Australian Politics Forum - Now its time for Gillards $8Billion BLACK HOLE

Andrei.Hicks Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 23818 Carlsbad, CA Gender:	Re: Now its time for Gillards $8Billion BLACK HOLE Reply #15 - Sep 7^th, 2010 at 11:18am Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 10:34am: One report is from Treasury, who have all the facts and figures. If you worked in Finance or Accounting you would realise who laughable that is!
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Ex Dame Pansi

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Re: Now its time for Gillards $8Billion BLACK HOLE
Reply #16 - Sep 7^th, 2010 at 11:52am

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 11:18am:

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 10:34am:

One report is from Treasury, who have all the facts and figures.

If you worked in Finance or Accounting you would realise who laughable that is!

Of course the accountant working for a pharma company would know all about the inner workings of the Dept. of Treasury.

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"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace." Hendrix
andrei said: Great isn't it? Seeing boatloads of what is nothing more than human garbage turn up.....

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Now its time for Gillards $8Billion BLACK HOLE
Reply #17 - Sep 7^th, 2010 at 11:56am

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 11:52am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 11:18am:

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 10:34am:

One report is from Treasury, who have all the facts and figures.

If you worked in Finance or Accounting you would realise who laughable that is!

Of course the accountant working for a pharma company would know all about the inner workings of the Dept. of Treasury.

When you are qualifying and a member of an Institute you have friends and colleagues that work all over commerce and industry.

Believe it or not we share experiences.

Government departments, and the Treasury in particular, are notorious for being completely inept at forecasting.

How many times have they revised the national debt figure?
8, 9, 10 times?

Guess how many times we revise our forecasted revenue for the year in our company?
Twice and % wise we are much, much closer than Treasuries ever get.

PS, I will compliment you that occasionally you are actually reasonably intelligent on some finance matters.
I am utterly baffled how you are only a shop assistant or whatever you say. Either you are the best read assistant in the world, or you're taking the piss out of all of us.
Most shop assistants that serve me wouldn't even know their way home unless it was written on their hand.

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longweekend58

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Re: Now its time for Gillards $8Billion BLACK HOLE
Reply #18 - Sep 7^th, 2010 at 12:05pm

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 10:34am:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 10:30am:

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 9:54am:

Last ditch effort to discredit the enemy, too little too late, I'd say.

so labors $8B blackhole is worse than Libs $7B blackhole, right?

or does this only apply when the argument is in yout favour?

One report is from Treasury, who have all the facts and figures. The other report is done by a resources group.

You took the spin hook, line and sinker longy.

The one who got sucked in is YOU, shopassistant. Treasury messed up the FIRST mining tax and said it was $12B when it was $35B. now they've got this one wrong as well. But they are consistant - they get almost EVERYTHGIN wrong.

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mozzaok

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Re: Now its time for Gillards $8Billion BLACK HOLE
Reply #19 - Sep 7^th, 2010 at 12:06pm

Verge wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 9:36am:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 9:34am:

mozzaok wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 9:16am:

Another top story coming in is that the Big Bad Wolf says that Granny was a crack dealer, so he had to eat her to protect the community.

Seriously????

A report, (obviously far more likely to be well rounded and independent)(cough, cough) from a mining industry group about the resource tax is your big scoop??

Thanks for that Moz, I failed to check report before responding, that is now retified.
Nice selective editing there Verge, an old Macca trait, seeing its not a huge article
here it is.
Quote:

Labor off $8b on mining tax - report

The Gillard government's proposed mining tax faces an $8 billion shortfall in revenue, according to a confidential report, The Australian newspaper says.

The report estimates the mineral resources rent tax will raise about $2.5 billion in its first two years, compared with the $10 billion the government forecast, the newspaper said on Tuesday.

The report, by global resources intelligence firm Intierra,

has not been released.

It estimates fewer than 50 companies will pay the tax.

It also highlights concerns among miners that in order to raise the projected $10.5 billion, a Labor-Greens government would raise the tax or expand it beyond iron and coal.

I copied the report word for word from the sky news site, and even provided the link.

I did no such editing, and am a tad annoyed at your insinuation.

True.
I can see when posts have been edited, and Verge's post does not say it was edited.

I prefer not to see the more sensible and moderate opposition supporters unnecessarily roped in with the few lunatic fringe extremists, as these moderates do offer perspective to issues from the conservative side of politics that are worth hearing.

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OOPS!!! My Karma, ran over your Dogma!

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Dsmithy70

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Re: Now its time for Gillards $8Billion BLACK HOLE
Reply #20 - Sep 7^th, 2010 at 1:24pm

mozzaok wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 12:06pm:

Verge wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 9:36am:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 9:34am:

mozzaok wrote on Sep 7^th, 2010 at 9:16am:

Another top story coming in is that the Big Bad Wolf says that Granny was a crack dealer, so he had to eat her to protect the community.

Seriously????

A report, (obviously far more likely to be well rounded and independent)(cough, cough) from a mining industry group about the resource tax is your big scoop??

Thanks for that Moz, I failed to check report before responding, that is now retified.
Nice selective editing there Verge, an old Macca trait, seeing its not a huge article
here it is.
Quote:

Labor off $8b on mining tax - report

The Gillard government's proposed mining tax faces an $8 billion shortfall in revenue, according to a confidential report, The Australian newspaper says.

The report estimates the mineral resources rent tax will raise about $2.5 billion in its first two years, compared with the $10 billion the government forecast, the newspaper said on Tuesday.

The report, by global resources intelligence firm Intierra,

has not been released.

It estimates fewer than 50 companies will pay the tax.

It also highlights concerns among miners that in order to raise the projected $10.5 billion, a Labor-Greens government would raise the tax or expand it beyond iron and coal.

I copied the report word for word from the sky news site, and even provided the link.

I did no such editing, and am a tad annoyed at your insinuation.

True.
I can see when posts have been edited, and Verge's post does not say it was edited.

I prefer not to see the more sensible and moderate opposition supporters unnecessarily roped in with the few lunatic fringe extremists, as these moderates do offer perspective to issues from the conservative side of politics that are worth hearing.

And within 5 minutes of posting that I'd realised my error and apologised, which everyone can see so why the re-print?
The edit I referred to is not on posts here but as I said an old foes habit of pasting good bits & leaving out bad in articles.

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mozzaok Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 6741 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Now its time for Gillards $8Billion BLACK HOLE Reply #21 - Sep 7^th, 2010 at 1:33pm Good on you for doing the right thing and apologising Smithy, I had to leave the computer for a while, and hadn't noticed your apology.
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vegitamite

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Re: Now its time for Gillards $8Billion BLACK HOLE
Reply #22 - Sep 7^th, 2010 at 1:41pm

Good summary here below . Seems its a choice between giving taxes back to the people OR services. Which brings up the question what is a governments role ?

http://truepolitik.blogspot.com/

Sunday, September 05, 2010
Treasury Comparison

The Independent MP's have had briefings from Treasury officials about the costings of the election policies of both the ALP and Liberal-National Party Coalition. These costings, and some policies important to them, will form the basis of which side of politics forms a minority government in Australia: a largely centrist-conservative Labor government; or a more right-wing conservative Liberal-National Coalition government.

A summary of the costings can be viewed at
Coalition-costings
Labor Party Costings

So, which is the better economic manager? I doubt you could form an opinion based on these documents. the only possible conclusions are that: there is little difference between the final figures from Treasury; that the Liberals did not use standard Treasury methods for their costings (based on the number of adjustments Treasury made). In terms of economic management, the sharemarket is indifferent, perhaps indicating that investors largely recognise that there is little or no significant economic difference between Labor and the Coalition. The market is more concerned about its ties to what happens in the US economy/sharemarket, and, to a lesser extent, in Europe.

My conclusion from the Treasury costings and the parties' public policy documents is hat the Liberals & Nationals lean more towards personal wealth, rather than community (public) wealth. That is, they want to distribute more public money (tax) to private entities, both individuals, and private companies, than does Labor.

I think it is important to retain, and enhance, our community/public wealth through investment in public education at all levels, public health and social programs that benefit individuals, communities and society. Becaue of those beliefs, I was once called a "latte-sipping, chardonay-drinking, left-wing (John) Howard-hater" by a Liberal Party supporter. I took it as a compliment.

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