Australian Politics Forum

Prevailing Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 7169 Stop Men	Re: Republic 2020 Reply #60 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 9:23am The forces of fear and tyranny will always argue from the bottom of the pond that change is to be feared, that there is security in the serfdom you know...what a joke. The brave and the progressive choose freedom from foreign rule and national independence for Australia.
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Frances

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Re: Republic 2020
Reply #61 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 4:41pm

Can someone fix up this defective poll, which appears to have been prepared by someone with no understanding of our present constitution?

The last option in the poll reads Quote:

Want us be a colony of england forever

which is not possible as:
a) we have not been colonies since federation and
b) we were British colonies, not English ones.

The question should read along the lines of " Want us be a constitutional monarchy forever, with the British sovereign as the Australian head of state".

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Dnarever

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Re: Republic 2020
Reply #62 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 10:37pm

Uncle Meat wrote on Jun 1^st, 2012 at 6:18pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 1^st, 2012 at 6:06pm:

... what is the better alternative.

Replace the monarch with a Head of State appointed by the Australian Federal Parliament.

Bi-partisan appointment republican model.

That is the option which was clearly defeated last time and in my view probably the worst option of all.

I would think that in a republic we would want a head of state representing the people and definatly not one in debt to both major political party's.

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Dnarever Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 62008 Here Gender:	Re: Republic 2020 Reply #63 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 10:42pm If we have a republic I would think that the most likely flavour would ba bannana.
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Prevailing Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 7169 Stop Men	Re: Republic 2020 Reply #64 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 10:45pm This is the Monarchists strategy to get the Republican debate bogged down in detail. We just want a strait up debate and referendum on an Australian head of state and a declaration of independence. The form the republic takes is decided with due process after the referenda.
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Frances Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3577 In a Castle in the Hills Gender:	Re: Republic 2020 Reply #65 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:14pm So you want a debate but you don't want any detail in it?
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Dnarever

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Re: Republic 2020
Reply #66 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:21pm

Frances wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:14pm:

So you want a debate but you don't want any detail in it?

Last time they put in the detail and everyone worked out that they didn't like the system proposed and voted against it.

Next time they are determined to get it through without telling us what it is going to be in any more than the most airy fairy feel good generic detail.

What the plan is is to put up the current system worts and all against the idealised theory of an unspecified republic.

Once a republic is locked in they will then tell us what it is going to be whether we like it or not.

I think dishonest in the extreeme but it is the intended process planned.

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matty Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 11055 East Sydney Gender:	Re: Republic 2020 Reply #67 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:21pm I don't know. If someone presented a good, solid alternative Republic, then I would have an open mind. The problem with changing, is that it could turn us from a dictatorial democracy into an outright dictatorship. I am definitely a fence-setter on the whole notion of Monarchy vs Republic.
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Frances

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Re: Republic 2020
Reply #68 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:24pm

Dnarever wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:21pm:

Frances wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:14pm:

So you want a debate but you don't want any detail in it?

Last time they put in the detail and everyone worked out that they didn't like the system proposed and voted against it.

Next time they are determined to get it through without telling us what it is going to be in any more than the most airy fairy feel good generic detail.

What the plan is is to put up the current system worts and all against the idealised theory of an unspecified republic.

Once a republic is locked in they will then tell us what it is going to be whether we like it or not.

I think dishonest in the extreeme but it is the intended process planned.

And what about a discussion in a thread that has a question that is factually inaccurate on two counts and is calculated to skew the results of the poll in favour of a republic?

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Dnarever

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Re: Republic 2020
Reply #69 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:32pm

Frances wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:24pm:

Dnarever wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:21pm:

Frances wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:14pm:

So you want a debate but you don't want any detail in it?

Last time they put in the detail and everyone worked out that they didn't like the system proposed and voted against it.

Next time they are determined to get it through without telling us what it is going to be in any more than the most airy fairy feel good generic detail.

What the plan is is to put up the current system worts and all against the idealised theory of an unspecified republic.

Once a republic is locked in they will then tell us what it is going to be whether we like it or not.

I think dishonest in the extreeme but it is the intended process planned.

And what about a discussion in a thread that has a question that is factually inaccurate on two counts and is calculated to skew the results of the poll in favour of a republic?

The reason I didn't vote and commented on page 4 than my vote is for "none of the above".

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Prevailing

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Re: Republic 2020
Reply #70 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:35pm

Frances wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:14pm:

So you want a debate but you don't want any detail in it?

The debate over whether we have a head of state from Australia or a foreign monarch is entirely a separate issue to the debate over the detail of the Republic which is really just another debate with Malthusian Royalists who will try to preserve as much of their oligarchical power as possible within the framework of a republic. I see no reason for that debate to stall a simple referendum on the issue of the Monarchy. I want to move forward to an independent Australia, bring on a referendum.

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Dnarever

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Re: Republic 2020
Reply #71 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:36pm

matty wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:21pm:

I don't know. If someone presented a good, solid alternative Republic, then I would have an open mind. The problem with changing, is that it could turn us from a dictatorial democracy into an outright dictatorship. I am definitely a fence-setter on the whole notion of Monarchy vs Republic.

Sensible position but I hope the fence is strong and comfortable.

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Uncle Meat

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Re: Republic 2020
Reply #72 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:41pm

Dnarever wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:36pm:

matty wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:21pm:

I don't know. If someone presented a good, solid alternative Republic, then I would have an open mind. The problem with changing, is that it could turn us from a dictatorial democracy into an outright dictatorship. I am definitely a fence-setter on the whole notion of Monarchy vs Republic.

Sensible position but I hope the fence is strong and comfortable.

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Dnarever

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Re: Republic 2020
Reply #73 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:44pm

Prevailing wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:35pm:

Frances wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:14pm:

So you want a debate but you don't want any detail in it?

The debate over whether we have a head of state from Australia or a foreign monarch is entirely a separate issue to the debate over the detail of the Republic which is really just another debate with Malthusian Royalists who will try to preserve as much of their oligarchical power as possible within the framework of a republic. I see no reason for that debate to stall a simple referendum on the issue of the Monarchy. I want to move forward to an independent Australia, bring on a referendum.

We currently have a good reliable stable system, I think that the majority who support the current system are not monachists.

I will not vote for change unless I know exactly what I am voting for, not just a feel good sentiment followed by the risk of a choice between dissapointing alternatives at a lower standard than what we currently have.

Be honest stand up in front of me and give me the real options.

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Dnarever

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Re: Republic 2020
Reply #74 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:47pm

Uncle Meat wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:41pm:

Dnarever wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:36pm:

matty wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:21pm:

I don't know. If someone presented a good, solid alternative Republic, then I would have an open mind. The problem with changing, is that it could turn us from a dictatorial democracy into an outright dictatorship. I am definitely a fence-setter on the whole notion of Monarchy vs Republic.

Sensible position but I hope the fence is strong and comfortable.

http://lateralmovements.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Penis-posts.jpg

It does look a lot like the republic model on offer.

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Poll
Question: Should Australia become a Republic in ...
Before 2020 Become a Republic in 2020 Become a Republic after 2020 Want us be a colony of england forever « Last Modified by: ____ on: Jun 1^st, 2012 at 9:49am »