Australian Politics Forum - Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?

Soren

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #240 - May 16^th, 2011 at 10:18pm

astro_surf wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 9:31pm:

Soren wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 10:19am:

Excellent. Can you give us one scientific publication that that provided the evidence that convinced you personally? No, you can't. You rely on popularisers like most of the rest of us.

I sure can.

http://www.ipcc.ch/publications_and_data/ar4/wg1/en/contents.html

Would that be the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change that issued such statements about their bogus disappearing glaciers:

“the IPCC said the paragraph "refers to poorly substantiated estimates of rate of recession and date for the disappearance of Himalayan glaciers. In drafting the paragraph in question, the clear and well-established standards of evidence, required by the IPCC procedures, were not applied properly."

Is that IPCC which is headed by one Rajenda Pachauri, who is now the boss of the discredited scientist who made that bogus claim about glaciers? The very same.

Pachauri, internationally renowned author of Return to Almora? Oh yes.
"The book mingles lectures on climate change with descriptions of Sanjay’s sexual encounters, including frequent references to “voluptuous breasts”."

The Pachauri with the same comb-over as Lord Whatshisname? Indeed.

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creep

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #241 - May 16^th, 2011 at 10:27pm

astro_surf wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 10:05pm:

Once again, the sheer vacuousness of the denier mentality is exposed for all to see. You people unquestioningly swallow anything your are told that supports your biases. It's pathetic really.

Yes it really is quite bizarre how the warmists will believe anything at all, they deny logic and facts even when their mentor Flannery has been exposed as a scarmongering alarmist. No wonder they are gullible gerties.

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astro_surf

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #242 - May 16^th, 2011 at 10:28pm

Soren wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 10:18pm:

Would that be the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change that issued such statements about their bogus disappearing glaciers:

“the IPCC said the paragraph "refers to poorly substantiated estimates of rate of recession and date for the disappearance of Himalayan glaciers. In drafting the paragraph in question, the clear and well-established standards of evidence, required by the IPCC procedures, were not applied properly."

Yes. The very same IPCC. The multidisciplinary committee made up of thousands of contributors and reviewers, coordinating a massive scientific undertaking comprising of four volumes and thousands of pages, and the ONLY mistakes it made were two minor errors in the non-peer reviewed part of the impact statement. Anyone who has ever had any idea of what committees are like would rightly hail that as a remarkable achievement:

Quote:

Errors in the IPCC Fourth Assessment Report (AR4)

As far as we’re aware, so far only one–or at most two–legitimate errors have been found in the AR4:

Himalayan glaciers: In a regional chapter on Asia in Volume 2, written by authors from the region, it was erroneously stated that 80% of Himalayan glacier area would very likely be gone by 2035. This is of course not the proper IPCC projection of future glacier decline, which is found in Volume 1 of the report. There we find a 45-page, perfectly valid chapter on glaciers, snow and ice (Chapter 4), with the authors including leading glacier experts (such as our colleague Georg Kaser from Austria, who first discovered the Himalaya error in the WG2 report). There are also several pages on future glacier decline in Chapter 10 (“Global Climate Projections”), where the proper projections are used e.g. to estimate future sea level rise. So the problem here is not that the IPCC’s glacier experts made an incorrect prediction. The problem is that a WG2 chapter, instead of relying on the proper IPCC projections from their WG1 colleagues, cited an unreliable outside source in one place. Fixing this error involves deleting two sentences on page 493 of the WG2 report.

Sea level in the Netherlands: The WG2 report states that “The Netherlands is an example of a country highly susceptible to both sea-level rise and river flooding because 55% of its territory is below sea level”. This sentence was provided by a Dutch government agency – the Netherlands Environmental Assessment Agency, which has now published a correction stating that the sentence should have read “55 per cent of the Netherlands is at risk of flooding; 26 per cent of the country is below sea level, and 29 per cent is susceptible to river flooding”. It surely will go down as one of the more ironic episodes in its history when the Dutch parliament last Monday derided the IPCC, in a heated debate, for printing information provided by … the Dutch government. In addition, the IPCC notes that there are several definitions of the area below sea level. The Dutch Ministry of Transport uses the figure 60% (below high water level during storms), while others use 30% (below mean sea level). Needless to say, the actual number mentioned in the report has no bearing on any IPCC conclusions and has nothing to do with climate science, and it is questionable whether it should even be counted as an IPCC error.

And I see you've taken the default denier position of doing the Gish Gallop and not responding when you points are challenged, rather jumping onto the next denier talking point without missing a beat. You people are intellectual derelicts.

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« Last Edit: May 16^th, 2011 at 10:44pm by astro_surf »

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am:

So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&

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Equitist

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #243 - May 16^th, 2011 at 10:47pm

Speaking of gullible Gerties...

How is it that those who refuse to accept the science of climate change also follow the draconian, divisive and hateful extremist rants and fearmongering fables in one of several ancient books (which were written in times when humans were convinced that the earth was flat) and believe in an omnipotent being in the sky...!?

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Lamenting the shift in the Australian psyche, away from the egalitarian ideal of the fair-go - and the rise of short-sighted pollies, who worship the 'Growth Fairy' and seek to divide and conquer!

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creep

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #244 - May 16^th, 2011 at 10:52pm

Equitist wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 10:47pm:

Speaking of gullible Gerties...

How is it that those who refuse to accept the science of climate change also follow the draconian, divisive and hateful extremist rants and fearmongering fables in one of several ancient books (which were written in times when humans were convinced that the earth was flat) and believe in an omnipotent being in the sky...!?

Aaaahhh yes the phrase the science of climate, sounds impressive doesnt it.
Lets say it again.
The science of climate.
But what does it mean?
It has already been debunked and proved to be the scam of the century and then when those fraudulent emails went around ...from those scientists, you remember, the results didnt support those scientists of climate, so those scientists altered the results.
And now the global warmists are in denial to what those scientists of climate confessed to.
Yes the science of climate, sounds impressive doesnt it.

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astro_surf

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #245 - May 16^th, 2011 at 10:58pm

creep wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 10:52pm:

Equitist wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 10:47pm:

Speaking of gullible Gerties...

How is it that those who refuse to accept the science of climate change also follow the draconian, divisive and hateful extremist rants and fearmongering fables in one of several ancient books (which were written in times when humans were convinced that the earth was flat) and believe in an omnipotent being in the sky...!?

Aaaahhh yes the phrase the science of climate, sounds impressive doesnt it.
Lets say it again.
The science of climate.
But what does it mean?
It has already been debunked and proved to be the scam of the century and then when those fraudulent emails went around ...from those scientists, you remember, the results didnt support those scientists of climate, so those scientists altered the results.
And now the global warmists are in denial to what those scientists of climate confessed to.
Yes the science of climate, sounds impressive doesnt it.

No, despite what Andrew Bolt tell you to believe, the East Anglia CRU has been cleared by no less than THREE separate inquiries now. And despite what you might have been led to believe, those emails do not show the slightest evidence of fraud.

http://solveclimate.com/news/20100708/hacked-email-scientists-exonerated-miscond...

If a lie is repeated loudly enough then it simply becomes the Truth for people like you. That's because you rely on people like Bolt to tell you what to think as you are not capable of thinking for yourself, preferring instead to triumphantly wallow in your anti-intellectualism.

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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am:

So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&

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Soren

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #246 - May 16^th, 2011 at 11:01pm

astro_surf wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 9:26pm:

That's a denialist blog and an op-ed written by a known reactionary hack, you moron, not expert scientific evidence.

A known reactionary hack? You sound like a smacking Robespierre, keeping tabs on all the enemies of the revolution.

Delingpole is a pretty astute journalist. And he won't call you a moron if you disprove him.

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astro_surf

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #247 - May 16^th, 2011 at 11:09pm

Soren wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 11:01pm:

astro_surf wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 9:26pm:

That's a denialist blog and an op-ed written by a known reactionary hack, you moron, not expert scientific evidence.

A known reactionary hack? You sound like a smacking Robespierre, keeping tabs on all the enemies of the revolution.

Delingpole is a pretty astute journalist. And he won't call you a moron if you disprove him.

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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am:

So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&

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BatteriesNotIncluded Gold Member Offline MediocrityNET: because people died for this! Posts: 26966	Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery? Reply #248 - May 17^th, 2011 at 2:17am TONY ABBOTT ACTUALLY EMBRACES DEBT!
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chicken_lipsforme

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #249 - May 17^th, 2011 at 7:03am

BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 3:42pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 12:00pm:

BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on May 15^th, 2011 at 8:08pm:

astro_surf wrote on May 15^th, 2011 at 4:16pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 15^th, 2011 at 4:13pm:

they have been predicting ice-free summers for the past 3 years and since that has never happened how do you claim it is FASTER than predicted?

Source or it didn't happen. I'm tired of correcting your unsupported statements.

And this is what I mean, the rate of decline accelerating faster and deeper than the worst case scenario projected by climate models. I've made this point to you before, climate models are only wrong in the sense that they tend to conservatively underestimate the impact of AGW.

http://www.scienceprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/SeaIceDecline_591.gif

Quote:

Polar Ice Sheets Melting Faster Than Predicted

The thick glaciers covering Greenland and Antarctica are melting faster than scientists expected

By Lauren Morello and ClimateWire | March 9, 2011 | 11

Ice loss from the massive ice sheets covering Greenland and Antarctica is accelerating, according to a new study.

If the trend continues, ice sheets could become the dominant contributor to sea level rise sooner than scientists had predicted, concludes the research, which will be published this month in the journal Geophysical Research Letters.

"The traditional view of the loss of land ice on Earth has been that mountain glaciers and ice caps are the dominant contributors, and ice sheets are following behind," said study co-author Eric Rignot, a glaciologist at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory and the University of California, Irvine. "In this study, we are showing that ice sheets, mountain glaciers and ice caps are neck-and-neck."

But that could soon change, Rignot said, because the rate at which ice sheets are losing mass is increasing three times faster than the rate of ice loss from mountain glaciers and ice caps.

"I don't think we expected ice sheets to run neck-and-neck with mountain glaciers, which basically sit in a warmer climate, this soon," he said. "At the same time, the mass loss on the ice sheet is not very large compared to how much mass they store."

Rignot was part of a research team that also included scientists from Utrecht University in the Netherlands and the National Center for Atmospheric Research in Boulder, Colo.

The researchers based their analysis on a comparison of two different methods to measure ice loss.

Continued...

http://www.scienceprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/SeaIceDecline_591.gif

INTERESTING Shocked

Back under your bed horse.
The sky's falling because someones extrapolated figures don't look good.

IN PERTH THEY'RE EXTRAPOLATING FIGURES TO PREDICT THERE WILL BE A WATER SHORTAGE by 2020 if they don't build a SECOND DESAL PLANT.....

Cheesy

Keep laughing horsehead.
Somehow I would think there is a marked difference between extrapolating figures for nine years time as opposed to a thousand years in the future or the past.

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"Another boat, another policy failure from the Howard government"

Julia Gillard
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chicken_lipsforme

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #250 - May 17^th, 2011 at 7:07am

astro_surf wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 9:40pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 11:56am:

adelcrow wrote on May 15^th, 2011 at 8:31pm:

Yep..Bolt and Jones have far superior scientific qualifications than Flannery.
You will also find that Flannery would happily admit to be wrong about plenty of things in his life..just like every other human on the planet.
But when it comes to the damage carbon pollution is doing to our planet..the only ones in the negative camp are shock jocks, insane inbred british lords, and opposition pollies Grin

His quals aren't the problem
It's the simple fact that not one of his doom and gloom predictions has happened.
Perhaps he should try reading tea leaves instead.

You keep repeating the lie even though you can't support it. Other than the lies Andrew Bolt writes, I doubt you've ever even read a anything Flannery has every written. And you keep repeating the lie even after it's been shown to be a lie. You people sure do like to revel in your pig headed ignorance, don't you?

Support what, like the dams aren't empty of water?
The lie is in that they are full, and we haven't run out.
Nice try.

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"Another boat, another policy failure from the Howard government"

Julia Gillard
Shadow Health Minister
2003.

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astro_surf

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #251 - May 17^th, 2011 at 8:32am

chicken_lipsforme wrote on May 17^th, 2011 at 7:07am:

astro_surf wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 9:40pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 11:56am:

adelcrow wrote on May 15^th, 2011 at 8:31pm:

Yep..Bolt and Jones have far superior scientific qualifications than Flannery.
You will also find that Flannery would happily admit to be wrong about plenty of things in his life..just like every other human on the planet.
But when it comes to the damage carbon pollution is doing to our planet..the only ones in the negative camp are shock jocks, insane inbred british lords, and opposition pollies Grin

His quals aren't the problem
It's the simple fact that not one of his doom and gloom predictions has happened.
Perhaps he should try reading tea leaves instead.

You keep repeating the lie even though you can't support it. Other than the lies Andrew Bolt writes, I doubt you've ever even read a anything Flannery has every written. And you keep repeating the lie even after it's been shown to be a lie. You people sure do like to revel in your pig headed ignorance, don't you?

Support what, like the dams aren't empty of water?
The lie is in that they are full, and we haven't run out.
Nice try.

No, support that he ever made the sort of claims that Bolt suggests that he has. We've already looked at one example and shown that his only suggestion was that IF the drought conditions continued then Sydney could well run out of water. Thankfully those conditions DIDN'T continue and Sydney didn't run out of water, but it was perilously close. And just because that didn't happen during the last El Nino cycle doesn't mean it won't happen in the next. Because despite one strong La Nina year and a few record rainfalls, the climate trend in SE Aus is inexorably towards hotter, drier conditions and no amount of hand waving from polemicists like Bolt will change that.

But, as is always the caser with the denier-tards, once someone like Bolt has decreed that something is The Truth then it becomes The Truth and no amount of reason can alter that in you pea-like reptile minds.

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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am:

So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&

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astro_surf

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #252 - May 17^th, 2011 at 8:34am

chicken_lipsforme wrote on May 17^th, 2011 at 7:03am:

Keep laughing horsehead.
Somehow I would think there is a marked difference between extrapolating figures for nine years time as opposed to a thousand years in the future or the past.

More flagrant lies from somebody whose entire understanding of the science comes from denier screeds and polemicists like Andrew Bolt.

Citation or it didn't happen, numbnuts.

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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am:

So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&

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chicken_lipsforme

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #253 - May 17^th, 2011 at 9:27am

astro_surf wrote on May 17^th, 2011 at 8:34am:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on May 17^th, 2011 at 7:03am:

Keep laughing horsehead.
Somehow I would think there is a marked difference between extrapolating figures for nine years time as opposed to a thousand years in the future or the past.

More flagrant lies from somebody whose entire understanding of the science comes from denier screeds and polemicists like Andrew Bolt.

Citation or it didn't happen, numbnuts.

What lies are those.
You think it's easy to guesstimate world average temps from a thousand years ago when no white man was in the Pacific region let alone anyone in Europe logging temperatures, as opposed to in nine years time or a thousand years in the future.
The only citation you require is the one from the court putting you in the loony bin if you do.
Face it, the 'science' and entire arguement is based on guesstimate figures.

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"Another boat, another policy failure from the Howard government"

Julia Gillard
Shadow Health Minister
2003.

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BatteriesNotIncluded

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people died for this!

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Re: Should Abbott apologise to Flannery?
Reply #254 - May 17^th, 2011 at 11:47am

chicken_lipsforme wrote on May 17^th, 2011 at 7:03am:

BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 3:42pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on May 16^th, 2011 at 12:00pm:

BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on May 15^th, 2011 at 8:08pm:

astro_surf wrote on May 15^th, 2011 at 4:16pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 15^th, 2011 at 4:13pm:

they have been predicting ice-free summers for the past 3 years and since that has never happened how do you claim it is FASTER than predicted?

Source or it didn't happen. I'm tired of correcting your unsupported statements.

And this is what I mean, the rate of decline accelerating faster and deeper than the worst case scenario projected by climate models. I've made this point to you before, climate models are only wrong in the sense that they tend to conservatively underestimate the impact of AGW.

http://www.scienceprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/SeaIceDecline_591.gif

Quote:

Polar Ice Sheets Melting Faster Than Predicted

The thick glaciers covering Greenland and Antarctica are melting faster than scientists expected

By Lauren Morello and ClimateWire | March 9, 2011 | 11

Ice loss from the massive ice sheets covering Greenland and Antarctica is accelerating, according to a new study.

If the trend continues, ice sheets could become the dominant contributor to sea level rise sooner than scientists had predicted, concludes the research, which will be published this month in the journal Geophysical Research Letters.

"The traditional view of the loss of land ice on Earth has been that mountain glaciers and ice caps are the dominant contributors, and ice sheets are following behind," said study co-author Eric Rignot, a glaciologist at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory and the University of California, Irvine. "In this study, we are showing that ice sheets, mountain glaciers and ice caps are neck-and-neck."

But that could soon change, Rignot said, because the rate at which ice sheets are losing mass is increasing three times faster than the rate of ice loss from mountain glaciers and ice caps.

"I don't think we expected ice sheets to run neck-and-neck with mountain glaciers, which basically sit in a warmer climate, this soon," he said. "At the same time, the mass loss on the ice sheet is not very large compared to how much mass they store."

Rignot was part of a research team that also included scientists from Utrecht University in the Netherlands and the National Center for Atmospheric Research in Boulder, Colo.

The researchers based their analysis on a comparison of two different methods to measure ice loss.

Continued...

http://www.scienceprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/SeaIceDecline_591.gif

INTERESTING Shocked

Back under your bed horse.
The sky's falling because someones extrapolated figures don't look good.

IN PERTH THEY'RE EXTRAPOLATING FIGURES TO PREDICT THERE WILL BE A WATER SHORTAGE by 2020 if they don't build a SECOND DESAL PLANT.....

Cheesy

Keep laughing horsehead.
Somehow I would think there is a marked difference between extrapolating figures for nine years time as opposed to a thousand years in the future or the past.

Yeh, of course, but your precendent is still finished! Cheesy

...have a nice day won't you!!!! DON'T FORGET TO KEEP SMILING WHILE YOU'RE AT IT! Embarrassed

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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