Australian Politics Forum - Legalisation of pot?

Life_goes_on

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 4772
400kms south of Yobsville, Qld
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #45 - Apr 22^nd, 2011 at 9:48pm

Quote:

If marijuana was as widespread as cigarette smoking, it would kill even more people

Well, no, it wouldn't.

(Unless of course you know of some common way it can kill other than by the effects it has on the respiratory system)

The volume of smoke and tar consumed by a heavy pot smoker is far less than by someone who smokes say 30 cigarettes a day.

A pot smoker isn't going to bang down down 5 cones every 45 mins to an hour (5 cones being about the same volume of smoke and tar as a cigarette).

Few pot smokers smoke pot all day every day like the ubiquitous "pot head". Smokers of cigarettes smoke from waking to sleep. For most pot smokers it's an after work thing, but for the sake of argument let's assume they sneak 4 or 5 cones in during work. You're still only looking at the equiivalent of 2 or 3 cigarettes a day.

Our psychiatric institutions aren't full cannabis induced psychosis cases - it's quite rare for that happen. It's not a case of the more pot you smoke the more likely that it is to happen.

All drugs have a saturation point. The point where it's considered to be taken up by every potential user with a community. The saturation point for cannabis is very unlikely to be anywhere near as high as nicotine because it's simply far less addictive and has a relatively long effect period.

And at just what point does a substance or activity become "dangerous"?

(and before I get accused of being a pot smoker, I'm not. The last time I tried it was years ago - I'd have to go back 20 years to when I last had any at home.)

Back to top

"You're just one lucky motherf-cker" - Someone, 5th February 2013

Num num num num.

IP Logged

muso

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 13151
Gladstone, Queensland
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #46 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:03am

Emma wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2011 at 9:34pm:

[the only people who go on about it as if were a panacea are potheads]

Cheesy

Please spare us your ignorance - and your claim.
The opposite is the truth. See no-one believes potheads eh?
But what about about all those highly knowledgeable, credentialled and ' straight ' scientists and law enforcement experts, world-wide- who decry the W O D !! Who are now, and have been for 20 odd yrs calling on govt's that do persecute their citizens in such inequitable and obsessive ways...... to think again. Begging, basically.

LOL. I knew I'd draw a few comments. Sure, you'll find the occasional pothead site extolling the virtues of Marijuana, but although it has some beneficial effects, the problems it causes far outweighs these. You don't have to believe me personally, there have been plenty of studies. The Yanks have done more studies than most.

Does marijuana have any medical value?

Quote:

The Institute of Medicine conducted a comprehensive study in 1999 to assess the potential health benefits of marijuana and its constituent cannabinoids. The study concluded that smoking marijuana is not recommended for the treatment of any disease condition. In addition, there are more effective medications currently available. For those reasons, the Institute of Medicine concluded that there is little future in smoked marijuana as a medically approved medication.

http://www.justice.gov/dea/ongoing/marijuana.html
Quote:

Exposing the Myth of Smoked Medical Marijuana
Marijuana: The Facts

As far as the road safety myths are concerned, marijuana leads to slowed thinking and slower reflexes - precisely the things that cause accidents. The car might be going 100km/hr, but their brain is only doing 20km/hr.

It rots the brain cells and is linked to heart attacks within the first hour of use.

Quote:

In Summary:

* Marijuana is a dangerous, addictive drug that poses significant health threats to users.

* Marijuana has no medical value that can't be met more effectively by legal drugs.

* Marijuana users are far more likely to use other drugs like cocaine and heroin than non-marijuana users.

* Drug legalizers use "medical marijuana" as red herring in effort to advocate broader legalization of drug use.

In other words, marijuana is a so-called "gateway drug"

Back to top

« Last Edit: Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:25am by muso »

1523 people like this. The remaining 7,134,765,234 do not

IP Logged

muso

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 13151
Gladstone, Queensland
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #47 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:16am

Here's a link to the executive summary of the US IOM report on marijuana.

http://www.erowid.org/plants/cannabis/cannabis_medical_iom_report.pdf

You will find a plethora of websites citing parts of this report out of context. Of course cannabis has proven benefits (oh....wow..... man), but these are far outweighed by the harmful effects of smoking marijuana.

The overall conclusion of every major medical authority in the world is that it should remain illegal.

Now I've come across 'potheads' who were once respectable engineers and even doctors. After 20 years of cannabis addiction, their brains are hamburger.

I mean let's look at the downside:

Paranoia and other psychotic symptoms such as hallucinations with increased risk of developing schizophrenia
Lowered sex drive
Slow thinking
Slow reflexes
Reduced coordination
Problems concentrating
Reduced motivation
Dilated pupils
Bloodshot or glassy eyes
Dryness of the mouth
Increased appetite
Mood swings
Panic attacks
Anxiety and paranoia
Psychosis
Hallucinations
Delusions

Then there's suicide............

Back to top

1523 people like this. The remaining 7,134,765,234 do not

IP Logged

muso

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 13151
Gladstone, Queensland
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #48 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:23am

Quote:

Our psychiatric institutions aren't full cannabis induced psychosis cases - it's quite rare for that happen. It's not a case of the more pot you smoke the more likely that it is to happen.

There are a lot of people outside psychiatric institutes whose brains are shot. Regardless of their qualifications, they are unemployable.

Back to top

1523 people like this. The remaining 7,134,765,234 do not

IP Logged

NorthOfNorth

Gold Member

Offline

OzPolitic

Posts: 17258
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #49 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:27am

muso wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:16am:

Here's a link to the executive summary of the US IOM report on marijuana.

http://www.erowid.org/plants/cannabis/cannabis_medical_iom_report.pdf

You will find a plethora of websites citing parts of this report out of context. Of course cannabis has proven benefits (oh....wow..... man), but these are far outweighed by the harmful effects of smoking marijuana.

The overall conclusion of every major medical authority in the world is that it should remain illegal.

Now I've come across 'potheads' who were once respectable engineers and even doctors. After 20 years of cannabis addiction, their brains are hamburger.

I mean let's look at the downside:

Paranoia and other psychotic symptoms such as hallucinations with increased risk of developing schizophrenia
Lowered sex drive
Slow thinking
Slow reflexes
Reduced coordination
Problems concentrating
Reduced motivation
Dilated pupils
Bloodshot or glassy eyes
Dryness of the mouth
Increased appetite
Mood swings
Panic attacks
Anxiety and paranoia
Psychosis
Hallucinations
Delusions

Then there's suicide............

Anyone who manifests those kinds of symptoms is using pot to deal with a personality order or underlying psychiatric condition... Or they're running from something.

Back to top

Conviction is the art of being certain

IP Logged

muso

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 13151
Gladstone, Queensland
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #50 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:37am

NorthOfNorth wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:27am:

Anyone who manifests those kinds of symptoms is using pot to deal with a personality order or underlying psychiatric condition... Or they're running from something.

Well, I was accused of ignorance and making unsubstantiated claims. I've provided my citations from possibly the most respected Medical Institute in the world. By comparison, anecodotal claims just don't hold water.

Now it may well be true that casual users (those who use it a few times in a month) are less susceptible to these symptoms. I don't doubt that may be true.

Back to top

1523 people like this. The remaining 7,134,765,234 do not

IP Logged

Bobby.

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 120177
Melbourne
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #51 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:38am

This sounds like a list for alcohol:

Muso.
Quote:

Paranoia and other psychotic symptoms such as hallucinations with increased risk of developing schizophrenia
Lowered sex drive
Slow thinking
Slow reflexes
Reduced coordination
Problems concentrating
Reduced motivation
Dilated pupils
Bloodshot or glassy eyes
Dryness of the mouth
Increased appetite
Mood swings
Panic attacks
Anxiety and paranoia
Psychosis
Hallucinations
Delusions

Back to top

IP Logged

NorthOfNorth

Gold Member

Offline

OzPolitic

Posts: 17258
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #52 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:38am

muso wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:37am:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:27am:

Anyone who manifests those kinds of symptoms is using pot to deal with a personality order or underlying psychiatric condition... Or they're running from something.

Well, I was accused of ignorance and making unsubstantiated claims. I've provided my citations from possibly the most respected Medical Institute in the world. By comparison, anecodotal claims just don't hold water.

Would they be the same ones that class cannabis as a narcotic?

Back to top

Conviction is the art of being certain

IP Logged

muso

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 13151
Gladstone, Queensland
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #53 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:43am

NorthOfNorth wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:38am:

muso wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:37am:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:27am:

Anyone who manifests those kinds of symptoms is using pot to deal with a personality order or underlying psychiatric condition... Or they're running from something.

Well, I was accused of ignorance and making unsubstantiated claims. I've provided my citations from possibly the most respected Medical Institute in the world. By comparison, anecodotal claims just don't hold water.

Would they be the same ones that class cannabis as a narcotic?

No - That would be the Drug Enforcement Administration. I'm quoting US departments because the Institute of Medicine that I cited is US based.

Back to top

« Last Edit: Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:53am by muso »

1523 people like this. The remaining 7,134,765,234 do not

IP Logged

muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Legalisation of pot? Reply #54 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:45am Bobby. wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:38am: This sounds like a list for alcohol: Well I gave my source. Coincidentally I was pulled over by a cop on the way back from gym this morning. He asked me if I had had any alcoholic drinks in the past 24 hours. I replied that I hadn't had any alcoholic drinks in the past 24 years.
Back to top	1523 people like this. The remaining 7,134,765,234 do not IP Logged

muso

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 13151
Gladstone, Queensland
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #55 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:50am

Life_goes_on wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2011 at 9:48pm:

Well, no, it wouldn't.

(Unless of course you know of some common way it can kill other than by the effects it has on the respiratory system)

The volume of smoke and tar consumed by a heavy pot smoker is far less than by someone who smokes say 30 cigarettes a day.

Quote:

There are also many long-term health consequences of marijuana use. According to the National Institute of Health, studies show that someone who smokes five joints per week may be taking in as many cancer-causing chemicals as someone who smokes a full pack of cigarettes every day.

Marijuana contains more than 400 chemicals, including most of the harmful substances found in tobacco smoke. Smoking one marijuana cigarette deposits about four times more tar into the lungs than a filtered tobacco cigarette.

http://www.justice.gov/dea/ongoing/marijuana.html

Back to top

1523 people like this. The remaining 7,134,765,234 do not

IP Logged

NorthOfNorth

Gold Member

Offline

OzPolitic

Posts: 17258
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #56 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:55am

From my experience, those who use pot to the point of manifesting those symptoms are already disturbed or have a predisposition towards psychosis or suffer a personality disorder. The same is true for those who overuse alcohol.

Every mind altering drug can have dangerous side effects when overused. Nitrous Oxide for example... Generally believed to be safe when used in moderation and used legally as an anaesthetic. When overused, it quickly depletes the body of Vitamin B12 causing simulations of brain damage... Never mind the actual brain damage that can occur due to oxygen deprivation.

Mind alterers like pot and alcohol can have very positive effects when used responsibly and in moderation (i.e. when not used in an attempt to evade the effects of personality disorders / psychological troubles etc).

Back to top

Conviction is the art of being certain

IP Logged

Bobby.

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 120177
Melbourne
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #57 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 9:24am

muso wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:45am:

Bobby. wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 8:38am:

This sounds like a list for alcohol:

Well I gave my source. Coincidentally I was pulled over by a cop on the way back from gym this morning. He asked me if I had had any alcoholic drinks in the past 24 hours. I replied that I hadn't had any alcoholic drinks in the past 24 years.

Yes - the cops are everywhere & always there when you don't
need them and never there when you do.

Anyway - the list you gave would be similar for alcohol.
Whenever you intefere with the workings of the brain
that list would apply.

Back to top

IP Logged

Emma

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 9853
OZ
Gender: female

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #58 - Apr 23^rd, 2011 at 11:21pm

Did you know-

- that all you folk saying 'keep it illegal, pot smokers are all a-h's and ratbags -- tough poo " .... are actually actively supporting massive funding for criminals, here and overseas, and terrorists,..... as a certainty.???

Do you consider or care about the far reaching consequences of your mindless mouthing of the status quo? Or perhaps you rub your hands in approval and satisfaction when you hear about a local , or national alleged 'successful' police operation against drugs.!?

(incidentally - the comments labelled - 'from anecdotal evidence..' are such BS.) Who are they trying to convince? Of what?

So - Illegal drugs provide FUNDs- ie. $ - you know???? MONEY.

Funds that are far beyond the reach of any individual country or organisation undertaking this War on Drugs (WOD), Funds which enable and arm terrorism, and organised crime, to reap all the benefits of the premium put on 'illicit' drugs.

Such FOOLS are we.!!

Did you realise that you -
Are supporting a divisive policy which breaks up our society into opposing groups who essentially have NO understanding of each other?
But who continue to insist on their unimpeachable opinion.!!

And a policy that creates a sub-strata of people to whom prohibitionist legislation is applied, so that they are persecuted, hated, jailed and removed from polite people's sight. Pre- Victorian era stuff!!

Did you know? you are totally unconcerned at the corruption of police, - federal, state, and local, and the outcomes of same.?
Perhaps I should give yous a credit - maybe you are just part of THE IGNORANT!.

Who me??? yes you. We all live in this country, and this sick policy continues. Angry

Back to top

live every day

IP Logged

Bobby.

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 120177
Melbourne
Gender: male

Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #59 - Apr 24^th, 2011 at 12:24am

I can't help wondering when I see that reality Customs TV show callled
Border Security.
While they arrest some mule with a little package of drugs -
you can't help thinking there is someone like Robert Trimbole
importing a whole container load just down the road.
I watched the Underbelly TV series & I bet a lot of it was true. Grin

Back to top

IP Logged