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Should Abbott apologise to Flannery? (Read 71935 times)
freediver
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #75 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:35pm
 
Quote:
If you bothered to read the quote you would have seen that Bolt quoted Flannery.


Bolt quoted very short pieces of what Flannery said. Taken by themselves they are nothing but mundane facts. Bolt's interpretation of them is worthy of a six year old.
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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creep
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #76 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:35pm
 
Time to spoonfeed another gullible gertie

"In 2008, Flannery said: "The water problem is so severe for Adelaide that it may run out of water by early 2009."


There you go, thats what Flannery said.

Guess Adelaide dams haven't lived up to Flannery's scaremongering!!!
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longweekend58
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #77 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:36pm
 
astro_surf wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:21pm:
longweekend58 wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:10pm:
and the carbon tax is not that at all. it is a CARBON DIOXIDE tax - the worlds most plentiful gas and its most useful since every plant on the planet needs it.


Another mindless denier talking point being regurgitated by the Useful Idiots that don't actually understand the processes they are talking about. Yes, CO2 is good for plants but a when it warms the planet it is very bad for humans AND many plant species that humans rely on to survive.

Quote:

CO2 is Good for Plants: Another Red Herring in the Climate Change Debate

Posted on 1 July 2010 by Mariana Ashley

Guest post by Mariana Ashley

CO2 feeds plants. And so, too, does ignorance and a little bit of politicking feed inane misconceptions. Rep. John Shimkus of Illinois made famous the CO2 as plant food argument during a U.S. House Subcommittee on Energy and Environment hearing in 2009. The basic plant food argument is that since plants need CO2 to grow, more CO2 means, by proxy, more sustained and robust plant growth globally.

A quick look at the science behind this argument demonstrates its inherent weaknesses. In closed, controlled environments, like greenhouses and plant nurseries, an increase in CO2 does indeed spur plant growth. However, the globe is not a controlled environment, and it’s incredible sensitivity to a variety of factors is something that is often taken for granted when such narrow arguments are proffered. A rise in CO2 levels is not the only consequence of climate change, and it is these other effects that have had and will have more abiding adverse effects on plant growth around the world.

While CO2 is an important element that stimulates plant growth, the planet's flora requires a cocktail of elements to maintain its health. Arguably the most important of these elements is water. With the global increase in temperature caused by the various factors affecting our climate's balance, increased evaporation means decreased soil moisture. Another effect of global climate change is erratic precipitation patterns. This causes extreme weather in certain geographic locations only sporadically, with overall, balanced rainfall drastically reduced.

Suppose, however, that CO2 does prime plant growth in the world at large. To what extent will this happen? For one, the increased density of forest vegetation could increase the risk of wildfires, which have reared their ugly heads in California all too often in the past few years, wreaking devastating damage. Presumably the CO2 as plant food enthusiasts offer their argument in an effort to demonstrate the resulting agricultural advantages. But even if "CO2 fertilization" occurs, weeds proliferate in tandem with crops, which would only increase the global cost of agriculture.

We could discuss the scientific finer points of global climate change and the unlimited effects it could have on global plant growth all day. A Climate Denial Crock of the Week video does just that in debunking the CO2 plant food argument. However, at its most basic level, the CO2 plant food argument rests on a simple logical fallacy--the fallacy of exclusion, which focuses on one cause-and-effect (in this case, more CO2 means more plants) to the exclusion of all other cause-and-effect chains.

When CO2 is framed as an element good for plants in order to dismiss the other existing pieces of evidences that suggest the dangers of global climate change, we are left with an idea that only distracts us from the more pressing issues of our planet's increased loss of balance.


your quote confirms that CO2 is good for plants - not that it was ever actually the point. and you maintain the fiction that CO2 warms the planet rather than the reverse simply by restating it - nothing else.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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creep
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #78 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:36pm
 
In 2005, Flannery predicted Sydney's dams could be dry in as little as two years because global warming was drying up the rains, leaving the city "facing extreme difficulties with water".


But the gullible gerties are in denial of what Flannery has said.
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freediver
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #79 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:37pm
 
creep wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:35pm:
Time to spoonfeed another gullible gertie

"In 2008, Flannery said: "The water problem is so severe for Adelaide that it may run out of water by early 2009."


There you go, thats what Flannery said.

Guess Adelaide dams haven't lived up to Flannery's scaremongering!!!


And there is nothing wrong with that. In 2008 Adelaide was facing a severe water shortage.

Bolt is acting like Flannery was the only one not to predict when the drought finished.
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creep
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #80 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:38pm
 
And more from the scaremongering Flannery

In 2007, Flannery predicted cities such as Brisbane would never again have dam-filling rains, as global warming had caused "a 20 per cent decrease in rainfall in some areas" and made the soil too hot, "so even the rain that falls isn't actually going to fill our dams and river systems ... ".


Guess those darn dams just are doing what theyre supposed to be doing, as Bisbane's are 100% full!!!!
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freediver
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #81 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:39pm
 
Quote:
In 2007, Flannery predicted cities such as Brisbane would never again have dam-filling rains


Creep this is the bit that Flannery did not actually say. Are you able to tell the difference?
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creep
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #82 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:39pm
 
creep wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:38pm:
And more from the scaremongering Flannery

In 2007, Flannery predicted cities such as Brisbane would never again have dam-filling rains, as global warming had caused "a 20 per cent decrease in rainfall in some areas" and made the soil too hot, "so even the rain that falls isn't actually going to fill our dams and river systems ... ".


Guess those darn dams just are doing what theyre supposed to be doing, as Bisbane's are 100% full!!!!



Wonder where Flannery was this year. You can bet he wasn't holidaying in Queensland a sit got flooded.
But it wouldnt have been from rain, as Flannery predicted that Brisbane wouldnt have rains that would fill the dams!
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longweekend58
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #83 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:39pm
 
adelcrow wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:34pm:
I think the problem is the climate change deniers are basing their arguments on basic year 7 science.
They may just find the scientists and economists that are advising the worlds govts and industrial giants are a tad more advanced than that.
It is not surprising that people with limited knowledge on a problem are easily maniputed by an opposition party that knows how to use fear and ignorance to their political advantage.


one of the scientists supporting the 'ether concept' in the 1940s was a Nobel Lauerate. He was also very, very wrong.

and your year 7 science also confirms that water releases dissolves gases as it warms. Or did you never learn that? and with the vast bulk of non-atmospheric CO2 being held in the oceans where is the surprise that with a small increase in average temperature that the oceans woudl release more CO2??? it is not just year 7 science it is a simple undeniable fact and no one disputes it. but we are asked to support the fact that CO2 causes the warming when in fact the warmin causes the CO2.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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astro_surf
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #84 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:40pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:07pm:
his many and varied predictions have been already listed and they were all wrong. and then there is al gores predictions of 6m higher sea levels byhmmm lets remember.. yes by next year!!!


That's a lie. Al Gore never specified how long it would take for sea levels to rise to 6 metres, he merely pointed out that if the Greenland ice sheet was to melt entirely it would raise sea levels by 6 metres. which is a fact, although exceedingly unlikely for at least a few hundred years. The IPCC projections of up to 90cms by 2100 is worrying enough, especially seeing as the latest data from the Greenland ice floes, which were not available to the IPCC in 2005, shows that it is melting at a rate that will raise sea levels by 1.6 metres by 2100, and that truly IS alarming.

Quote:
as for the CO2 question, ice cores have already shown in many cases that CO2 levels FOLLOWED warming - no preceded it.


No YOU don't understand this denier talking point that you are repeating. In fact, I preempted this reply when you first made the claim a few weeks back, and provided you with ample reference that outlines exactly how you've been misled.

CO2 lags temperature - what does it mean?

When the planet moves from a glacial to an interglacial the change in solar radiation does indeed release vast amounts of CO2 from the oceans but it is this CO2 that AMPLIFIES the warming and allows the planet to warm to the degree it does in interglacials. It has been comprehensively proven that the changes in solar radiation alone couldn't possibly cause the planet to warm to the degree it does. The ONLY thing that can explain ti is the CO2.

This time though, rather than it being a slight change in solar irradiation causing the oceans to release CO2 into the atmosphere, it is us digging up vast stores of carbon buries safely under the ground, burning it and releasing it into the atmosphere. Unless of course you think that it is the temperature causing us to mine coal and burn it, because that would be the logical conclusion of your idiotic notion that just because changes in temperature cause CO2 to rise in the past means that is the ONLY thing that can cause CO2 to rise.

Quote:
you are so unsicentific and biased you cannot even concieve of the notion of the 'science' being wrong. you dont understand it at all - you just quote it.  


I understand it better than you, evidently.

Quote:
and what is the worlds biggest carbon sink?? OCEANS. and what happens to any body of water that gets warmer???  now remember you high school science. dissolved gases come out of solution. As temperatures get higher more Co2 is emitted from oceans and lakes.  Funnily enough that is exactly what I said.


Yes, and the fact that the oceans are acidifying and losing their capacity to absorb oceans is just one more piece of evidence that overwhelmingly supports AGW.

http://switchboard.nrdc.org/blogs/lsuatoni/why_scientists_agree_ocean_aci.html
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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11th, 2011 at 11:23am:
So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&
 
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longweekend58
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #85 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:42pm
 
creep wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:35pm:
Time to spoonfeed another gullible gertie

"In 2008, Flannery said: "The water problem is so severe for Adelaide that it may run out of water by early 2009."


There you go, thats what Flannery said.

Guess Adelaide dams haven't lived up to Flannery's scaremongering!!!


our reservoirs actually hit 100% (except for one reservoir up north)

there is no way you can spin Flannery's prediction as anything other than totally undeniably wrong. Now, ive no problem with that. People make mistakes. What i DONT tolerate is people like som of thee posters who want to say it WASNT a mistake or it didnt happen or whatever mindless excuse comes up next.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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creep
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #86 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:42pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:39pm:
we are asked to support the fact that CO2 causes the warming when in fact the warmin causes the CO2.




Better reduce population growth as it is humans breathing that are causing the build up of Co2
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longweekend58
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #87 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:43pm
 
freediver wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:37pm:
creep wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:35pm:
Time to spoonfeed another gullible gertie

"In 2008, Flannery said: "The water problem is so severe for Adelaide that it may run out of water by early 2009."


There you go, thats what Flannery said.

Guess Adelaide dams haven't lived up to Flannery's scaremongering!!!


And there is nothing wrong with that. In 2008 Adelaide was facing a severe water shortage.

Bolt is acting like Flannery was the only one not to predict when the drought finished.


The difference was that Flannery was using Adelaide as an example of climate change. and in that he was undeniably wrong.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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creep
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #88 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:44pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:42pm:
creep wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:35pm:
Time to spoonfeed another gullible gertie

"In 2008, Flannery said: "The water problem is so severe for Adelaide that it may run out of water by early 2009."


There you go, thats what Flannery said.

Guess Adelaide dams haven't lived up to Flannery's scaremongering!!!


our reservoirs actually hit 100% (except for one reservoir up north)

there is no way you can spin Flannery's prediction as anything other than totally undeniably wrong. Now, ive no problem with that. People make mistakes. What i DONT tolerate is people like som of thee posters who want to say it WASNT a mistake or it didnt happen or whatever mindless excuse comes up next.



SO true.
But there are the gullible gerties who are still in denial to Flannery being a scaremongerer.
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astro_surf
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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #89 - May 14th, 2011 at 4:45pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:39pm:
adelcrow wrote on May 14th, 2011 at 4:34pm:
I think the problem is the climate change deniers are basing their arguments on basic year 7 science.
They may just find the scientists and economists that are advising the worlds govts and industrial giants are a tad more advanced than that.
It is not surprising that people with limited knowledge on a problem are easily maniputed by an opposition party that knows how to use fear and ignorance to their political advantage.


one of the scientists supporting the 'ether concept' in the 1940s was a Nobel Lauerate. He was also very, very wrong.

and your year 7 science also confirms that water releases dissolves gases as it warms. Or did you never learn that? and with the vast bulk of non-atmospheric CO2 being held in the oceans where is the surprise that with a small increase in average temperature that the oceans woudl release more CO2??? it is not just year 7 science it is a simple undeniable fact and no one disputes it. but we are asked to support the fact that CO2 causes the warming when in fact the warmin causes the CO2.


Why do you think repeating actually means something? Do you think that geoscientists don't understand that concept? The logical conclusion of your idiocy is that it is temperature causing us to mine coal and burn it. But that is retarded.

Temperature CAN release CO2, but it will amplify that warming, which is what happens between ice ages. This time around WE have released the CO2, not a temperature change, and that IS causing an unprecedented warming. The evidence is undeniable, no matter how much you try.
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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11th, 2011 at 11:23am:
So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&
 
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