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"Global Cooling in the 70's" Myth (Read 17076 times)
Grendel
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Re: Plimer
Reply #45 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 10:51am
 
Where?

All I've seen so far is reinterpretations and quotes from someone else from somewhere else about something else.

You have to stop lying to yourselves.
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mozzaok
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Re: Plimer
Reply #46 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 10:54am
 
Weasel away, Grendel.
Don't hold your breath muso, Grendel always weasels out when faced with defending his self proclaimed "facts".

He will feign confusion, or resort to bluster and insult, but he will never give an honest answer to your last challenge.
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OOPS!!! My Karma, ran over your Dogma!
 
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Grendel
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Re: Plimer
Reply #47 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 10:55am
 
Only weasels here are you and Bozo...  

Come on lets see you put up some real quotes for a change.
let's see you stop lying about what I've said.
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muso
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Re: Plimer
Reply #48 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 10:59am
 
Grendel - I'll keep it simple -

Was it Scientists or Greenies?
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muso
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Re: Plimer
Reply #49 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 11:03am
 
By the way, what Stephen Schneider said about the paper was that it was taken out of context. He never at any stage said that there was going to be an Ice Age. It was a popular press misrepresentation of that paper that gave rise to the misconception that there could be global cooling.

He was talking about a very specific scenario - in fact using the very same text as yourself:  

An increase by only a factor of 4 in global aerosol background concentration may be sufficient to reduce the surface temperature by as much as 3.5 ° K. If sustained over a period of several years, such a temperature decrease over the whole globe is believed to be sufficient to trigger an ice age.

- and if you don't believe me, watch the clip and you'll hear Stephen Schneider say it all by himself. You can hear it from the horse's mouth - one of the original authors.
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Grendel
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Re: Plimer
Reply #50 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 11:09am
 
I posted the quote from the paper seems pretty clear what he said Bozo.

Is what I posted incorrect?

Now do puhlease QUOTE ME and stop carrying on like your namesake Bozo.

I went back over this topic and all the distortions and misquoting start and end with you.
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muso
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Re: Plimer
Reply #51 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 11:19am
 
Grendel wrote on Jul 13th, 2009 at 11:09am:
I posted the quote from the paper seems pretty clear what he said Bozo.

Is what I posted incorrect?

Now do puhlease QUOTE ME and stop carrying on like your namesake Bozo.

I went back over this topic and all the distortions and misquoting start and end with you.


Was it Scientists or Greenies?
Was it Scientists or Greenies?

Was it Scientists or Greenies?

Was it Scientists or Greenies?

Was it Scientists or Greenies?


ATFQ Grin
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muso
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Re: Plimer
Reply #52 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 11:30am
 
Grendel wrote on Jul 13th, 2009 at 11:09am:
I posted the quote from the paper seems pretty clear what he said Bozo.

Is what I posted incorrect?


The emphasis is misleading. It would be like me saying the following means that you're gonna get drunk (watch carefully for the sleight of hand in applying the bold folks):

An increase by a factor of 4 in Grendel's consumption of Tooheys Heavy today in response to his guilty conscience about deliberately distorting facts, may be sufficient to render him intoxicated. This is believed to be sufficient to cause severe inebriation or even short term paralysis for Grendel.
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Grendel
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Re: Plimer
Reply #53 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 11:36am
 
So what I posted was correct...  you just don't like the sound of it.


So how about posting those QUOTES of mine then eh...  love to clear them up for you too.
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muso
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Re: Plimer
Reply #54 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 11:40am
 
Grendel wrote on Jul 13th, 2009 at 11:36am:
So what I posted was correct...  you just don't like the sound of it.


So how about posting those QUOTES of mine then eh...  love to clear them up for you too.


I was merely pointing out that furious prestidigitation can make you go blind.

Love the weaseling attempts, but people see through them, Grendel. Who are you trying to kid?
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Grendel
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Re: Plimer
Reply #55 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 12:26pm
 
far as I can see the only wanker here is you Bozo.

Running away from those false claims now I see.

Well at least the saner people here who don't fall for arguments based on lies will have noted your misquotes.
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Grendel
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Re: Plimer
Reply #56 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 1:11pm
 
The ice age that never was
15 December 2006 by Fred Pearce

There was a chill across the world, and it wasn't just the cold war. From the 1940s to the mid-70s, the planet seemed to be in the grip of a global cooling. For a while, almost every outbreak of extreme weather was blamed on it. Some members of a new scientific discipline, climatology, predicted a new ice age. Yet before the 70s were out, temperatures were rising and many of the soothsayers for a new ice age were warning of global warming instead. It is a strange, and now largely forgotten episode.
BY MOZZ
  Some say it shows climate scientists are scaremongers and shouldn't be believed, whatever they are predicting. So what happened three decades ago? And why should we believe the climatologists now?

Global cooling was a real phenomenon - and it changed global history. In the winter of 1941, it stopped the German army's advance on Moscow: grease froze in German guns and thousands of soldiers died from cold. Hitler's failure to take Moscow marked a turning point in the second world war. Without the freezing 40s, Hitler might have triumphed. But by the 1970s, no one was giving thanks for global cooling. As snow banks built across the Canadian Arctic and pack ice grew in the North Atlantic, there was concern bordering on panic about where this might be leading.
FORGOTTEN BY MOZZ


Without the freezing 40s, Hitler might have triumphed
In July 1971, Stephen Schneider, a young American climate researcher at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in New York, made headlines in The New York Times when he warned of a coming cooling that could "trigger an ice age". Soon after, George Kulka, a respected climatologist from the Czech Academy of Sciences, warned on TV that "the ice age is due now any time".

The US National Academy of Sciences reported "a finite probability that a serious worldwide cooling could befall the Earth within the next 100 years". As a hint of the horrors in store, weird weather in Africa led to a drought in the Sahel that starved millions.

Many climate scientists, such as Fred Singer, now a well-known contrarian, called for action to halt the cooling. US government advisers proposed putting giant mirrors into orbit to direct more sunlight onto Earth. Others suggested sprinkling Himalayan glaciers with soot to absorb heat and maintain the ice-melt that feeds the region's rivers.

What prompted this panic? Three decades of evident, if mild, cooling had set the scene, but there was also genuine concern among climate scientists based on predictions of both natural and human-made climate change.

For one thing, the atmosphere was becoming dustier and filling with pollution. Fine, light-scattering particles in the air were shading the planet's surface and, some suspected, causing the cooling. Reid Bryson of the University of Wisconsin-Madison argued that dust storms caused by farms spreading into more arid lands were mostly to blame. Meanwhile, Schneider tried to calculate the likely cooling effect of anthropogenic air pollution and compared it with the possible warming effect of carbon dioxide emissions, which it was now clear were accumulating in the atmosphere.

In Schneider's early calculations, published in Science in 1971, the cooling effect was dominant. He said aerosols might have doubled since 1900 and could double again in the coming 50 years. Even allowing for warming from CO2, this could still mean a 3.5 °C drop in global temperatures, which "if sustained over a period of several years... is believed to be sufficient to trigger an ice age".

At the same time, research into the history and timing of past ice ages made it clear that there had been many more than the four originally guessed at, their appearance driven by regular planetary wobbles. Worse, it was now clear that ice ages were the norm rather than the exception. According to Kulka, the most recent interval between ice ages appeared to have lasted only 5000 years. Our present interglacial had already lasted 10,000 years. An ice age was long overdue.

The early 1970s also saw the first analysis of Greenland ice cores and with it the suggestion that climate could change very fast: the last ice age may have taken hold within as little as a century. So the cooling in the mid-20th century might not have been a short-term blip but the start of a rapid slide into the next global freeze. The cooling caused by aerosols could kick-start the process, argued Kulka.

It is often claimed today that the fad for cooling was a brief interlude propagated by a few renegade researchers or even that the story is a myth invented by today's climate sceptics. It wasn't. There was good science behind the fears of global cooling. So why did the prognosis prove so wrong?

Short memories were partly to blame.
MOZZA
A generation of researchers had virtually forgotten the work of Swedish chemist Svante Arrhenius, who predicted at the end of the 19th century that increases in the atmospheric concentration of CO2 would cause significant warming. This meant few took much notice when in the 1960s Charles Keeling began to show that concentrations of the gas had been rising since at least the mid-1950s.


OH DEAR...  KISS MY ASS GUYS...  Grin Grin Grin
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skippy
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Re: Plimer
Reply #57 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 1:32pm
 
That's a great article from 2006, you got any written in the seventies when you and the other confusionalists say it all happened?
Because that article looks a lot like someone trying to rewrite history.
If what you said were true there would be thousands of papers from the seventies that you could quote, I cannot find one of them, but there are plenty written in the 2000s trying to rewrite history.
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Grendel
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Re: Plimer
Reply #58 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 1:43pm
 
yeah just wait till i check the bottom of my compost heap...  nah...  nothing there but you Skip.

Whats it like living in denial?
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Soren
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Re: Plimer
Reply #59 - Jul 13th, 2009 at 2:03pm
 
Quote:
That's a great article from 2006, you got any written in the seventies when you and the other confusionalists say it all happened?
Because that article looks a lot like someone trying to rewrite history.
If what you said were true there would be thousands of papers from the seventies that you could quote, I cannot find one of them, but there are plenty written in the 2000s trying to rewrite history.


Will this do for starters?

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,944914,00.html

Another Ice Age?

In Africa, drought continues for the sixth consecutive year, adding terribly to the toll of famine victims. During 1972 record rains in parts of the U.S., Pakistan and Japan caused some of the worst flooding in centuries. In Canada's wheat belt, a particularly chilly and rainy spring has delayed planting and may well bring a disappointingly small harvest. Rainy Britain, on the other hand, has suffered from uncharacteristic dry spells the past few springs. A series of unusually cold winters has gripped the American Far West, while New England and northern Europe have recently experienced the mildest winters within anyone's recollection.


As they review the bizarre and unpredictable weather pattern of the past several years, a growing number of scientists are beginning to suspect that many seemingly contradictory meteorological fluctuations are actually part of a global climatic upheaval. However widely the weather varies from place to place and time to time, when meteorologists take an average of temperatures around the globe they find that the atmosphere has been growing gradually cooler for the past three decades. The trend shows no indication of reversing. Climatological Cassandras are becoming increasingly apprehensive, for the weather aberrations they are studying may be the harbinger of another ice age.

Telltale signs are everywhere —from the unexpected persistence and thickness of pack ice in the waters around Iceland to the southward migration of a warmth-loving creature like the armadillo from the Midwest.Since the 1940s the mean global temperature has dropped about 2.7° F. Although that figure is at best an estimate, it is supported by other convincing data. When Climatologist George J. Kukla of Columbia University's Lamont-Doherty Geological Observatory and his wife Helena analyzed satellite weather data for the Northern Hemisphere, they found that the area of the ice and snow cover had suddenly increased by 12% in 1971 and the increase has persisted ever since. Areas of Baffin Island in the Canadian Arctic, for example, were once totally free of any snow in summer; now they are covered year round.

Scientists have found other indications of global cooling. For one thing there has been a noticeable expansion of the great belt of dry, high-altitude polar winds —the so-called circumpolar vortex—that sweep from west to east around the top and bottom of the world. Indeed it is the widening of this cap of cold air that is the immediate cause of Africa's drought. By blocking moisture-bearing equatorial winds and preventing them from bringing rainfall to the parched sub-Sahara region, as well as other drought-ridden areas stretching all the way from Central America to the Middle East and India, the polar winds have in effect caused the Sahara and other deserts to reach farther to the south. Paradoxically, the same vortex has created quite different weather quirks in the U.S. and other temperate zones. As the winds swirl around the globe, their southerly portions undulate like the bottom of a skirt. Cold air is pulled down across the Western U.S. and warm air is swept up to the Northeast. The collision of air masses of widely differing temperatures and humidity can create violent storms—the Midwest's recent rash of disastrous tornadoes, for example.



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