Australian Politics Forum - A precedent against voluntary abortion?

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A precedent against voluntary abortion?
Nov 16^th, 2010 at 4:28pm

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A Noble Park man, whose dangerous driving caused the death of an unborn baby, has been sentenced to three years and five months in jail.

Judge Meryl Sexton told the court Amrick Thind, 23, was driving aggressively, weaving in and out of traffic along Warrigal Road in Oakleigh, Victoria when he suddenly changed lanes, clipping a four-wheel drive and sending it veering head on into Hannah Robert's car.

Ms Robert was eight months pregnant and lost her unborn baby daughter in the crash. Four other people were also injured.

Judge Sexton said she did not accept Thind had made a "split second" decision to change lanes, but rather had taken "unnecessary risks" in driving too close to the car in front.

"The way in which you were driving caused irreversible and heartbreaking changes to the lives of a number of those people," she said.

She said no-one could fail to be touched by the eloquent and powerful statements of Ms Robert and her partner about the loss of their baby girl.

"Slowly, they have recovered from their physical injuries. It will take much longer for their emotional healing," she said.

In sentencing Thind, Judge Sexton told the court she accepted his remorse, but said it was lessened by his decision to flee the scene after he saw the collision.

"I must state clearly that conduct of the kind you engaged in will not be tolerated," she said.

Thind pleaded guilty to five counts of dangerous driving causing serious injury and failing to stop at the scene of an accident.

He will serve a non-parole period of two years and three months.

He has been ordered to pay $6,523 for damage to Ms Robert's car, and is likely to face deportation after his release from prison.

So if he can be punsihed for accidentally causing the death of an unborn babay, what of those who wilfully do so?

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Verge

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Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion?
Reply #1 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 4:44pm

No he wasnt Wes. No charges of manslaughter or murder there, not even dangerous driving causing death.

And as far as Im concerned, the baby was only a month of being due. Its hardly abortion at that time dont you think.

The asshole should have got aleast another 10 for manslaughter in my book. If my wife lost our baby because of someone like this, it would be me doing time.

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Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion?
Reply #2 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 4:56pm

Verge wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 4:44pm:

No he wasnt Wes. No charges of manslaughter or murder there, not even dangerous driving causing death.

And as far as Im concerned, the baby was only a month of being due. Its hardly abortion at that time dont you think.

The asshole should have got aleast another 10 for manslaughter in my book. If my wife lost our baby because of someone like this, it would be me doing time.

Not officially, but the sentence, in comparison to others on the same charges suggests he was, in actuality, punished for causing the death of the unborn child.

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darkhall67 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1935	Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion? Reply #3 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:02pm So you are equating the tragic death of an eight month old foetus that was planned for and wanted by the parents to removing a cluster of unwanted cells ?
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... Gold Member Offline Posts: 23673 WA Gender:	Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion? Reply #4 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:03pm darkhall67 wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:02pm: So you are equating the tragic death of an eight month old foetus that was planned for and wanted by the parents to removing a cluster of unwanted cells ? What a lovely way to view the beginning of a new life.
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tickfen

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Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion?
Reply #5 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:04pm

... wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 4:28pm:

Quote:

A Noble Park man, whose dangerous driving caused the death of an unborn baby, has been sentenced to three years and five months in jail.

Judge Meryl Sexton told the court Amrick Thind, 23, was driving aggressively, weaving in and out of traffic along Warrigal Road in Oakleigh, Victoria when he suddenly changed lanes, clipping a four-wheel drive and sending it veering head on into Hannah Robert's car.

Ms Robert was eight months pregnant and lost her unborn baby daughter in the crash. Four other people were also injured.

Judge Sexton said she did not accept Thind had made a "split second" decision to change lanes, but rather had taken "unnecessary risks" in driving too close to the car in front.

"The way in which you were driving caused irreversible and heartbreaking changes to the lives of a number of those people," she said.

She said no-one could fail to be touched by the eloquent and powerful statements of Ms Robert and her partner about the loss of their baby girl.

"Slowly, they have recovered from their physical injuries. It will take much longer for their emotional healing," she said.

In sentencing Thind, Judge Sexton told the court she accepted his remorse, but said it was lessened by his decision to flee the scene after he saw the collision.

"I must state clearly that conduct of the kind you engaged in will not be tolerated," she said.

Thind pleaded guilty to five counts of dangerous driving causing serious injury and failing to stop at the scene of an accident.

He will serve a non-parole period of two years and three months.

He has been ordered to pay $6,523 for damage to Ms Robert's car, and is likely to face deportation after his release from prison.

So if he can be punsihed for accidentally causing the death of an unborn babay, what of those who wilfully do so?

Youre right
It would appear that the sentencing judge took into account the unborn.
And if any portion of his sentence whatsoever is due to the unborn dying then yes, abortionists and mothers having an abortion should also be prosecuted.

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Yeah, I know I'm right, so I guess you just have to learn to live with that!

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darkhall67

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Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion?
Reply #6 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:20pm

... wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:03pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:02pm:

So you are equating the tragic death of an eight month old foetus that was planned for and wanted by the parents to removing a cluster of unwanted cells ?

What a lovely way to view the beginning of a new life.

Does reality have to be viewed through a rosy hued lens?

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Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion?
Reply #7 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:21pm

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:20pm:

... wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:03pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:02pm:

So you are equating the tragic death of an eight month old foetus that was planned for and wanted by the parents to removing a cluster of unwanted cells ?

What a lovely way to view the beginning of a new life.

Does reality have to be viewed through a rosy hued lens?

Of course not, but conversely doesn't have to viewed through a poo-stained lens either.

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darkhall67 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1935	Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion? Reply #8 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:26pm I fail to see any brown colour in my previous posts. Perhaps your glasses are dirty.
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... Gold Member Offline Posts: 23673 WA Gender:	Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion? Reply #9 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:29pm perhaps you deliberately try to dehumanise the 'bunch of unwanted cells' to assuage any guilt you may have about snuffing them out?
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darkhall67 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1935	Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion? Reply #10 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 6:15pm ... wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:29pm: perhaps you deliberately try to dehumanise the 'bunch of unwanted cells' to assuage any guilt you may have about snuffing them out? A human aint a human unless it has a brain (insert witty comment about my brain here).
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Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion?
Reply #11 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 6:19pm

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 6:15pm:

... wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:29pm:

perhaps you deliberately try to dehumanise the 'bunch of unwanted cells' to assuage any guilt you may have about snuffing them out?

A human aint a human unless it has a brain (insert witty comment about my brain here).

And the brain forms in a foetus after only a couple of weeks.

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PeterPan

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Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion?
Reply #12 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 6:25pm

... wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 6:19pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 6:15pm:

... wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:29pm:

perhaps you deliberately try to dehumanise the 'bunch of unwanted cells' to assuage any guilt you may have about snuffing them out?

A human aint a human unless it has a brain (insert witty comment about my brain here).

And the brain forms in a foetus after only a couple of weeks.

Right! That explains why some people were allowed to survive and became GREEN voters.

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tickfen

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Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion?
Reply #13 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 6:27pm

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 6:15pm:

... wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:29pm:

perhaps you deliberately try to dehumanise the 'bunch of unwanted cells' to assuage any guilt you may have about snuffing them out?

A human aint a human unless it has a brain (insert witty comment about my brain here).

Such an attempt to draw a line in the sand is purely artificial, what we do know is that life begins at conception.

And that is where the human begins its cycle.

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Yeah, I know I'm right, so I guess you just have to learn to live with that!

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darkhall67

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Re: A precedent against voluntary abortion?
Reply #14 - Nov 16^th, 2010 at 6:32pm

... wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 6:19pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 6:15pm:

... wrote on Nov 16^th, 2010 at 5:29pm:

perhaps you deliberately try to dehumanise the 'bunch of unwanted cells' to assuage any guilt you may have about snuffing them out?

A human aint a human unless it has a brain (insert witty comment about my brain here).

And the brain forms in a foetus after only a couple of weeks.

http://brainmind.com/FetalBrainDevelopment.html

"The human brainstem is fashioned around the 7th week of gestation and matures in a caudal to rostral arc thereby forming the medulla, pons, and midbrain. The medulla mediates arousal, breathing, heart rate, and gross movement of the body and head, and medullary functions appear prior to those of the pons which precede those of the midbrain. Hence, by the 9th gestational week the fetus will display spontaneous movements, one week later takes its first breath, and by the 25th week demonstrates stimulus-induced heart rate accelerations. As the pons, which is later to mature, mediates arousal, body movements, and vestibular and vibroacoustic perception, from around the 20th to 27th weeks the fetus responds with arousal and body movements to vibroacoustic and loud sounds delivered to the maternal abdomen. The midbrain inferior-auditory followed by the superior-visual colliculi is the last to mature, and in conjunction with the lower brainstem makes fine auditory discriminations, and reacts to sound with fetal heart rate (FHR) accelerations, head turning, and eye movements--around the 36th week."

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