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Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ??? (Read 22660 times)
imcrookonit
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Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Sep 14th, 2010 at 9:53am
 

How the rich get well - and enjoy subsidies



Before we get too carried away with our relative success, we should note that some ''reforms'' made by the Howard government to Medicare continue to attack equality of access.

The first of these is the private health insurance rebate, by which the government pays 30 per cent or more of the cost of private health cover. This is promoted as a way of ''taking pressure'' off the public system. Unhappily, the evidence for this is scant, whereas it is clear that treating people privately remains far more lucrative for doctors.

Many, if not most, of those with private health insurance are relatively well off and would have it regardless of the rebate. Yet it costs the taxpayer $3 billion a year and largely represents redistribution of scarce public health dollars to the affluent.
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mellie
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #1 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 9:57am
 
You fool, getting rid of the 30% rebate will place more demands on the public health system, as many (many who aren't rich by the way) wont be able to afford their private health care premiums.

If you think private health care is for the wealthy, think again, most people I know have it, and I wouldn't call them rich....just ordinary Australians.

I think it's particularly important to have it if you have children,  or are elderly.

If you think it's not made a difference, get rid of the 30% rebate and see how long you have to wait for surgery via the public system then.

I would be willing to pay an extra 30% for a year, just to show you up!

Cool




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imcrookonit
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #2 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 10:00am
 
By getting rid of the rebate could we not put the money straight back, into the public hospital system?.
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BobH
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #3 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 10:01am
 
Quote:
How the rich get well - and enjoy subsidies



Before we get too carried away with our relative success, we should note that some ''reforms'' made by the Howard government to Medicare continue to attack equality of access.

The first of these is the private health insurance rebate, by which the government pays 30 per cent or more of the cost of private health cover. This is promoted as a way of ''taking pressure'' off the public system. Unhappily, the evidence for this is scant, whereas it is clear that treating people privately remains far more lucrative for doctors.

Many, if not most, of those with private health insurance are relatively well off and would have it regardless of the rebate. Yet it costs the taxpayer $3 billion a year and largely represents redistribution of scarce public health dollars to the affluent.

I'd like to see Medicare worked in to the flat tax/high tax-free threshold proposed by the Henry Tax review. So if you set the high tax-free threshold at $25000, those who earn more than that are not entitled to Medicare. You then supplement that with easier access to Health Savings Accounts, or perhaps even forced savings similar to the Superannuation system, to help people get off the system of relying on third party insurance for medical coverage and on to a market-based system of paying for medical costs out of pocket. This is done very successfully in Singapore, which is ranked #6 in the world for health care according to the UN. Market-based health care works. You can achieve universal health care without government control.
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mellie
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #4 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 10:06am
 
If you get rid of the 30%, many many will exist the private health care system, and in droves, of which will place so much pressure on the public system, it would be ridiculous.

In theory, it sounds great, (I only have private extras, not hospital cover at present by the way given our local hospital is very good).. for when Rudd came in, we had to compromise)..but I can tell you now.... the ALP wouldn't put the 30% into public health, when they cant even put anything back into public education.





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mellie
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #5 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 10:09am
 
At least this way, we have choices, we may go public or private...the ALP would love to take these choices away from us.

The ALP wont be happy until we are a socialist Republic.

Roll Eyes
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imcrookonit
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #6 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 10:14am
 
Perhaps we could still keep the rebate for some people, but should we means test it for those that are well off?.  After all as you know, we cant all afford private health insurance.  In other words a rebate is all well and good, but should those that are well off, and that can easily afford the insurance still get the rebate?.
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buzzanddidj
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #7 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 10:26am
 
You will ALWAYS have divided opinion on middle class welfare - as you will on public funding to elite private schools

Don't expect consensus on a matter of personal political ideology
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Deborahmac09
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #8 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 10:35am
 
mellie wrote on Sep 14th, 2010 at 9:57am:
You fool, getting rid of the 30% rebate will place more demands on the public health system, as many (many who aren't rich by the way) wont be able to afford their private health care premiums.

If you think private health care is for the wealthy, think again, most people I know have it, and I wouldn't call them rich....just ordinary Australians.

I think it's particularly important to have it if you have children,  or are elderly.

If you think it's not made a difference, get rid of the 30% rebate and see how long you have to wait for surgery via the public system then.

I would be willing to pay an extra 30% for a year, just to show you up!

Cool






For once I agree with Millie.
*shock horror*
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Deborahmac09
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #9 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 10:40am
 
Quote:
Perhaps we could still keep the rebate for some people, but should we means test it for those that are well off?.  After all as you know, we cant all afford private health insurance.  In other words a rebate is all well and good, but should those that are well off, and that can easily afford the insurance still get the rebate?.


Everyone who pays tax, pays the medicare levy. If they are forced to pay the levi, then they are entitled to medicare. End of story. (residents anyway)
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Andrei.Hicks
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #10 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 2:53pm
 
In a word NO, we should not.

Think of this situation -

1) A person is earning roughly A$150k per year. He takes out private healthcare. He is paying over $60,000 in tax to the ATO. When he needs hospital cover he doesn't use the public system.

2) A person is either not working, claiming benefits, earning a low amount and paying very little if any tax. He uses the public system.

Who is funding who? Who is helping to pay for the public system and NOT USING IT.


Answer me this why should those people who earn $150k+ directly pay for their own healthcare AND fund those who don't pay for the public system.

Why should we have one set of people living off the backs of others?
Why should we pay for other people?

I never had a free ride in life, I worked hard. I fail to see why its acceptable to give it others.

I refuse to support losers and deadbeats.
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Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde
 
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buzzanddidj
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #11 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 3:06pm
 
Quote:
Perhaps we could still keep the rebate for some people, but should we means test it for those that are well off?.  After all as you know, we cant all afford private health insurance.  In other words a rebate is all well and good, but should those that are well off, and that can easily afford the insurance still get the rebate?.




That's pretty much the concept of the upcoming legislation
The rebate would be means tested and gradually reduce, based on need

It would be abolished TOTALLY for a family on $300,000 plus per annum
There are those that argue that these people are 'not rich' and still in need of tax breaks, despite earning over FIVE times the average annual income
It is estimated those affected by the means  test in ANY way are the top 15% of income earners



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Andrei.Hicks
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #12 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 3:09pm
 

Buzz - my family unit is not far off A$300k per year.
We are NOT rich.

Wayne Rooney earns in a WEEK what I earn in an entire year.

Tell me again that we are rich??

Comparing us to dropouts is hardly demonstrating we're rich.
Rich is Rooney, Beckham, Lleyton Hewitt, Rupert Murdoch, need I go on.....
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Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde
 
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buzzanddidj
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #13 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 3:34pm
 
Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 14th, 2010 at 3:09pm:
Buzz - my family unit is not far off A$300k per year.
We are NOT rich.

Wayne Rooney earns in a WEEK what I earn in an entire year.

Tell me again that we are rich??

Comparing us to dropouts is hardly demonstrating we're rich.
Rich is Rooney, Beckham, Lleyton Hewitt, Rupert Murdoch, need I go on.....





You may not be "rich", on FIVE times the average workers income - but nor are you in need of government assistance to pay your family health insurance

The function of welfare is to give those at the bottom and middle of the ladder a bit of a boost up
If EVERYONE gets welfare - effectively, NO-ONE does



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'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.
Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'


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Andrei.Hicks
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Re: Should We Get Rid Of The Private Health Rebate ???
Reply #14 - Sep 14th, 2010 at 3:39pm
 
I fundamentally disagree.

If I am paying for private healthcare and not using the public system then explain to me why I should pay for someone else to use the public system at my expense and for them to pay nothing??

In the United States, I have private healthcare. I am able to afford this why?
Because my taxes are lower.
Why?
Because I do not have a burden of paying for other people to use a public system.
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Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde
 
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