Australian Politics Forum - Legalisation of pot?

mrhammerhead

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Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #30 - Apr 15^th, 2011 at 2:13am

James Bluntus wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2011 at 3:08pm:

Legalise, decrimilise or keep illegal?

Being a pot user myself, if it is legalize there is no more adventure of buying and using it, the feeling of hiding and always be careful because once it is legal you could buy it anywhere and talked about tax and everything they will put on pot.

Keep in illegal and still users like me will like it that way since it offers more challenge in buying while cops are chasing hehehehe..

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Amadd

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Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #31 - Apr 16^th, 2011 at 1:58am

Everything is a drug. Ingest too much H2O and you will die.

The question is only, "Is this chemical good for my idea of what society should be like?"

Can we really rely on laws which prohibit some chemicals and allow others?
It's a bit stupid. Cannibis has never been found to cause one single death in the history of mankind, and yet it is seen as a big evil.
There is very little evil about cannibis, except maybe the lack of production from the plebs.

I am an alcohol user, where I was once a cannibis user. No drugs at all would be better, but I wish with 20-20 hindsight that I had stuck with cannibis.

I now use every legal drug under the sun in an attempt to compensate.
...it costs me money and it makes them money.

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muso

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Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #32 - Apr 16^th, 2011 at 8:58am

Amadd wrote on Mar 14^th, 2011 at 1:41am:

Quote:

The problem with legalising cannabis is that it would be smoked even more prolifically than it is now, especially at work. I've heard people boast they can work and drive well while stoned, but they're kidding themselves.

Generally, I think that it is a very different drug to alcohol. It usually causes one to drive more carefully with far less sacrifice of cognetive skill than that which ocurrs with alcohol.

Most people have tried it, and most don't really care for it unless the situation is right.
If there was a higher (no pun) demand for it, then it would be all over the place as it is easily grown and distributed quite easily without detection.

I've seen many a bong-head, and believe you me, it is a service to society to keep them on it. You really wouldn't like them when they're mad.

It's the bud that has kept them from being mad, not the other way 'round.

Well, it's a complicated issue. What I highlighted is probably the main cause of accidents due to drugs like cannabis. It's the effects on personality that impair the judgement of people. Mind you, a lot of people don't need drugs to become hotheads.

With alcohol and drugs, it's not the acute immediate effects that are always the main problem. As has been proven with study after study, if you have a heavy night on the grog, your judgement will be impaired the next day, as will your ability to concentrate - even if there is no alcohol detected in your system.

As far as the minimum harm track is concerned, the answer lies in encouraging people to drink responsibly. That's all you can do in a free society. If you pull somebody up who had say 6 standard drinks the night before and they had a breathalyser reading of zero, that person will be more impaired (and therefore more likely to have an accident) than those who had three standard drinks for breakfast Grin

. That's a medical fact, but of course it's difficult to measure impairment. The old police method of getting the driver to walk a straight line (still used in the States) is probably more accurate than the breathalyser.

Amadd - this one will crack you up:

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« Last Edit: Apr 16^th, 2011 at 9:04am by muso »

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Bobby. Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 120097 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Legalisation of pot? Reply #33 - Apr 16^th, 2011 at 11:55am Come on Muso - that video is not a real bust.
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Amadd Gold Member Offline Mo Posts: 6217	Re: Legalisation of pot? Reply #34 - Apr 18^th, 2011 at 5:16pm Yeah I've got a sneaking suspicion that the youtube clip may be staged As for road accidents involving cannibis, I 'd like to see the stats vs. alcohol and also vs. the average for 18-15yr old males.
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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Legalisation of pot? Reply #35 - Apr 20^th, 2011 at 10:08am Bobby. wrote on Apr 16^th, 2011 at 11:55am: Come on Muso - that video is not a real bust. I know. It's from a comedy show, but it's funny all the same.
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Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #36 - Apr 20^th, 2011 at 10:55am

Amadd wrote on Apr 18^th, 2011 at 5:16pm:

Yeah I've got a sneaking suspicion that the youtube clip may be staged Grin

As for road accidents involving cannibis, I 'd like to see the stats vs. alcohol and also vs. the average for 18-15yr old males.

the stats are stage to appear worse than they are.
They say X% of road crash victims have dope in their system. Sounds bad, until you discover that a) this includes passengers and b) Weed can take 30 days to be purged from the body, so they don't even need to be under the influence at the time.

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muso

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Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #37 - Apr 21^st, 2011 at 8:52am

... wrote on Apr 20^th, 2011 at 10:55am:

Amadd wrote on Apr 18^th, 2011 at 5:16pm:

Yeah I've got a sneaking suspicion that the youtube clip may be staged Grin

As for road accidents involving cannibis, I 'd like to see the stats vs. alcohol and also vs. the average for 18-15yr old males.

the stats are stage to appear worse than they are.
They say X% of road crash victims have dope in their system. Sounds bad, until you discover that a) this includes passengers and b) Weed can take 30 days to be purged from the body, so they don't even need to be under the influence at the time.

Well that is sometimes true, but it's not necessarily detectable in a roadside saliva test. Actually it's not the case for occasional light users. It's a complex issue. It depends on your level of body fat among other things.

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Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #38 - Apr 21^st, 2011 at 10:06am

muso wrote on Apr 21^st, 2011 at 8:52am:

... wrote on Apr 20^th, 2011 at 10:55am:

Amadd wrote on Apr 18^th, 2011 at 5:16pm:

Yeah I've got a sneaking suspicion that the youtube clip may be staged Grin

As for road accidents involving cannibis, I 'd like to see the stats vs. alcohol and also vs. the average for 18-15yr old males.

the stats are stage to appear worse than they are.
They say X% of road crash victims have dope in their system. Sounds bad, until you discover that a) this includes passengers and b) Weed can take 30 days to be purged from the body, so they don't even need to be under the influence at the time.

Well that is sometimes true, but it's not necessarily detectable in a roadside saliva test. Actually it's not the case for occasional light users. It's a complex issue. It depends on your level of body fat among other things.

yeah, I know 30 days is at the extreme end of the scale, but seeing as how the effects last a coupla hours, even if it is detectable for just a week afterwards, it still doesn't give an accurate assessment of whether they are impaired at the time of the crash.

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In the fullness of time...

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Life_goes_on

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Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #39 - Apr 21^st, 2011 at 12:07pm

Quote:

yeah, I know 30 days is at the extreme end of the scale, but seeing as how the effects last a coupla hours, even if it is detectable for just a week afterwards, it still doesn't give an accurate assessment of whether they are impaired at the time of the crash.

I don't know about other states, but in NSW and Vic you have blood taken after a vehicle accident resulting in an injury (even if you're uninjured and you blow a zero reading).

Roadside drug tests are only designed to detect drug use within 12 or so hours (drug type dependent) - anything longer and suddenly you have a lot of people fighting the issue in court.

Blood tests will detect use up until about 7 days. It is the blood test result that gets used in vehicle accident/injury/fatality stats. They don't differentiate between high and trace levels. Any trace then causes that accident to be one flagged as "where drug use was a factor". It doesn't matter if the person returning the positive result was fast asleep in the back of a parked vehicle that got hit by another vehicle - it still counts as an accident where drug use was a factor.

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Life_goes_on Gold Member Offline Posts: 4772 400kms south of Yobsville, Qld Gender:	Re: Legalisation of pot? Reply #40 - Apr 21^st, 2011 at 12:19pm In regards to vehicle accident statistics, the only state in Australia that goes to any real trouble in finding actual causes and reports them accurately is South Australia. ...well, that was the case about 4 or 5 years ago.
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Thealexman.

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Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #41 - Apr 21^st, 2011 at 7:10pm

Marijuana is the best drug to cure anxiety and depression it has no side effects other than a dry mouth and and a slightly increased heart rate. Studies have also shown that it helps chemotherapy patients recover quicker and studies also show that it can actually kill cancer cells. The stereotype that people who smoke Marijuana have is completely wrong, we don't sit around and do nothing, our minds don't change for the worse. I am a student and I've been a heavy smoker for just over a year and I'm an A student, I get the odd B in English.
Marijuana kills less people a year than alcohol does with zero Marijuana related deaths and 3000 alcohol related. Why aren't smokes illegal? Thousands, no hundreds of thousands of people have died because of smoking cigarettes but they are legal. In California where only medicinal cannabis is legal the government there make 4 billion a year. If Marijuana was legal and cigarettes were banned less people would die of cancer and less people would die on the road because everyone would be going at 45kmph and nobody would get fines. LEGALISE CANNABIS IT DOES NO HARM.

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Life_goes_on

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Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #42 - Apr 21^st, 2011 at 8:52pm

Back when I was a pot smoker I used to love driving stoned - or at least being in a car when stoned.

Sydney - Adelaide
Adelaide - Melbourne
Melbourne - Sydney
Sydney - Coffs
Coffs - Moree
Moree - Sydney
Sydney - Melbourne
Melbourne - Adelaide
Adelaide - Sydney

All so incredibly stoned - all such good, good times.

As for medicinal excuses for getting stoned?

Pffft. Who cares, for the bulk of the population who smoke pot, that's not the reason why they do it, so don't go fishing for excuses.

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muso

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Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #43 - Apr 22^nd, 2011 at 7:50pm

Thealexman. wrote on Apr 21^st, 2011 at 7:10pm:

Marijuana is the best drug to cure anxiety and depression it has no side effects ..................................LEGALISE CANNABIS IT DOES NO HARM.

I think I prefer to listen to what experts say:

http://www.drugs.health.gov.au/internet/drugs/publishing.nsf/content/marijuana

...and try the questionnaire here:
http://ncpic.org.au/

If marijuana was as widespread as cigarette smoking, it would kill even more people.

Like tobacco, marijuana is a dangerous drug.

If it was the best drug to cure depression, it would be approved by the NH & MRC. It usually makes depression much worse.

The only people who go on about it as if it were a panacea are pot heads.

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Emma

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Re: Legalisation of pot?
Reply #44 - Apr 22^nd, 2011 at 9:34pm

[the only people who go on about it as if were a panacea are potheads]

Cheesy

Please spare us your ignorance - and your claim.
The opposite is the truth. See no-one believes potheads eh?
But what about about all those highly knowledgeable, credentialled and ' straight ' scientists and law enforcement experts, world-wide- who decry the W O D !! Who are now, and have been for 20 odd yrs calling on govt's that do persecute their citizens in such inequitable and obsessive ways...... to think again. Begging, basically.

Much too simplistic there er MUSO, and one can always choose ones experts, if one wants to support an argument - wotever 'side' ur on.

As for the comment 'drugs or alcohol or cigarettes' seen so often --you want to be honest about it ???

JUST SAY DRUGS!!
Speaking of (..sspitt.!) statisitics ........ remember Samual Clemens.

So much to say on this - one of the stupidest 'social egineering experiments' of all time !! The War on Drugs.!!!

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