Australian Politics Forum - Why R Homos and Greens so rude?

longweekend58

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Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude?
Reply #360 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 5:19pm

MOTR wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 4:03pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 3:16pm:

MOTR wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 3:11pm:

If you wanted to argue both are unacceptable in the eyes of God, you would have an argument in a faith based community. We live in a secular community, thank God for that.

You really have no idea what the rest of us are talking about, do you?

I'm not entirely sure what you are on about. Incest and pedophilia are illegal in Australia. The argument for same sex marriages is that homosexual relationships are legal and in a secular society, separate from the laws of the church, homosexual citizens should have the same right to marry as do heterosexual citizens.

it is EXTREMELY hard to get you to understand this so let me try YET again just as several others have already tried.

A) this is not a debate about the pros and cons of gay marriage
B) it IS about the argument itself and the way it is done
C) the basic points of the pro-gay marriage argument are so weak as to easily also apply to supporting incest.

I dont know what is so hard abotu this except that perhaps it is the perennial problem: almost anyone can make an argument and hold an opinion on a particularl instance of a problem. But when asked to turn this into a principle they all go to water. Probably the hardest thing to ever discuss on here is a PRINCIPLED ARGUMENT. and this is a perfect example. What we are talking about is the PRINCIPLE of the points made in support of gay marriage. It is if you want a hypothetcical debate requiring you to think beyond what you see at the moment.

frankly, the problem appears to be that the mere notion of a discussion of principle or indeed any topic that requires someone to think becomes too hard. This has been explained multiple times before in this thread and yet still people cannot understand it.

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longweekend58

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Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude?
Reply #361 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 5:20pm

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 3:46pm:

longweekend is indulging in an argument much favoured by opponents of social reform.

They take a proposed change, exaggerate it to the nth degree and then argue that because the exaggeration is unacceptable therefore so is the original proposal.

This is the argument of the desperate who have nothing more logical to offer.

As a liberal who has no problem with either homosexuality or gay marriage I ask little of people like longweekend. They have a right to disapprove of homosexuality, never make a friend of a homosexual or invite one into their home.

They have a right to disapprove of gay marriage, never enter into one, never attend one or have one conducted in their backyard next to the chookhouse.

But they do not have the right to demand others be governed by THEIR morality or deny people equality before the law.

If they find they are not comfortable in a society which allows gay marriage then they have a choice. They can leave. Saudi Arabia is quite pleasant at this time of year.

if you had the slightest clue what this discussion is your'd hang your head in shame at your idiotic post. Unfortunately there are only three people on here whom I think of when the topic comes to PRINCIPLED positions: myself FD and dsmithy. the rest of you wouldnt know a principle if it attacked you.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude?
Reply #362 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 5:23pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 5:19pm:

MOTR wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 4:03pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 3:16pm:

MOTR wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 3:11pm:

If you wanted to argue both are unacceptable in the eyes of God, you would have an argument in a faith based community. We live in a secular community, thank God for that.

You really have no idea what the rest of us are talking about, do you?

I'm not entirely sure what you are on about. Incest and pedophilia are illegal in Australia. The argument for same sex marriages is that homosexual relationships are legal and in a secular society, separate from the laws of the church, homosexual citizens should have the same right to marry as do heterosexual citizens.

it is EXTREMELY hard to get you to understand this so let me try YET again just as several others have already tried.

A) this is not a debate about the pros and cons of gay marriage
B) it IS about the argument itself and the way it is done
C) the basic points of the pro-gay marriage argument are so weak as to easily also apply to supporting incest.

I dont know what is so hard abotu this except that perhaps it is the perennial problem: almost anyone can make an argument and hold an opinion on a particularl instance of a problem. But when asked to turn this into a principle they all go to water. Probably the hardest thing to ever discuss on here is a PRINCIPLED ARGUMENT. and this is a perfect example. What we are talking about is the PRINCIPLE of the points made in support of gay marriage. It is if you want a hypothetcical debate requiring you to think beyond what you see at the moment.

frankly, the problem appears to be that the mere notion of a discussion of principle or indeed any topic that requires someone to think becomes too hard. This has been explained multiple times before in this thread and yet still people cannot understand it.

How abut the PRINCIPLE of equality? Of not being bigoted? Of letting others lead their own lives without interfering?

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MOTR

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Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude?
Reply #363 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 6:57pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 5:19pm:

MOTR wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 4:03pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 3:16pm:

MOTR wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 3:11pm:

If you wanted to argue both are unacceptable in the eyes of God, you would have an argument in a faith based community. We live in a secular community, thank God for that.

You really have no idea what the rest of us are talking about, do you?

I'm not entirely sure what you are on about. Incest and pedophilia are illegal in Australia. The argument for same sex marriages is that homosexual relationships are legal and in a secular society, separate from the laws of the church, homosexual citizens should have the same right to marry as do heterosexual citizens.

it is EXTREMELY hard to get you to understand this so let me try YET again just as several others have already tried.

A) this is not a debate about the pros and cons of gay marriage
B) it IS about the argument itself and the way it is done
C) the basic points of the pro-gay marriage argument are so weak as to easily also apply to supporting incest.

I dont know what is so hard abotu this except that perhaps it is the perennial problem: almost anyone can make an argument and hold an opinion on a particularl instance of a problem. But when asked to turn this into a principle they all go to water. Probably the hardest thing to ever discuss on here is a PRINCIPLED ARGUMENT. and this is a perfect example. What we are talking about is the PRINCIPLE of the points made in support of gay marriage. It is if you want a hypothetcical debate requiring you to think beyond what you see at the moment.

frankly, the problem appears to be that the mere notion of a discussion of principle or indeed any topic that requires someone to think becomes too hard. This has been explained multiple times before in this thread and yet still people cannot understand it.

I have clearly demonstrated that point C does not stand. It does not stand because a homosexual relationship is a legal relationship. Your argument also does not stand because it could be used to maintain the exclusion of interracial marriages in jurisdictions where interracial marriages are proscribed.

I'm not sure I can make it any clearer for you, Longy.

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MOTR Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6646	Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude? Reply #364 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:02pm You are clearly inferring that homosexual relationships have something in common with pedophiliac and incestuous relationships that interracial relationships don't.
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Chard Gold Member Offline Mein Führer! I can walk! Posts: 1077 Alabama, USA Gender:	Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude? Reply #365 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:09pm Q. Why are homosexuals so rude? A. You'd be a little rude to if you had to deal with bigoted dickheads like Longwinded there. Hey, Long, provide evidence that there is a direct causal link between homosexuality and pedophilia. No, bullshit your pastor told you doesn't count.
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MOTR

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Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude?
Reply #366 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:15pm

Chard wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:09pm:

Q. Why are homosexuals so rude?

A. You'd be a little rude to if you had to deal with bigoted dickheads like Longwinded there.

Hey, Long, provide evidence that there is a direct causal link between homosexuality and pedophilia. No, bullshit your pastor told you doesn't count.

I don't believe Longy has made that particular claim in this thread. I doubt he has made it elsewhere.

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Chard

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Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude?
Reply #367 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:23pm

MOTR wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:15pm:

Chard wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:09pm:

Q. Why are homosexuals so rude?

A. You'd be a little rude to if you had to deal with bigoted dickheads like Longwinded there.

Hey, Long, provide evidence that there is a direct causal link between homosexuality and pedophilia. No, bullshit your pastor told you doesn't count.

I don't believe Longy has made that particular claim in this thread. I doubt he has made it elsewhere.

Are you reading the same thread I am? I could swear that the last several pages he was attempting to equivocate arguments justifying giving homosexuals the same rights as heterosexuals to arguments in favor of legalizing incest and pedophilia. I also noticed that he hasn't actually said that he isn't against gay marriage as well. From this one can easily infer that he's probably just a tad bigoted.

Now, if he comes out and clearly states that he has nothing against granting homosexuals the same rights as heterosexuals I'll retract my statements and give Long an apology.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude?
Reply #368 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:23pm

MOTR wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:15pm:

Chard wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:09pm:

Q. Why are homosexuals so rude?

A. You'd be a little rude to if you had to deal with bigoted dickheads like Longwinded there.

Hey, Long, provide evidence that there is a direct causal link between homosexuality and pedophilia. No, bullshit your pastor told you doesn't count.

I don't believe Longy has made that particular claim in this thread. I doubt he has made it elsewhere.

Heh yeah. They have kinda stopped short of that one on this forum but ive seen it enough elsewhere. Some of them have implied it enough though.

SOB

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MOTR

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Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude?
Reply #369 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:34pm

Chard wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:23pm:

MOTR wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:15pm:

Chard wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:09pm:

Q. Why are homosexuals so rude?

A. You'd be a little rude to if you had to deal with bigoted dickheads like Longwinded there.

Hey, Long, provide evidence that there is a direct causal link between homosexuality and pedophilia. No, bullshit your pastor told you doesn't count.

I don't believe Longy has made that particular claim in this thread. I doubt he has made it elsewhere.

Are you reading the same thread I am? I could swear that the last several pages he was attempting to equivocate arguments justifying giving homosexuals the same rights as heterosexuals to arguments in favor of legalizing incest and pedophilia. I also noticed that he hasn't actually said that he isn't against gay marriage as well. From this one can easily infer that he's probably just a tad bigoted.

Now, if he comes out and clearly states that he has nothing against granting homosexuals the same rights as heterosexuals I'll retract my statements and give Long an apology.

He is equating the arguments. His reasoning seems a bit muddled so it is difficult to ascertain the nature of the equivalency, besides that homosexuality was once socially unacceptable.

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Chard

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Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude?
Reply #370 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 8:01pm

MOTR wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:34pm:

He is equating the arguments. His reasoning seems a bit muddled so it is difficult to ascertain the nature of the equivalency, besides that homosexuality was once socially unacceptable.

1. Equivocating arguments like that is pretty much one of the biggest forms of intellectual dishonesty I can think of. It's saying that something that is completely victimless and without societal risk is the same as things that clearly have victims and can put society at risk. It's a bullshit argument generally made by people who are huge bigoted tools but lack the enough conviction to come right out and admit their bigotry.

2. The only reason why its socially unacceptable is because of is because of arbitrary religious morals inflicted on others by people who can't mind their own damn business and by people who feel threatened by gays because they're afraid to admit they might have sexual inclinations towards the same sex themselves.. The reasons for denying homosexuals the right to marry are every bit as mired in religiously driven bigoted bullshit and fear of admitting ones own sexual desires as the anti-miscegenation laws that we used to have in the US that made it a crime for blacks and whites to marry.

So, yeah, I honestly don't give a rusty f*ck what he was doing so much as I'm concerned about his motivations for doing so.

On a side note, what the hell is up with you people and these walls of quotes? Do none of you know how to prune posts and operate simply BB code? Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over?

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Peter Freedman

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Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude?
Reply #371 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 8:40pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 5:20pm:

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 3:46pm:

longweekend is indulging in an argument much favoured by opponents of social reform.

They take a proposed change, exaggerate it to the nth degree and then argue that because the exaggeration is unacceptable therefore so is the original proposal.

This is the argument of the desperate who have nothing more logical to offer.

As a liberal who has no problem with either homosexuality or gay marriage I ask little of people like longweekend. They have a right to disapprove of homosexuality, never make a friend of a homosexual or invite one into their home.

They have a right to disapprove of gay marriage, never enter into one, never attend one or have one conducted in their backyard next to the chookhouse.

But they do not have the right to demand others be governed by THEIR morality or deny people equality before the law.

If they find they are not comfortable in a society which allows gay marriage then they have a choice. They can leave. Saudi Arabia is quite pleasant at this time of year.

if you had the slightest clue what this discussion is your'd hang your head in shame at your idiotic post. Unfortunately there are only three people on here whom I think of when the topic comes to PRINCIPLED positions: myself FD and dsmithy. the rest of you wouldnt know a principle if it attacked you.

I take this response as meaning the author is defeated, knows it, and can think of nothing reasoned to say in reply. QED

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MOTR

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Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude?
Reply #372 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 8:44pm

Chard wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 8:01pm:

MOTR wrote on Jun 17^th, 2012 at 7:34pm:

He is equating the arguments. His reasoning seems a bit muddled so it is difficult to ascertain the nature of the equivalency, besides that homosexuality was once socially unacceptable.

1. Equivocating arguments like that is pretty much one of the biggest forms of intellectual dishonesty I can think of. It's saying that something that is completely victimless and without societal risk is the same as things that clearly have victims and can put society at risk. It's a bullshit argument generally made by people who are huge bigoted tools but lack the enough conviction to come right out and admit their bigotry.

2. The only reason why its socially unacceptable is because of is because of arbitrary religious morals inflicted on others by people who can't mind their own damn business and by people who feel threatened by gays because they're afraid to admit they might have sexual inclinations towards the same sex themselves.. The reasons for denying homosexuals the right to marry are every bit as mired in religiously driven bigoted bullshit and fear of admitting ones own sexual desires as the anti-miscegenation laws that we used to have in the US that made it a crime for blacks and whites

I'd say you've nailed Longy well. No pun intended, of course.

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Hunt says Coalition accepts IPCC findings

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Avram Horowitz Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3153 Australia Gender:	Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude? Reply #373 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 8:51pm In Sydney I too have seen homosexuals to be rude as well. Specially at the university demonstration they were rude about religious people. Why do they need to be offensive like this? The gay society and Islam society at the university. If is my decision I would ban both of them!
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Peter Freedman Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5275 Wellington Gender:	Re: Why R Homos and Greens so rude? Reply #374 - Jun 17^th, 2012 at 8:57pm In Brisbane, I've seen one legged men with flowers in their buttonholes who are extremely rude, especially if you tread on their remaining foot. If it was my decision I'd ban them. In fact, why not just ban everybody, Avram, and be done with it?
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