced to flee because of the Israeli occupation. Are they just intruders who should get on their bike back to Jordan?

As to this slogan of yours, technically I, and most Australians are ethnically British. Should we all pack up and ship back to the UK?

My view is that I am every bit as "native" as the blackest Aboriginal - because both of us were born here. Likewise, the Palestinian population that was uprooted in 1948 was native in the sense that most of them had been born there, and could claim heritage to that land.

And what does "ethnically Jordanian" even mean? Jordan wasn't even created until 1922 - and it was an entirely artificial construct, created for British imperialist purposes. Is there even any such thing as "ethnically jordan"?? Linguistically, Lebanese, Syrian, Jordanian and Palestinian arabs are basically identical. There may not even be such a thing as a "Palestinian" ethnicity - but there most certainly was such a thing as Palestinian homes, farms and property that had existed for generations before their owners were forced to abandon them to make way for the creation of the jewish state. Dismissing these owners as "ethnically Jordanian" doesn't make up for the loss these people have suffered.

You’re asking Y these questions, G?

This is a soul who literally believes Leviticus is modern history.

K,

Why do you fear/hate Leviticus so much ?

Have you, done anything wrong ?

Leviticus 18:22
Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

Leviticus 20:13
If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Those Torah laws were/are only applicable for a people who were/are in-covenant with their God.

The outer heathen nations, and heathens [like yourself K], had their own laws. Grin

....LOL, as if!!!

Revelation 22:14
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

.....who could Jesus be talking about, K ?

Not sure, Y. Who wrote the Book of Revelation?

Paul is hardly an expert on international law, eh?

John wrote the book of Revelation.

Revelation 1:1
The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Karnal Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 98302	Re: The Evolution of Islam Reply #151 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 10:58am So. Moslems are savages. They cannot be given the right to live among decent human beings. Support the two state solution, do you, Y? Blessed are the peacemakers.
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Yadda

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #152 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:15am

Karnal wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 10:58am:

So. Moslems are savages. They cannot be given the right to live among decent human beings.

No, they cannot.

Not while moslems choose to embrace a savage, lawless, philosophy like ISLAM.

ISLAM sanctifies and makes lawlessness among men, lawful !

ISLAM sanctifies and makes lawful - rape, murder, robbery, lying, deceit !

Lovely! NOT!!!!!

Quote:

Support the two state solution, do you, Y?

They have Jordan, as a homeland.

The homeland of the Jewish people, is Israel.

e.g. K,
Ever heard of that historic local - JUDEA ????i Quote:

Blessed are the peacemakers.

Indeed [seriously].

K,

Do you believe that you can make peace, establish peace among men, by appeasing wicked men ?

Is that how YOU propose to establish peace in the world, K ?

Are you proposing that every time that you are in dispute with a wicked person, that you will give them what they wish - so as to 'secure' peace with them ?

e.g.
If a wicked person is in dispute WITH YOUR CHILD, and [the wicked person] unilaterally decides to murder your child [to settle the dispute], are YOU going to agree to that circumstance K ?

p.s.

K.

Go to hell!

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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polite_gandalf

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #153 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:28am

freediver wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:45am:

during the 14 years of its operation, 110,000 Jews immigrated to Palestine

First of all, I wasn't talking about the 14 years, I was talking about the entire inter-war period - ~1918-1948. During that time the jewish population went from around 60k to over 600k

freediver wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:45am:

So tell us Gandalf, which one looks more significant to you? People (especially Muslims) like to associate Israel with European interference and the aftermath of the holocaust, yet it was Arabs themselves who contributed most to it.

What are you talking about? Israel was created in 1948 - the jewish exodus from the arab world didn't even start until after that. Of course the creation of Israel was only possible by the mass exodus of jews from Europe - that enabled them to become a majority of the population in certain key centres.

freediver wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:45am:

Apparently they mistook it for a concentration camp.

It is trully pathetic when people attempt to draw some sort of moral equivalence between the muslim and European treatment of jews. Perhaps you can enlighten me and show me the muslim gas chambers and the 4+ million dead jews at the hands of the muslims?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Yadda

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #154 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:29am

Yadda wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:15am:

Are you proposing that every time that you are in dispute with a wicked person, that you will give them what they wish - so as to 'secure' peace with them ?

e.g.
If a wicked person is in dispute WITH YOUR CHILD, and [the wicked person] unilaterally decides to murder your child [to settle the dispute], are YOU going to agree to that circumstance K ?

Exodus 4:22
.....Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Yadda

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #155 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:36am

polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:28am:

freediver wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:45am:

Apparently they mistook it for a concentration camp.

It is trully pathetic when people attempt to draw some sort of moral equivalence between the muslim and European treatment of jews.

Perhaps you can enlighten me and show me the muslim gas chambers and the 4+ million dead jews at the hands of the muslims?

g,

Do moslems admit their errors, their wrong doings ?

Oh! Of course they do! Tongue

Moslems always tell the truth, moslems never, ever, re-write history, to hide their crimes. Tongue

Moslem have NEVER, EVER, done such a thing, have they! Tongue

Armenian genocide.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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polite_gandalf

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #156 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:37am

Yadda wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 10:18am:

Palestinians' cannot live along side the Jewish people, because many of the 'Palestinians' act like moslems.

i.e.
Wherever moslems [moslem communities] live, moslems cannot help themselves, but feel compelled to engage in committing 'lawful' atrocities, slaughtering both, other moslems and non-moslems.

Perhaps you can clear up my confusion then Yadda: there are currently around 1.6 million muslims living amongst the jews with full Israeli citizen rights. You may recall our zionist friend Avram giving a glowing account of how well they are integrated and how famously they get on with the jews.

How could this be Y? Shouldn't the jewish state have collapsed long ago by the "lawful" atrocities of these 5th columnists - going around slaughtering jews at every opportunity? How on earth could this state have survived with 20% of the population comprising of these "savages" who adhere to only one law: death and violence against non-muslims?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Yadda

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #157 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:46am

Yadda wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:36am:

polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:28am:

freediver wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:45am:

Apparently they mistook it for a concentration camp.

It is trully pathetic when people attempt to draw some sort of moral equivalence between the muslim and European treatment of jews.

Perhaps you can enlighten me and show me the muslim gas chambers and the 4+ million dead jews at the hands of the muslims?

g,

Do moslems admit their errors, their wrong doings ?

Oh! Of course they do! Tongue

Moslems always tell the truth, moslems never, ever, re-write history, to hide their crimes. Tongue

Moslem have NEVER, EVER, done such a thing, have they! Tongue

Armenian genocide.

ALL moslems, are idolaters!!!!!!

It is true. Tongue

Moslems CLAIM that they worship a god called Allah.

But in truth, moslems all put on their rose coloured glasses, and worship a god called 'Kumbaya, lord'.

Honest.

Allah ?

Spit, spit!!!!!!!

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Adamant

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #158 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:48am

I like Golda Meir's quotes regarding that mythical place palestine.

"There were no such thing as Palestinians. When was there an independent Palestinian people with a Palestinian state? It was either southern Syria before the First World War, and then it was a Palestine including Jordan. It was not as though there was a Palestinian people in Palestine considering itself as a Palestinian people and we came and threw them out and took their country away from them. They did not exist".

And ain't these eternal truths

"Peace will come to the Middle East when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us".

"We don’t thrive on military acts. We do them because we have to, and thank God we are efficient.

This last says it all.

"Any one who speaks in favor of bringing the Arab refugees back must also say how he expects to take the responsibility for it, if he is interested in the state of Israel. It is better that things are stated clearly and plainly: We shall not let this happen"

"

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In real life Gandalf is known as Mr 10%

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polite_gandalf

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #159 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:50am

Yadda wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:36am:

Do moslems admit their errors, their wrong doings ?

Oh! Of course they do! Tongue

Moslems always tell the truth, moslems never, ever, re-write history, to hide their crimes.

Sort of reminds me of when I drew a comparison between the conquest of Jerusalem by the muslims, and the christians. Sparing of civilians and granting of religious freedom, versus wholesale slaughter of civilians and denial of jewish or muslim religious freedom. You dismissed it as muslim revisionism, yet never explained how the historical account is wrong. I have never read a historical account - muslim or non-muslim - that disputes the core elements of this version.

So we have here now a contention about the validity of comparing the scale of the holocaust to the scale of any single muslim atrocity against the jews throughout the history of jewish-muslim relations - and we get this such obvious diversion about the Armenian genocide and what not. Never mind the fact that I have never attempted to justify or whitewash muslim atrocities - such as the Armenian tragedy - rendering the entire point an irrelevant strawman.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Yadda

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #160 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:56am

polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:37am:

Yadda wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 10:18am:

Palestinians' cannot live along side the Jewish people, because many of the 'Palestinians' act like moslems.

i.e.
Wherever moslems [moslem communities] live, moslems cannot help themselves, but feel compelled to engage in committing 'lawful' atrocities, slaughtering both, other moslems and non-moslems.

Perhaps you can clear up my confusion then Yadda: there are currently around 1.6 million muslims living amongst the jews with full Israeli citizen rights. You may recall our zionist friend Avram giving a glowing account of how well they are integrated and how famously they get on with the jews.

How could this be Y? Shouldn't the jewish state have collapsed long ago by the "lawful" atrocities of these 5th columnists - going around slaughtering jews at every opportunity? How on earth could this state have survived with 20% of the population comprising of these "savages" who adhere to only one law: death and violence against non-muslims?

g,

Clearly, it is Israeli laws, which are protecting, .......the Israelis, from the 'affections' of many of those moslems.

It is commonly known among us, that moslems are told by their imams/ISLAM that Jews are apes, that may be 'lawfully' killed.

So it is NOT, the good intentions, of Israeli moslems that is causing Israeli moslems to treat Israeli Jews with lawful respect.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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polite_gandalf

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #161 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:58am

Adamant wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:48am:

There were no such thing as Palestinians. When was there an independent Palestinian people with a Palestinian state? It was either southern Syria before the First World War, and then it was a Palestine including Jordan. It was not as though there was a Palestinian people in Palestine considering itself as a Palestinian people and we came and threw them out and took their country away from them. They did not exist

This misses the point I have been trying to make.

There were people living in what is now Israel - and who are no longer living there because of the creation of Israel. Their property and livelihoods had to be abandoned to facilitate the creation of Israel, and most of these people became refugees, living in limbo as stateless people to this very day. Whether these people were called "Palestinians" or "Syrians" or "Jordanians" matters not a damn thing to this fact.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Yadda

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #162 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:58am

polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

Yadda wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:36am:

Do moslems admit their errors, their wrong doings ?

Oh! Of course they do! Tongue

Moslems always tell the truth, moslems never, ever, re-write history, to hide their crimes.

Sort of reminds me of when I drew a comparison between the conquest of Jerusalem by the muslims,......

Err, ancient history, which was re-written, by, .......moslems, to make who, look good ?

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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polite_gandalf

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #163 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 12:01pm

Yadda wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:56am:

Clearly, it is Israeli laws, which are protecting, .......the Israelis, from the 'affections' of many of those moslems.

No Yadda, thats a complete copout. If 1.6 million people - 20% of the population really were as determined in their savagery as you make out, nothing - least of all Israeli laws - would be able to keep them in check. Israel is a prosperous nation with a first world economy. The Arab component of that state is not only coexisting, they are actively contributing to its prosperity. As Avram said, these people are holding high positions in the Israeli Armed Forces. Why don't they shoot a few jews in the back? Wouldn't be that hard.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Karnal

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Re: The Evolution of Islam
Reply #164 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 12:05pm

Yadda wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:15am:

Karnal wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 10:58am:

So. Moslems are savages. They cannot be given the right to live among decent human beings.

No, they cannot.

Not while moslems choose to embrace a savage, lawless, philosophy like ISLAM.

ISLAM sanctifies and makes lawlessness among men, lawful !

ISLAM sanctifies and makes lawful - rape, murder, robbery, lying, deceit !

Lovely! NOT!!!!!

Quote:

Support the two state solution, do you, Y?

They have Jordan, as a homeland.

The homeland of the Jewish people, is Israel.

e.g. K,
Ever heard of that historic local - JUDEA ????i Quote:

Blessed are the peacemakers.

Indeed [seriously].

K,

Do you believe that you can make peace, establish peace among men, by appeasing wicked men ?

Is that how YOU propose to establish peace in the world, K ?

Are you proposing that every time that you are in dispute with a wicked person, that you will give them what they wish - so as to 'secure' peace with them ?

e.g.
If a wicked person is in dispute WITH YOUR CHILD, and [the wicked person] unilaterally decides to murder your child [to settle the dispute], are YOU going to agree to that circumstance K ?

p.s.

K.

Go to hell!

You sound a bit angry there, Y. Bad night?

How do you apply your anti-wickedness strategy to Israel? The Moslems are inside the tent, as it were. They’re part of Israel’s body politic.

What do you do with them?

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