Australian Politics Forum - the Sydney protests

abu_rashid

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Re: the Sydney protests
Reply #30 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:21am

Emma wrote on Sep 21^st, 2012 at 12:18am:

Frankly I think the whole thing was so badly handled by authorities, that they have in fact painted the picture, for more to follow.

I really hope that the malicious few realise that there is nothing to gain, and everything to lose by following that path.
Let wiser heads prevail.

Emma, unfortunately the police are in a win-win situation. They know that by provoking the Muslims they will get a reaction (sadly) and they know the media (and therefore public opinion) will instantly side with them. And they will come out the heroes of the day.

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abu_rashid

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Re: the Sydney protests
Reply #31 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:24am

Bobby. wrote on Sep 21^st, 2012 at 12:28am:

Yes Emma - it's the fault of the police for turning up.

Ignore the religious nutters & they will go away.

Bobby, the protesters did not commit any acts of aggression until the police became heavy handed with them. Yes their response was not the correct one, but what else do you expect them to do when their peaceful protest was met with pepper spray and police heavy handedness?

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freediver

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Re: the Sydney protests
Reply #32 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 8:22am

Quote:

It is inappropriate to display such signs in a country with a legal system that does not implement capital punishment, and which considers such punishment to be unjust.

Would it be appropriate in places like the US that do have capital punishment and consider it just?

Was there anything inappropriate about the reference to blasphemy, or was it only the reference to the punishment that was inappropriate?

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There's just simply no need for such signs, as the ones carrying them do not live under an Islamic system, and therefore even speaking about Islamic punishments is just nonsensical.

You speak about Islamic punishments here quite often. Do you make sense?

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The debate, in reality, is about peddling xenophobic garbage in order to justify the government's actions here and abroad.

So it has nothing to do with freedom of speech and blasphemy? It has nothing to do with that video that insulted Muhammed? Were the Muslims just pretending to be upset about that?

Emma:

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Indeed there are deep things behind this 'protest', but I say again, the people....all the people involved, were dupes and pawns.

Are you allowed to talk about these deep things? Or only the superficial platitudes you keep trotting out?

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AND -- I find it suss and offensive that the US Embassy warned 'it's citizens' to stay away.

Several Americans have been killed in the protests around the world. It would be irresponsible for them not to warn people. If a non-Muslims American had wandered into that group I can't imagine them coming out unharmed.

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BECAUSE... if we , as Australians, truly reject such public displays of religious fervour

I don't think Australians get particularly wound up about public displays of religious fervour. You seem to be missing the point again.

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Got to stop it now, or end up with untold unending conflict..

Stop it how? By ignoring it and hoping it goes away? That sounds a bit naive to me. Don't you agree that it seems naive?

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By participating in the conflict we , in effect, agree with 'conflict'. Willing participants.

Is it a bad thing to willingly stand up for human rights like freedom of speech?

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Big Dave

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Re: the Sydney protests
Reply #33 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 5:53pm

abu_rashid wrote on Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:24am:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 21^st, 2012 at 12:28am:

Yes Emma - it's the fault of the police for turning up.

Ignore the religious nutters & they will go away.

Bobby, the protesters did not commit any acts of aggression until the police became heavy handed with them. Yes their response was not the correct one, but what else do you expect them to do when their peaceful protest was met with pepper spray and police heavy handedness?

They were never going to do anything until the cops arrived. HAHAHAHA!!! How do you know they weren't going to do anything. So when they got to the American Consulate they weren't going to smash the place up hey. How can you peddle such crap? You muslims always stick up for your bros and sisters no matter what and place the blame somewhere else.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49968 At my desk.	Re: the Sydney protests Reply #34 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:11pm Isn't it obvious? They even had signs to let everyone know they were calling for murder, not vandalism. The must have been the peaceful variety of Muslims.
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Big Dave Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 2164 Gender:	Re: the Sydney protests Reply #35 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:18pm The same opinion "that the cops were to blame" is a very common opinion on Aussie Muslim Freediver. Abu has offered his denial. The moderator of the website believes that non-muslims handed out the signs to cause problems. Unbelievable.
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49968 At my desk.	Re: the Sydney protests Reply #36 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:29pm Is that true Abu? Do you also believe the Muslims were tricked into marching behind signs calling for beheadings?
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Emma

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Re: the Sydney protests
Reply #37 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:41pm

Emma:

Quote:

Indeed there are deep things behind this 'protest', but I say again, the people....all the people involved, were dupes and pawns.

Are you allowed to talk about these deep things? Or only the superficial platitudes you keep trotting out?

Some people wish to incite a Holy war.

Quote:

AND -- I find it suss and offensive that the US Embassy warned 'it's citizens' to stay away.

Several Americans have been killed in the protests around the world. It would be irresponsible for them not to warn people. If a non-Muslims American had wandered into that group I can't imagine them coming out unharmed.

The US now say these deaths were the acts of terrorists, who used the protests as cover.

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BECAUSE... if we , as Australians, truly reject such public displays of religious fervour

I don't think Australians get particularly wound up about public displays of religious fervour. You seem to be missing the point again.

Huh? if Aussies don't get 'wound up' what is all the fuss about hmm?

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Got to stop it now, or end up with untold unending conflict..

Stop it how? By ignoring it and hoping it goes away? That sounds a bit naive to me. Don't you agree that it seems naive?

Yes - it does... sadly. But one can only try

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By participating in the conflict we , in effect, agree with 'conflict'. Willing participants.

Is it a bad thing to willingly stand up for human rights like freedom of speech? [/quote]

Huh ? again.. who was it who was standing up for freedom of speech?. I think you've got it all arse about face. .... were not the demonstrators exercising freedom of expression?

So, I prefer not to repeat myself too often. I really think this thread is a good example of the breadth of opinion on these types of incidents, but how about giving it a rest now eh?

You obviously cannot see beyond your own hatred, so nothing said to you will make any difference. I have explained to you as best I can. I hope you have gained something from it. Have a good day.

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Postmodern Trendoid III Gold Member Offline Posts: 10266 Gender:	Re: the Sydney protests Reply #38 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:45pm Emma Peel, Does the logic of blaming the cops for the riot work with the Cronulla riot? Maybe if we just ignored them then it would have gone away?
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Big Dave Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 2164 Gender:	Re: the Sydney protests Reply #39 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:50pm Imagine being a cop caught up in that mess and now is getting blamed. I'd quit.
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Emma Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 9853 OZ Gender:	Re: the Sydney protests Reply #40 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:58pm I doubt the controller of the Police involved was on the line. The riot in Cronulla was much larger and more widespread, so I think it was appropriate in those circumstances.
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Big Dave Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 2164 Gender:	Re: the Sydney protests Reply #41 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 7:04pm Do you know about the second half of the cronulla riot Emma. do you know about the multiple bashings and stabbings.
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Bobby.

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Re: the Sydney protests
Reply #42 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 7:15pm

abu_rashid wrote on Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:24am:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 21^st, 2012 at 12:28am:

Yes Emma - it's the fault of the police for turning up.

Ignore the religious nutters & they will go away.

Bobby, the protesters did not commit any acts of aggression until the police became heavy handed with them. Yes their response was not the correct one, but what else do you expect them to do when their peaceful protest was met with pepper spray and police heavy handedness?

Well Abu,
I don't understand it.
Not one TV or radio report has given a reason why police turned up.
It's like trolls on forums - you ignore them & they go away.

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Soren

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Re: the Sydney protests
Reply #43 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 8:49pm

abu_rashid wrote on Sep 21^st, 2012 at 6:24am:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 21^st, 2012 at 12:28am:

Yes Emma - it's the fault of the police for turning up.

Ignore the religious nutters & they will go away.

Bobby, the protesters did not commit any acts of aggression until the police became heavy handed with them. Yes their response was not the correct one, but what else do you expect them to do when their peaceful protest was met with pepper spray and police heavy handedness?

hey, Bearded Bozo, when the police say stop, you stop. When they say desist, you desist.

Nobody gives a flying bugger about you being a Muslim getting emotionally incontinent over some smacking cartoons or a vid. You obey police directions. You don't, they will make you.

Is this difficult for you? Evidently.

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freediver

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Re: the Sydney protests
Reply #44 - Sep 21^st, 2012 at 9:26pm

Quote:

Some people wish to incite a Holy war.

Sorry, is that the deep insight, or the superficial tripe?

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The US now say these deaths were the acts of terrorists, who used the protests as cover.

What is the difference between a terrorist and a Muslim who kills Americans because he hates their freedoms?

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Huh? if Aussies don't get 'wound up' what is all the fuss about hmm?

The point I was trying to make, which you are apparently oblivious to, was what they get wound up about. Beheading blasphemers is something you should take notice of, not ignore and hope it goes away. Apathy is not always a good thing. Just ask the Germans.

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Yes - it does... sadly. But one can only try

OK, so it seems naive. Do you also agree that it actually is naive?

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Huh ? again.. who was it who was standing up for freedom of speech?.

Everyone who objects to 400 people marching through Sydney calling for blasphemers to be beheaded.

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I really think this thread is a good example of the breadth of opinion on these types of incidents, but how about giving it a rest now eh?

There is more to debate than everyone giving an empty headed opinion then moving on because it is all too complicated.

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You obviously cannot see beyond your own hatred

What hatred would that be? Is this another excuse for not thinking, not debating, just offering worthless opinions and moving on to the next worthless opinion?

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Not one TV or radio report has given a reason why police turned up.

Probably because it was obvious to anyone with half a brain - 400 Muslims marching through Sydney calling for murder and descending on the US embassy, several Americans already dead overseas over the crappy youtube video. Fortunately for us the police strategy goes beyond ignoring it and hoping it will go away, while admitting it is hopelessly naive but insisting we do nothing anyway.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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