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the politics of regional communities (Read 5542 times)
gizmo_2655
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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #15 - Aug 29th, 2010 at 1:03pm
 
freediver wrote on Aug 29th, 2010 at 9:37am:
I think you'll find they are getting paid more per bushel now.



Based on what?....the price per bushel on the stockmarket or cost to bread/flour manufacturers??

The 'Traded Price' for wheat and other grain crops in the World Marketplace doesn't necessarily reflect what price the 'grower' receives......
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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #16 - Aug 29th, 2010 at 1:32pm
 
Quote:
Every wheat farmer is loving the boom


SOARING wheat prices are sowing optimism over the Australian grainbelt, with the spike hoped to add more than $1 billion to the economy.
In the past week the price has jumped $50 a tonne, injecting an extra $1.1bn into Australia's GDP. At these prices, the wheat crop would earn $7.26bn, up from $5bn at the beginning of the season.

Geoff Bond, who farms with his brothers Kevin and Rodney at Mannum, 70km east of Adelaide, said they were elated. "We have got some opportunity to sell our wheat at a good price now," he said.

Just three weeks ago, the Bonds sold the last of the old crop for about $250 a tonne. Yesterday AWB was quoting $330 a tonne.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/every-wheat-farmer-is-loving-the-boo...
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gizmo_2655
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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #17 - Aug 29th, 2010 at 1:40pm
 
Life_goes_on wrote on Aug 29th, 2010 at 1:32pm:
Quote:
Every wheat farmer is loving the boom


SOARING wheat prices are sowing optimism over the Australian grainbelt, with the spike hoped to add more than $1 billion to the economy.
In the past week the price has jumped $50 a tonne, injecting an extra $1.1bn into Australia's GDP. At these prices, the wheat crop would earn $7.26bn, up from $5bn at the beginning of the season.

Geoff Bond, who farms with his brothers Kevin and Rodney at Mannum, 70km east of Adelaide, said they were elated. "We have got some opportunity to sell our wheat at a good price now," he said.

Just three weeks ago, the Bonds sold the last of the old crop for about $250 a tonne. Yesterday AWB was quoting $330 a tonne.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/every-wheat-farmer-is-loving-the-boo...


fair enough
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It_is_the_Darkness
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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #18 - Aug 29th, 2010 at 1:42pm
 
Yes FreeDiver, they are making a mistake.
Its a practice that the early Samericans put into use to great effect - they supported millions by this method.
An 'open' Canal releases any heat made by friction of large amounts of moving water into open air, unlike a closed pipe. Anything bigger than the ones in Sydney for Sydney Water  tend to cause buckling.
The so called 'Greens' aren't real Greens - they're just another bunch of Polititians aren't they. Its not like they are really out there ...on the land. Hell, they wish to legalise Heroin.  Roll Eyes
The transferance of water uphill (or through via tunnels) is by ducting systems - not to hard to do at all. Of course it would be hard to transport water up really steep inclines or gradients.

...since this idea came into effect 10 years ago, there hasn't been a better idea since to replace it. Maybe the fact that it is not an Anglo-Saxon idea, might be why it is not supported more so although those that do, seem to be the type of Farmers that are progressive and make a 'profit' efficiently and comfortably beyond the reach of oppressive CSIRO & Govt 'control'.
A lot of 'Political Australia' doesn't like things going on in Australia that might lead this country into a better future and 'Political Australia ...behind. So Political Australia makes sure everything is 'chained down' and with words like "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" - this Country slowly goes nowhere but into the slow death of stagnation. No offence Political Australia - but 'political australia' IS BROKE (starting with NSW).

Hope this helps.
Progressive thinking and practices and results is far better long term than short fixes of 'cash'. What good is cash when most just leave Australia and go overseas to spend it.
Instead of burning and back-burning huge amounts of land around people who cry foul for living in 'fire-prone' regions ...why not build 'Fire-Proof' Houses, etc? The Straw Bale House is possibly the most superior and cheapest form of housing. It takes a good 1/2 hour for fire to burn anywhere near 'through' the wall. But I guess the Building Industry prefers the Australian Public to buy more expensive and inferior materials and makes sure the Council's endorse such inadequate methods.
No - just quick fix cash and she'll be right mate.



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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #19 - Aug 29th, 2010 at 2:17pm
 
They need good rain around Mannum for a half decent crop..away from the river its infertile dirt and limestone and as dry as a dead dingos donga most years  Smiley
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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #20 - Aug 29th, 2010 at 5:26pm
 
Quote:
An 'open' Canal releases any heat made by friction of large amounts of moving water into open air, unlike a closed pipe.


But it is the friction that is the problem, not the heat generated. A pipe is more than capable of dispersing enough heat to compensate for friction. Have you ever heard of a water pipe overheating due to fluid resistance?

Quote:
Anything bigger than the ones in Sydney for Sydney Water  tend to cause buckling.


Buckling of what?

Quote:
The so called 'Greens' aren't real Greens - they're just another bunch of Polititians aren't they.


Of course. Not sure what your point is though. No matter what happens, you only ever get to vote for a politician.

Quote:
The transferance of water uphill (or through via tunnels) is by ducting systems


LOL.

Quote:
not to hard to do at all


Compared to pumping, it is absurdly difficult. Which is why the cost is so high.

Quote:
...since this idea came into effect 10 years ago, there hasn't been a better idea since to replace it


Are you saying people only thought to make canals 10 years ago?

Quote:
Progressive thinking and practices and results is far better long term than short fixes of 'cash'. What good is cash when most just leave Australia and go overseas to spend it.


What exactly are you criticising now?
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It_is_the_Darkness
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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #21 - Aug 30th, 2010 at 12:34am
 
What I'm saying FreeDiver is that the Canal 'concept' is the best that this country has got to go with. Sure, it has its nooks and crannys that people can have a dig at if they like, but nothing better has come around in the way of ideas to help make the Australian landscape far more productive both for the Agricultural and Wild.
It is a relatively 'new' idea in regards to being taken seriously here in Australia and you might think that following US agendas in Afghanistan might be a Political priority, but the State Governments think otherwise and much prefer to be focused upon 'water' issues. In fact, most of the world looks to Australia for two things in guidance: Water & Art.
Being the most advanced nation in regards to all things 'Water' is probably the best challenge this country can take on. Even the Councils and general public don't want to be scammed into paying high water rates for a backwards  Federal Govt, they want to live a waterwise nation with forward thinking State Govts and Councils.

Few points. Moving large volumes of water in large pipes does cause heat related friction.
West Australian Farmers were wondering why it never rained in their wheat belt areas, but it always rained on the other side of the Rabbit Fence. They realised that the rain was attracted to all the trees upon the uncleared side.

I could go on pedantically, but the main thing is that Canals (get those prisoners out of those 'buggery' cells and into the sunshine for some work!) have long term positive effects. No offence, but I'm an Oceanian and I am bias in that I would rather build giant Canal/River systems across this continent than just tar roads. But each to his own. You've built your road, now let me build my Canal - we'll see which one is more appreciated in the long run.
Drain water from a Flooded area and run it to a drought affected area.
Simple eh.  Wink
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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #22 - Aug 30th, 2010 at 10:06pm
 
Quote:
What I'm saying FreeDiver is that the Canal 'concept' is the best that this country has got to go with.


Unless of course you throw pipes into the equation. Then it looks outdated and wasteful.

Quote:
Sure, it has its nooks and crannys that people can have a dig at if they like


Not to mention holes that leak all the water. Having a dig is the only sane way to approach canal building.

Quote:
Moving large volumes of water in large pipes does cause heat related friction.


I thought you were worried about friction related heat? Do you have any clue what you are talking about? How about you compare the actual losses of a pipe and an equivalent canal system.

Quote:
They realised that the rain was attracted to all the trees upon the uncleared side.


Crap.
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It_is_the_Darkness
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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #23 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 3:15am
 
Sorry FreeDiver, not Crap (Fact ...along with the Common Sense that goes with it.) and Pipes just ain't up to scratch with a Canal. Plus I'm a bit more sociable in that people 'rowing' along the canals on a sleep Sunday arvo sounds kinda nice, not to mention the aquatic life that will live in the Canals, unlike in a Pipe.
...you gotta be a bit less closed-minded FreeDiver. I'm sure you would want to come up for air when you like, rather than a junction every 100 metres Grin

So if you wanna have a Farm with Pipes and no Trees, along with outdated crops and unwanted herds, while using Chemical sprays upon your property so yo create a nice layer of sterile and useless soil because you thought throwing worms in was just too Hippie - then go ahead.

Fact: Hungarian Farmers are forced to purchase non-reproductive hybrid seedlings from large Seedling manufacturers. They have to by seedlings each year and not be allowed to have regeneration crops. Talk about being screwed over.
Fact: The Vampire-Mite is set to infiltrate Australia very soon after outbreaks in NZ and PNG. This will inevitable decimate the Australian Bee population and thus decimate the Australian Crop industry due to severe lack of polination. Australia, being the last country to be infested has the fortune to plan ahead at least and come to a better outcome hopefully. Fingers Crossed.
Expect a very large rise in Food Prices soon.

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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #24 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 8:06am
 
freediver wrote on Aug 22nd, 2010 at 11:59am:
Andrei.Hicks wrote on Aug 22nd, 2010 at 11:50am:
freediver wrote on Aug 22nd, 2010 at 11:48am:
Oh well, looks like there will be more handouts for farmers, whoever wins.



Given the farming community along with the miners, drives Australia.

I am not sure I see that as a bad thing.

I am very much a city person, always have been, but the Nationals win so much support out in places there for a reason.


Farming no longer drives this country. If anything they are becoming parasitic. This country has a strong emotional connection to rural australia, but the reality is quite different. Unfoprtunately in politics we tend to be guided by that emotional connection. Farmers and politicians milk it for all it's worth. They feel no shame in demanding that Australians pay more for our food so that they don't have to change the way they do things, so that they can continue running a business the same way their ancestors did 100 years ago.

The nationals do well out there for one reason - self interest.



What a pant load  Angry

Food production holds a high level of strategic importance for any country and ensuring that capability remains is critical.

There is no-one so ignorant and yet so sure, as a city prong-head when talking about issues relating to regional areas and farming. Grin

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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #25 - Sep 1st, 2010 at 9:28pm
 
Quote:
...you gotta be a bit less closed-minded FreeDiver


Be open minded, but not so open minded that your brains fall out.

I gave you plenty of opportunity to prove your point, or at least give an example that demonstrates that canals can actually work better than pipes. All you could come up with is mind numbing slogans and irrelevant rants about big pharma BS. So I am right. It is crap.

Quote:
Food production holds a high level of strategic importance for any country and ensuring that capability remains is critical.


So you're one of the "lets throw tomatoes at the enemy" brigade?

Who said anything about losing the capability? Do you think we will forget how to grow food if we stop giving handouts to farmers?
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It_is_the_Darkness
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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #26 - Sep 2nd, 2010 at 10:43am
 
I did prove my Point FD, I mentioned the Canal System was based upon the 'early' Samericans who used smaller systems over vast expanses of land to 'irrigate' their crops to support a population that was x20 times as much as most other civilisations at the time.

During the night, moisture would rise up from the irrigation canals and water the crops via the process of 'dew'. It was subtle but effective form of watering the garden.

Having been around New Zealand a bit, they too use Irrigation Canal systems. But in NZ'ds case, they have a very natural and excellent waterway system that gives them quality water and irrigation.

Of course there is no 'actual' example upon such a large example of using such a Canal system. Mr Andrews in South Australia, turned his property into a wetland oasis from scub - for the benefit of both his stock and local wildlife, by using Canal systems. Sadly he was 'fined' hundreds of thousands of dollars, because he did something different and, besides successful, beyond the jurisdiction of the Governmental CSIRO. Seems the Australian Government cannot move into the future unless it is a UK-USA future, and only looks at anything domestically in the way of a possible 'fine'.
Its embarressing to see that the Opera House is the only 'uniquely Australian' thing to emerge in this country in its 200+ 'global' history.
The Big Barnacle on its Great Boring Land Mass.

If its about putting things up in this post, well my apologies, I'm not as computer savvy as you, besides being an excellent writer - but I can only state that this ain't vague ranting. The giant Canal system is a positive step into a better Australian future for the land. Take a look at some suburbs that are become self-sufficient in filtering their own water usage via 'aquifying' ponds. There is one north of Adelaide and another currently being built in NSW.

I would have thought, being a FreeDiver, you would jump in at the chance of having a paddle in the giant Canals?

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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #27 - Sep 2nd, 2010 at 11:11am
 
freediver wrote on Sep 1st, 2010 at 9:28pm:
Food production holds a high level of strategic importance for any country and ensuring that capability remains is critical.


So you're one of the "lets throw tomatoes at the enemy" brigade?

Who said anything about losing the capability? Do you think we will forget how to grow food if we stop giving handouts to farmers? [/quote]


If farmers are not financially assisted during times of drought and they go broke the will walk off the land or be pushed; who exactly is going to do the farming when the drought breaks?

It's a tough gig, and once it is gone, it's not easy to get back, so yes if the farmers leave the land, it's not like you can drag someone off the dole and plonk em on a tractor and get them to run a property.

Maybe you city people should get in a car and go and have a look, even better have a talk to a farmer, and make your world a little less ignorant.  Grin



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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #28 - Sep 2nd, 2010 at 11:28am
 
When the global economy was looking a bit frazzled, the UK suffered considerably because it has basically dispensed with 'farming' as a major source of income for the nation. These days, the UK is primarily reliant upon Service Provider businesses.
Pretty sad really  Roll Eyes

If 'Relief Packages' aren't the go during Drought/Flood & even Bushfire times ...which will always happen.
Then stand by progressive thinking, theories, acts and innovation, etc.
Don't just stand around and say "Can't do that or i'll fine ya"
...unless 'fines' are a form of future pay for the underprivaleged Australian?

Australia was once a giant Inland Sea ...its ripe for irrigation upon such a large scale.
Wink
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Re: the politics of regional communities
Reply #29 - Sep 2nd, 2010 at 10:14pm
 
Quote:
I did prove my Point FD, I mentioned the Canal System was based upon the 'early' Samericans who used smaller systems over vast expanses of land to 'irrigate' their crops to support a population that was x20 times as much as most other civilisations at the time.


So because it was a good idea back before people made pipes they are a better option than pipes? Is that supposed to make sense?

Quote:
Sadly he was 'fined' hundreds of thousands of dollars, because he did something different and, besides successful, beyond the jurisdiction of the Governmental CSIRO.


It wasn't because he was stealing water and making other farmers go without? Maybe he should go to court and argue that the other farmers benefitted because the little bit of dew they got made up for the loss of irrigation water?

Quote:
If its about putting things up in this post, well my apologies, I'm not as computer savvy as you, besides being an excellent writer - but I can only state that this ain't vague ranting.


But it is vague ranting. Canals are a stupid idea, especially for Australia, and you are incapable of making a rational argument in favour of them, so you hide in the vague and meaningless.

Quote:
If farmers are not financially assisted during times of drought and they go broke the will walk off the land or be pushed; who exactly is going to do the farming when the drought breaks?


Wrong. The ones who can't manage their business effectively go broke. The ones who can buy them out. The result of this is a bunch of farmers who manage to get by without the government teat.
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