Australian Politics Forum - Should taxpayer pay for private education?

Annie Anthrax

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #180 - May 11^th, 2012 at 2:29pm

Quote:

There are special schools for the disabled. Keep them there - they only harm the chances of everyone else in a normal class realising their potential.

Good thinking. Far better to hide disabled children away rather than create an inclusive environment where everyone is encouraged.

Quote:

The distinction between "Australian born" and "australian" didn't escape me. Not too many australians would be doing ESL classes...what do you think the background of these australian born ESL students would be? Middle eastern would be a hefty chunk doncha think?

I said ESL and other educators.

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #181 - May 11^th, 2012 at 2:41pm

Annie Anthrax wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 2:29pm:

Quote:

There are special schools for the disabled. Keep them there - they only harm the chances of everyone else in a normal class realising their potential.

Good thinking. Far better to hide disabled children away rather than create an inclusive environment where everyone is encouraged.

I know you're bing sarcastic, but you're actually spot on. It's not fair having a disabled kid monopolising teachers time while the other 30 students languish.

Quote:

The distinction between "Australian born" and "australian" didn't escape me. Not too many australians would be doing ESL classes...what do you think the background of these australian born ESL students would be? Middle eastern would be a hefty chunk doncha think?

I said ESL and other educators. [/quote]

Uhuh. So why does ESL get a specific mention?

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #182 - May 11^th, 2012 at 2:42pm

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 2:25pm:

Swagman wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 1:38pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 11:11am:

(4) to cover this increased enrollment the govt would have to pay $11,000 pers student simply to keep pace with current funding levels.

the simply an obvious answer is that for every private school student who leaves and goes to the public sector, the govt is $3500 WORSE OFF.

Please tell me you either understand this or wish to question it. and before you questino it keep in mind that almost all education professionals accept that this is correct.

Quote:

In 2011 there were 3,541,809 students attending schools in Australia, an increase of 30,934 (0.9%) compared with 2010.

In that time primary students rose by 1.3%, from 2,015,017 to 2,042,081, while secondary students rose by 0.3%, from 1,495,858 to 1,499,728.

In 2011, there were almost twice as many students attending government schools (2,315,253) as there were attending non-government schools (1,226,556), however the non-government sector continued its trend of stronger growth from 2010 to 2011.

In 2011 the split of students between government and non-government schools was 65.4% and 34.6% respectively and these figures reinforce the long-term drift of students from government schools to non-government schools. For 2001 the split was 69.0% and 31.0% respectively.

Source

An extra $13.5 Billion per year.......what would that do to Swan's surplus? Shocked

Private schooling is SAVING the taxpayer $13.5 Billion a year........ Shocked

If the Govt stopped funding private education they'd have to stop paying the dole to pay for it... Grin

Heh thanks soren but trolerator should have done that if he wanted to prove his point. I still say that it doesnt matter what the cost is the govt should invest more in public schools to make education better.

SOB

The tolerator has little interest in spoon feeding dummies.

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Soren Gold Member Offline Posts: 25654 Gender:	Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education? Reply #183 - May 11^th, 2012 at 2:50pm None of us is sure where exctly the limits of inclusivity are but we all know it has limits.
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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #184 - May 11^th, 2012 at 3:01pm

In my experience as a tutor, it mostly comes down to the willingness of the student to learn. There are always a handful who are keen and pay attention, and there are always a handful who will do the least amount as possible.
But, in some cases there really are bad teachers. I've known a few who do little as possible for their pay cheque.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #185 - May 11^th, 2012 at 3:07pm

... wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 2:42pm:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 2:25pm:

Swagman wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 1:38pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 11:11am:

(4) to cover this increased enrollment the govt would have to pay $11,000 pers student simply to keep pace with current funding levels.

the simply an obvious answer is that for every private school student who leaves and goes to the public sector, the govt is $3500 WORSE OFF.

Please tell me you either understand this or wish to question it. and before you questino it keep in mind that almost all education professionals accept that this is correct.

Quote:

In 2011 there were 3,541,809 students attending schools in Australia, an increase of 30,934 (0.9%) compared with 2010.

In that time primary students rose by 1.3%, from 2,015,017 to 2,042,081, while secondary students rose by 0.3%, from 1,495,858 to 1,499,728.

In 2011, there were almost twice as many students attending government schools (2,315,253) as there were attending non-government schools (1,226,556), however the non-government sector continued its trend of stronger growth from 2010 to 2011.

In 2011 the split of students between government and non-government schools was 65.4% and 34.6% respectively and these figures reinforce the long-term drift of students from government schools to non-government schools. For 2001 the split was 69.0% and 31.0% respectively.

Source

An extra $13.5 Billion per year.......what would that do to Swan's surplus? Shocked

Private schooling is SAVING the taxpayer $13.5 Billion a year........ Shocked

If the Govt stopped funding private education they'd have to stop paying the dole to pay for it... Grin

Heh thanks soren but trolerator should have done that if he wanted to prove his point. I still say that it doesnt matter what the cost is the govt should invest more in public schools to make education better.

SOB

The tolerator has little interest in spoon feeding dummies.

The tolerator is an idiot.

SOB

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Whaaaaaah!
I'm a
Moron!

- edited by some unethical admin - you think its funny? - its a slippery slope

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Soren

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #186 - May 11^th, 2012 at 3:08pm

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 3:01pm:

there are always a handful who will do the least amount as possible.

And now they have been successfully re-labelled as 'disadvantaged' or having 'learnin difficulties' or coming from 'disadvantaged or immigrant' families. Or some other excuse. Everything is covered except the fact that most of these kids are bone lazy and stupid. Their parents should pay an extra levy and do community service.

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Big Donger

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #187 - May 11^th, 2012 at 3:09pm

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 3:07pm:

... wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 2:42pm:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 2:25pm:

Swagman wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 1:38pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 11:11am:

(4) to cover this increased enrollment the govt would have to pay $11,000 pers student simply to keep pace with current funding levels.

the simply an obvious answer is that for every private school student who leaves and goes to the public sector, the govt is $3500 WORSE OFF.

Please tell me you either understand this or wish to question it. and before you questino it keep in mind that almost all education professionals accept that this is correct.

Quote:

In 2011 there were 3,541,809 students attending schools in Australia, an increase of 30,934 (0.9%) compared with 2010.

In that time primary students rose by 1.3%, from 2,015,017 to 2,042,081, while secondary students rose by 0.3%, from 1,495,858 to 1,499,728.

In 2011, there were almost twice as many students attending government schools (2,315,253) as there were attending non-government schools (1,226,556), however the non-government sector continued its trend of stronger growth from 2010 to 2011.

In 2011 the split of students between government and non-government schools was 65.4% and 34.6% respectively and these figures reinforce the long-term drift of students from government schools to non-government schools. For 2001 the split was 69.0% and 31.0% respectively.

Source

An extra $13.5 Billion per year.......what would that do to Swan's surplus? Shocked

Private schooling is SAVING the taxpayer $13.5 Billion a year........ Shocked

If the Govt stopped funding private education they'd have to stop paying the dole to pay for it... Grin

Heh thanks soren but trolerator should have done that if he wanted to prove his point. I still say that it doesnt matter what the cost is the govt should invest more in public schools to make education better.

SOB

The tolerator has little interest in spoon feeding dummies.

The tolerator is an idiot.

SOB

The Tolerator is a genius.

He would make an excellent teacher.

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #188 - May 11^th, 2012 at 3:34pm

Big Donger wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 3:09pm:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 3:07pm:

... wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 2:42pm:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 2:25pm:

Swagman wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 1:38pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 11:11am:

(4) to cover this increased enrollment the govt would have to pay $11,000 pers student simply to keep pace with current funding levels.

the simply an obvious answer is that for every private school student who leaves and goes to the public sector, the govt is $3500 WORSE OFF.

Please tell me you either understand this or wish to question it. and before you questino it keep in mind that almost all education professionals accept that this is correct.

Quote:

In 2011 there were 3,541,809 students attending schools in Australia, an increase of 30,934 (0.9%) compared with 2010.

In that time primary students rose by 1.3%, from 2,015,017 to 2,042,081, while secondary students rose by 0.3%, from 1,495,858 to 1,499,728.

In 2011, there were almost twice as many students attending government schools (2,315,253) as there were attending non-government schools (1,226,556), however the non-government sector continued its trend of stronger growth from 2010 to 2011.

In 2011 the split of students between government and non-government schools was 65.4% and 34.6% respectively and these figures reinforce the long-term drift of students from government schools to non-government schools. For 2001 the split was 69.0% and 31.0% respectively.

Source

An extra $13.5 Billion per year.......what would that do to Swan's surplus? Shocked

Private schooling is SAVING the taxpayer $13.5 Billion a year........ Shocked

If the Govt stopped funding private education they'd have to stop paying the dole to pay for it... Grin

Heh thanks soren but trolerator should have done that if he wanted to prove his point. I still say that it doesnt matter what the cost is the govt should invest more in public schools to make education better.

SOB

The tolerator has little interest in spoon feeding dummies.

The tolerator is an idiot.

SOB

The Tolerator is a genius.

He would make an excellent teacher.

The tolerator is a genius, but the tolerator wouldn't make a very good school teacher.

Well, that's not quite true. I'd The tolerator wouldmake an excellent school teacher, but the handwringing softcock brigade would have conniptions at my the tolerators methods.

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Sir Spot of Borg Gold Member Offline WE ARE BORG Posts: 26588 Australia	Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education? Reply #189 - May 11^th, 2012 at 3:38pm the tolerator would not make a good teacher because he doesnt back up his so-called "facts" with evidence. SOB
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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #190 - May 11^th, 2012 at 3:42pm

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 3:38pm:

the tolerator would not make a good teacher because he doesnt back up his so-called "facts" with evidence.

SOB

The tolerator thinks he's the tolerator has shown borg up for the retard he is one too many times, and now the borg can't go 5 minutes without mentioning him.

The tolerator has gotten under your skin exoskeleton, lil miss pissy pants. Cry

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longweekend58

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #191 - May 11^th, 2012 at 3:47pm

Annie Anthrax wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 1:43pm:

Students absolutely have a right to adequate resources to facilitate their learning at an individual level.

Some students need more encouragement than others - I don't see the problem with that.

'adequate' is a subjective term. it doesnt really say much. adequate could easily be defined as access to a teach, books and materials. It doesnt say you neen small calss zies or a pool or a huge library.

I somehow doubt that resources are the reasonn for private schools superiority in performance. In the Finnish system - which toenail loves to quote - the govt funding is actually a little LESS than ours. In the end it is always what you DO with your resources rather than how many you have.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education?
Reply #192 - May 11^th, 2012 at 3:50pm

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 2:25pm:

Swagman wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 1:38pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 11:11am:

(4) to cover this increased enrollment the govt would have to pay $11,000 pers student simply to keep pace with current funding levels.

the simply an obvious answer is that for every private school student who leaves and goes to the public sector, the govt is $3500 WORSE OFF.

Please tell me you either understand this or wish to question it. and before you questino it keep in mind that almost all education professionals accept that this is correct.

Quote:

In 2011 there were 3,541,809 students attending schools in Australia, an increase of 30,934 (0.9%) compared with 2010.

In that time primary students rose by 1.3%, from 2,015,017 to 2,042,081, while secondary students rose by 0.3%, from 1,495,858 to 1,499,728.

In 2011, there were almost twice as many students attending government schools (2,315,253) as there were attending non-government schools (1,226,556), however the non-government sector continued its trend of stronger growth from 2010 to 2011.

In 2011 the split of students between government and non-government schools was 65.4% and 34.6% respectively and these figures reinforce the long-term drift of students from government schools to non-government schools. For 2001 the split was 69.0% and 31.0% respectively.

Source

An extra $13.5 Billion per year.......what would that do to Swan's surplus? Shocked

Private schooling is SAVING the taxpayer $13.5 Billion a year........ Shocked

If the Govt stopped funding private education they'd have to stop paying the dole to pay for it... Grin

Heh thanks soren but trolerator should have done that if he wanted to prove his point. I still say that it doesnt matter what the cost is the govt should invest more in public schools to make education better.

SOB

you assume that the problem is not enough money. no proof of course.

You might find a better way of getting better outcomes is giving MORE money to privte schools so they can greatly reduce fees and make them more accessible. And they already have much better educational outcomes.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 45675 Gender:	Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education? Reply #193 - May 11^th, 2012 at 3:58pm Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 3:38pm: the tolerator would not make a good teacher because he doesnt back up his so-called "facts" with evidence. SOB pot calling the kettle black!
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... Gold Member Offline Posts: 23673 WA Gender:	Re: Should taxpayer pay for private education? Reply #194 - May 11^th, 2012 at 4:05pm longweekend58 wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 3:58pm: Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 3:38pm: the tolerator would not make a good teacher because he doesnt back up his so-called "facts" with evidence. SOB pot calling the kettle black! I am not a kettle. I am a human being!!!
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Poll
Question: Should taxpayers money pay for private education ?
Yes 11 (35.5%) No 20 (64.5%) Total votes: 31 « Created by: Sir lastnail on: May 7^th, 2012 at 11:47am »