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100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West' (Read 10140 times)
Yadda
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100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Nov 26th, 2008 at 10:42am
 
100's of muslim apostates are being murdered in the 'West'.

Why won't the West, stop these murders of muslim apostates, in the West?


A GALLERY OF VICTIMS.....

".....And the thing is, this is the end - the final act, the culmination of the subjugation, oppression, violent abuse of women in Islam."
http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2008/01/islam-killing-o.html



Many Western police forces are paralysed, by their own politically correct efforts to avoid being labelled as culturally insensitive, or 'racist'.

In the UK, the police don't want to get involved in the 'cultural matters' of others.....

Murder girl's five cries for help that were ignored
By FIONA BARTON and STEPHEN WRIGHT
11th June 2007
Five police officers are under investigation after a series of terrible blunders left a young Muslim woman at the mercy of killers in her own family.
....It also emerged that in the two months before her death she had warned police four times that she believed her family wanted to murder her.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-461280/Murder-girls-cries-help-ignored.h...


The Times
February 05, 2005
Muslim apostates cast out and at risk from faith and family
By Anthony Browne
While Christians who turn to Islam are feted, the 200,000 Muslims who turn away are faced with abuse, violence and even murder
For police, religious authorities and politicians, it is an issue so sensitive that they are accused by victims of refusing to respond to appeals for help.
Page 1
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article510589.ece?token=null&offset=0&p...





Many young muslim women are being murdered by family members, because they seek to escape the stifling control ISLAM has over their lives [exercised through their male family members].

And young muslim women in particular are being targeted, because of their vulnerability, and powerlessness.

These young women are being killed, because they are [easy] 'targets of opportunity', within the muslim community.

From the Hadith.....

".....I have been given superiority......; I have been helped by terror (in the hearts of enemies): spoils have been made lawful to me:"
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/muslim/004.smt.html#004.10...


"I have been made victorious with terror (cast in the hearts of the enemy), and while I was sleeping, the keys of the treasures of the world were brought to me and put in my hand."
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/052.sbt.html#004.0...





These are not 'honor' killings.


THIS IS THE KILLING OF APOSTATES, WITHIN THE MUSLIM COMMUNITY - IN THE WEST.

"Ibn 'Abbas reported that the Prophet said: "The bare essence of Islam and the basics of the religion are three [acts], upon which Islam has been established. Whoever leaves one of them becomes an unbeliever and his blood may legally be spilled. [The acts are:] Testifying that there is no God except Allah, the obligatory prayers, and the fast of Ramadan."...."
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/law/fiqhussunnah/fus3_50.html#3.110



WHY IS THIS 'CULTURAL' ABUSE, AND MURDER, BEING TOLERATED BY AUTHORITIES, AND GOVERNMENTS, IN THE WEST?

THESE LOVERS OF SHARIA, SHOULD BE STOPPED, FROM BRINGING THEIR EVIL CULTURE HERE.

TODAY, IT IS THEIR DAUGHTERS WHO ARE BEING ABUSED, AND MURDERED.

IF YOU IGNORE THIS TODAY,
....THEN 'TOMORROW', IT WILL BE YOUR DAUGHTERS WHO ARE BEING ABUSED AND MURDERED.



...
A Muslim rape epidemic [is] sweeping over Europe
-- and over many other nations host to immigrants from the Islamic world. The direct connection between the rapes and Islam is irrefutable, as Muslims are significantly overrepresented among convicted rapists and rape suspects. The Muslim perpetrators themselves boast that their crime is justified since their victims were, among other things, not properly veiled.
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Read.aspx?GUID=473928E3-18E1-4E4E-ADF6-1AD7...


Uncovered Meat and Rape: Condemning an Honest, innocent Cleric
by MA Khan
02 Nov, 2006

http://www.islam-watch.org/MA_Khan/UncoveredMeat.htm




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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #1 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 11:40am
 
Quote:
Muslims are significantly overrepresented among convicted rapists


Can you back that up?
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Yadda
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #2 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 11:43am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 26th, 2008 at 11:40am:
Quote:
Muslims are significantly overrepresented among convicted rapists


Can you back that up?



FD,

That statement was quoted from the article i linked to, in my post....

i.e.
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Read.aspx?GUID=473928E3-18E1-4E4E-ADF6-1AD7...



I have previously read that much of the mainstream media in Europe will NOT cover many of these incidents of muslim rape.

Because the topic is too sensitive to report, particularly because these incidents involve muslims.
....[perhaps some of the media in Europe are so intimidated by threats against Popes, and cartoonists, etc, that they now avoid many 'muslim' incidents / stories completely ???]





see also,

Google,
Muslim rape epidemic sweeping over Europe norway sweden
http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&q=Muslim+rape+epidemic+sweeping+over+Europ...
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« Last Edit: Nov 26th, 2008 at 12:00pm by Yadda »  

"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #3 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 11:55am
 
So you can't back it up?
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #4 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 12:24pm
 
You are doubting this because?

Oh that's right if FD hasn't heard of it it's not reality..

Sorry fd, been a fact for years that rape has increased due the the Influx of muslims in Western societies.  I have heard of it in European countries for decades...  France even had a term for it... gang rape in particular  "take your turn"...  "tournante"  it was widely reported in Norway and Sweden also.  We even had it here.

A little bit of googling on your behalf would end your ignorance.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #5 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 12:28pm
 
I am doubting this because it sounds like BS.

Google will only tell me how popular it is as a topic, not whether it is true. I want to know whether it is true. I want to know whether you can back up the claim with anything more than examples. Examples don't make a trend.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #6 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 12:29pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 26th, 2008 at 11:55am:
So you can't back it up?





Muslim Rape Statistics In Oslo, Raping Europe
March 5, 2007
While researching Danish riots, I wandered off topic for a second time. This time to Norway and an interesting article concerning the rate of rapes committed in Oslo. Muslims are responsible for a disproportionately high number of rapes. Just how many?
Six Times More Likely To Rape
It seems that rapists are six times more likely to be Muslims than native Norwegians in Oslo, Norway. This is according to an article on The Brussels Journal: The Essential European Blog.
http://errantmind.wordpress.com/2007/03/05/muslim-rape-statistics-in-oslo-raping...



Raped in Oslo
From the desk of Fjordman on Wed, 2006-12-13
There has been an explosive increase in the number of rape charges in the city of Oslo, but both the media and the authorities consistently refuse to tell us why. They did do so, however, in 2001, when two out of Norway's three largest newspapers, Aftenposten and Dagbladet, reported that most of these rape charges involve an immigrant perp, which again mostly means Muslims. Both newspapers have since then conveniently “forgotten” about this, and have never connected the issue to Muslim immigration although the number of rape charges has continued to rise to historic levels. They are thus at best guilty of extreme incompetence, since their former articles about this issue are still available online.
Norway’s Minister of Justice from 2001 to 2005, Odd Einar Dørum, mentioned the problem in 2001 but has later gone quiet about the issue.
http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/1754


FD,

There may be other sources available, but clearly some of these articles are not published in English.

And due to the sensitivity of these 'ethnic' incidents perhaps we should take the cue from our European brothers, and just shut up about this???

Self censorship is a wonderful thing isn't it?

And it seems that this, is what some of the European media is doing [self censorship], when 'confronting' incidents involving their muslim co-community members arise.




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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #7 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 12:56pm
 
Two points:

1) It appears to be based on an extremely small sample size, so that one criminal alone could completely alter the outcome.

2) It appears to confuse foreigners and immigrants. Foreigners committing rapes could just as easily refer to drunk Australian tourists.

This is hardly enough evidence to justify such broad generalisations.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #8 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 1:13pm
 

the facts there are quite concrete to me.

totally in synch with the sexist treatment against women elsewhere in the world in muslim countries.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #9 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 1:32pm
 
The facts are based on a poorly translated throwaway comment that was never intended to be a generalisation. It was a specific comment on a very small number of rapes over a very short period of time. Suppose I say I shared a jail cell with 5 aborigines and 4 white men. Would that justify a claim that 50% of people in jail are aborigines? No. It is merely a comment about the people I shared a jail cell with.

It does not back up the original claim about Muslims and rape in any way. In fact, it is a good example of Chinese wispers in action. As the claim got translated and passed on, it got more and more absurd until it no longer resembled the original claim in any way.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #10 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 3:50pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 26th, 2008 at 1:32pm:
The facts are based on a poorly translated throwaway comment that was never intended to be a generalisation......It does not back up the original claim about Muslims and rape in any way......



I have to concede, that i doubt i can find clear set of statistics showing an influx of muslim men, and an increase in rape in Europe.

Perhaps where those type of statistics may have been collated, and released, in the past, they are deemed too controversial to release today?

A withholding of ugly truths, for the sake of inter-community harmony?

Do you doubt that the mainstream media, and governments in Europe are not reporting, and are actively suppressing such information from the public....'for the publics own good'.



+++++++


Men rape women.

Non-muslim men and muslim men.

But the Sudan Govt has claimed that devout muslim men are different.....


Darfur Women Describe Gang-Rape Horror
".....KALMA, Sudan - The seven women pooled money to rent a donkey and cart, then ventured out of the refugee camp to gather firewood, hoping to sell it for cash to feed their families. Instead, they say, in a wooded area just a few hours walk away, they were gang-raped, beaten and robbed.
......In May, after the top U.N. human rights official charged that Sudanese soldiers had raped at least 15 Darfur women during one recent incident, Justice Minister Mohammed Ali al-Mardi asked where the evidence was.
"We always seem to get sweeping generalizations, without naming the injured, without naming the offenders," he told reporters."
"...Sudan's government denies arming and unleashing the janjaweed, and bristles at the charges of rape, saying its conservative Islamic society would never tolerate it..."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/05/27/AR2007052700634_...





Further,
A very good, but disturbing article, exploring the issue of rape as a weapon, in conflicts......

May 14th, 2008 9:29 am
What Is Justice for A Rape Victim?

http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/05/14/what-is-justice-for-a-rape-vic...



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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #11 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 3:54pm
 
Yadda wrote on Nov 26th, 2008 at 3:50pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 26th, 2008 at 1:32pm:
The facts are based on a poorly translated throwaway comment that was never intended to be a generalisation......It does not back up the original claim about Muslims and rape in any way......



I have to concede, that i doubt i can find clear set of statistics showing an influx of muslim men, and an increase in rape in Europe.

Perhaps where those type of statistics may have been collated, and released, in the past, they are deemed too controversial to release today?

A withholding of ugly truths, for the sake of inter-community harmony?

Do you doubt that the mainstream media, and governments in Europe are not reporting, and are actively suppressing such information from the public....'for the publics own good'.


oh please yadda- that is the silliest thing you've said yet.

muslim men are not over represented in rape crimes, or in crime in general.

if you want to say that rape and other atrocities are much more common in war torn countries- then yes, obviously that would be true. and yes rape has always been used as a tactic of war, as a weapon, as a way of breaking down a people, as ethnic cleansing etc etc- this again has nothing to do with muslims, it has to do with the nature of war and the environment it produces.

rape is a product of such harsh and extreme situations. one need only look at the prevalence of rape in refugee camps to realise this.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #12 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 4:08pm
 
Quote:
I have to concede, that i doubt i can find clear set of statistics showing an influx of muslim men, and an increase in rape in Europe.


I would be looking for statistics about the religious convictions of convicted rapists, at the time they committed the offense.

Quote:
Perhaps where those type of statistics may have been collated, and released, in the past, they are deemed too controversial to release today?


You cannot unrelease information.

Quote:
Do you doubt that the mainstream media, and governments in Europe are not reporting, and are actively suppressing such information from the public....'for the publics own good'.


I doubt they are reporting it, but I also doubt they are actively suppressing it.

Quote:
yes rape has always been used as a tactic of war


Not always.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #13 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 4:27pm
 
often, commonly etc
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #14 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 4:41pm
 
I wonder if the Islamic policy of forcing people off their land and taking the women as sex slaves was an effective military tactic, in that it made people hesitant to want to take on the caliphate. Rape and pillage is one thing, but that takes it to a whole new level.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #15 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 5:17pm
 
"Muslim rape concern 
 
Alarmed at last week's police statistics, which revealed that in 68% of all rapes committed this year the perpetrator was from an ethnic minority ......"

http://www.cphpost.dk/get/62605.html


"Even though Sweden, unlike Denmark, has almost no public debate about immigration, frustration is very much present underneath the surface. 75 % of Swedes think that many people in their country “dislike” Muslims, more than in any other European nation surveyed. Even in Holland, which recently witnessed violent clashes with Muslims after the murder of Islam-critic Theo van Gogh, the rate is lower than in Sweden. But you’re not supposed to talk about such issues in Sweden. That would be “racist”:

Swedish laws prohibiting "hate speech" against racial minorities have been vigorously enforced. There have, for example, been a number of gang-rapes of Swedish women by Muslim immigrants. But Swedes must be careful what they say about them. On May 25, neo-Nazi Bjorn Bjorkqvist was convicted and sentenced to two months in prison for writing, "I don’t think I am alone in feeling sick when reading about how Swedish girls are raped by immigrant hordes." ["Jag tror inte jag är ensam om att må dåligt när jag läser om hur svenska tjejer har våldtagits av invandrarhorder"]

http://fjordman.blogspot.com/2005/02/muslim-rape-epidemic-in-sweden-and.html


"Apparently, the Norwegian newspaper Dagbladet reported that 65 percent of rapes of Norwegian women were performed by "non-Western" immigrants – a category that, in Norway, consists mostly of Muslims. The article quoted a professor of social anthropology at the University of Oslo (note: her name is Unni Wikan) as saying that "Norwegian women must take their share of responsibility for these rapes" because Muslim men found their manner of dress provocative. The professor's conclusion was not that Muslim men living in the West needed to adjust to Western norms, but the exact opposite: "Norwegian women must realize that we live in a multicultural society and adapt themselves to it."

http://fjordman.blogspot.com/2005/02/muslim-rape-epidemic-in-sweden-and.html


"Norway's most important paper Aftenposten ran a story earlier this week saying that 65% of the rape crimes in Oslo were committed by foreigners, even though they only represent a mere 23% of the population in the Norwegian capital. The article was prompted by a call by the Rape Commission (Voldtektsutvalget) to the imams to put rapes and the attitude against women on the agenda.

Foreigners are six times more likely to figure in crime statistics concerning rapes in Oslo. During the first two months of this year sixteen rapes and rape attempts have been committed, and the three men the police are looking for in connection with four of those cases have one thing in common: they all have a Muslim background"


http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/1937
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #16 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 5:33pm
 
That first one looks interesting, as it appears that muslim organisations are conceding there is a problem.

The second one does not appear to provide any evidence. The last two are the same one as in the opening post of this thread.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #17 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 5:50pm
 
Gaybriel wrote on Nov 26th, 2008 at 3:54pm:
oh please yadda- that is the silliest thing you've said yet.

muslim men are not over represented in rape crimes, or in crime in general.




Gaybriel,

Of course not.

But Gaybriel, you are missing the logical point.

Within ISLAM, for a devout muslim all things are permissible, if they are permitted by Sharia.

And all muslims are 'innocent', and 'pure', when they conduct themselves within the strictures of Sharia.

Even while many things are unlawful in our culture, they are lawful for a muslim.

And i would be hard pressed to bring any 'conviction' against a muslim, on the basis of what Sharia allows.




Gaybriel,

Q.
What is wrong with NON-muslims?

A.
Everything they say.
....And everything they do.

Non-muslims, are 'guilty' ppl.


Whereas, muslims are 'innocent', and 'pure'.

"A man can have sexual pleasure from a child as young as a baby.  However, he should not penetrate vaginally, but sodomising the child is acceptable.  If a man does penetrate and damage the child then, he should be responsible for her subsistence all her life.  This girl will not count as one of his four permanent wives and the man will not be eligible to marry the girl's sister...  It is better for a girl to marry at such a time when she would begin menstruation at her husband's house, rather than her father's home.  Any father marrying his daughter so young will have a permanent place in heaven.  ["Tahrirolvasyleh", fourth edition, Qom, Iran, 1990]"
Ayatollah Khomeini

".....In June, 2002  Iranian authorities approved a law raising the age at which girls can marry without parental consent from 9 to 13.  The elected legislature actually passed the bill in 2000, but the "Guardian Council", a 12-man body of conservative clerics, vetoed it as contradicting Islamic Sharia law."
http://ethnikoi.org/iran.html

Innocent.





The story below....
....another study in Jihad tactics used against the Kuffar....

Accused of wrong doing?

Deflect!!!


Muslim sex offenders could opt out of treatment programme 'because it's against their faith'
By JAMES SLACK
08 April 2008
It is against the rules of Islam for Muslims to discuss their crimes (file photo)
Muslim sex offenders are asking to be let off a prison treatment programme on religious grounds.
Rapists, paedophiles and other dangerous attackers are expected to discuss their crimes with other inmates as a condition of release.
But Muslim prisoners complain that criminals should not have to talk about their offences - a "legitimate Islamic position", according to Ahtsham Ali, the Prison Service's Muslim adviser.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-558091/Muslim-sex-offenders-opt-treatmen...

Of course, these ppl in the prison story above, were more muslim 'impersonators'.
.....coz real, pure, muslims don't commit sex crimes.





...
Happy snaps.
Another muslim 'impersonator', with his happy wife.






Q.
What is wrong with ISLAM / muslims?

A.
Not a lot.
Ask Gaybriel.



As every Sharia practitioner knows, it is a woman's fault, if she is raped by muslim a 'impersonator'...

The Afghan women jailed for being victims of rape
In Lashkar Gah, the majority of female prisoners are serving 20-year sentences for being forced to have sex. Terri Judd visited them and heard their extraordinary stories
Monday, 18 August 2008

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/the-afghan-women-jailed-for-being-v...


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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #18 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 6:58pm
 
http://www.familysecuritymatters.org/publications/id.116/pub_detail.asp
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #19 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 7:06pm
 
thanks tallowood.
This is from the link she posted.


"Denmark, long the liberal, open society that welcomed immigrants, has done an about face. After being the symbolic envy of Universalists, of Socialists, of cultural liberalism, Denmark today has the strictest immigration policy in Europe.

The Muslim population in Denmark, constituting a mere 4% of the total, refuses to integrate, consumes 40% of the welfare, and constitutes a majority of the country's convicted rapists. The Danes now acknowledge that their core values of personal liberty, free speech, equality for women and tolerance of other ethnic groups are incompatible with Islam as they know it.

Muslim leaders openly advocate introducing Islamic law in Denmark. Danes at the forefront of advocating free speech and Western values are subject to fatwas and increasingly violent attacks from the Muslim population.

This haven of tolerance and openness has opted for survival and rationality. For citizenship, the country now requires of new immigrants:

- 3 years of language classes
- tests on Denmark's history, culture and language
- 7 years of residency prior to application
- proven job opportunities and commitment to work

New mosques will not be allowed to be built in Copenhagen. Assimilation will be actively promoted. The country that once courageously and righteously saved their 7,000 Jews from the Nazi death camps now is accused of racism.

America is no stranger to accusations of profiling, political incorrectness and racism. Yet Muslims worldwide still beat down our doors to gain immigration status to the U.S. - they tellingly do not do likewise to the majority of UN nations habitually accusing the U.S. of racism. When did Cuba or Russia, Syria or even Saudi Arabia, those bastions of tolerance and freedom, last receive a deluge of immigrant applications?

So we in the U.S. spend our time being sued by aggressive Imams testing nervous airlines. Open season has been declared on the West by demanding Islamist organizations hoping to force the government and our municipalities to kowtow into passive submission. We now clearly need footbaths in every university restroom. We also need two taxi lines at every airport - one for those with short skirts, dogs or alcoholic beverages and one for Shari'a-compliant Americans.

Yet little spunky Denmark is showing us and everyone the way. They opened their borders and their coffers to welcome Muslims, in a show of remarkable generosity and goodwill. Now, bruised and battered by an unappreciative, increasingly fundamentalist, and sadly uncompromising Muslim community, they are closing their doors and battening down the hatches....."

http://www.familysecuritymatters.org/publications/id.116/pub_detail.asp

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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #20 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 7:23pm
 
tallowood wrote on Nov 26th, 2008 at 6:58pm:



tallowood,

Thank you for your contribution....


".....The Muslim population in Denmark, constituting a mere 4% of the total, refuses to integrate, consumes 40% of the welfare, and constitutes a majority of the country's convicted rapists. The Danes now acknowledge that their core values of personal liberty, free speech, equality for women and tolerance of other ethnic groups are incompatible with Islam as they know it."



But of course those 'muslim' rapists were....
.....muslim 'impersonators'.

Not real muslims.

Grin



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Luke 16:31
 
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #21 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 8:28pm
 
That article doesn't seem to give any sources. Most newspapers will name the authority they get their stats from (eg the ABS), if they are genuine.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #22 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 8:32pm
 
Sprintcyclist wrote on Nov 26th, 2008 at 7:06pm:
Yet little spunky Denmark is showing us and everyone the way. They opened their borders and their coffers to welcome Muslims, in a show of remarkable generosity and goodwill. Now, bruised and battered by an unappreciative, increasingly fundamentalist, and sadly uncompromising Muslim community, they are closing their doors and battening down the hatches....."

http://www.familysecuritymatters.org/publications/id.116/pub_detail.asp




And so Holger awakens.

The danes indeed are showing the way.

But it will be england again that will show that the wind has changed. Australia did it first, then Denmark (dontcha love 'em!). But the tide will turn when England follows suit. And then they will all do it, as always.



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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #23 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 8:49pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 26th, 2008 at 8:28pm:
That article doesn't seem to give any sources. Most newspapers will name the authority they get their stats from (eg the ABS), if they are genuine.


The source is  StatBank Denmark Social conditions, health and justice

You will have to do your own modelling and analysis though, they provide data.


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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #24 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 10:07pm
 
I find it odd that you 2 (g&FD) were unaware of the problems in Europe since the increase in Muslim migration over the last 3 decades there.

It was widely reported and even made the media here.

As for criminality...  why do we have dedicated Asian and ME crime squads...  hint; because there is a bloody problem.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #25 - Nov 26th, 2008 at 10:39pm
 
Tallow, there was nothing in those options about Muslims. What makes you think the stats came from that site?

Grendel, having 'problems' with a minority group and them being over-represented among rapists are not exactly the same thing.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #26 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 5:33am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 26th, 2008 at 10:39pm:
Tallow, there was nothing in those options about Muslims. What makes you think the stats came from that site?

Grendel, having 'problems' with a minority group and them being over-represented among rapists are not exactly the same thing.


The article was originally published in the New York Post as "Something Rotten in Denmark" on August 27, 2002. The Minister of Justice in Denmark reported that 76.5% of the rapes in Copenhagen were committed by non-native Danes, and over 3/4 of non-native Danes are Muslim.
Official police records do not record religion but you may look up and analyse data about how many rapes were committed by immigrants then do the same for native Danes, then compare. You also may look up number of immigrants and number of immigrants from Muslim countries.

http://www.statbank.dk is where Danish statistics come from, similar to ABS.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #27 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 8:27am
 
Yes... sometime I wonder what planet fd is from.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #28 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 8:49am
 

Sometimes so do I.
But good to have someone here to be the devils advocate.
To question claims, ask for proof etc etc etc.

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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #29 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 10:59am
 
It sounds more like a problem with immigration rather than Islam. Remember, correlation does not equal causation. I've been to Denmark. The women there don't mind getting their gear off. If they had a huge influx of immigrants from any ultraconservative society it would cause problems. While it does appear to be a genuine problem, it also seems to be isolated. You should also check out the actual rate of sex crimes in the country. It could for example just be that it is extremely low among Danes, and that English immigrants would appear just as bad by comparuison. None of the people engaged in the fearmongering seem interested in getting the full story out, which is always very suspicious, especially when it comes down to reporting statistics.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #30 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 12:27pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 27th, 2008 at 10:59am:
It sounds more like a problem with immigration rather than Islam. Remember, correlation does not equal causation. I've been to Denmark. The women there don't mind getting their gear off. If they had a huge influx of immigrants from any ultraconservative society it would cause problems. While it does appear to be a genuine problem, it also seems to be isolated. You should also check out the actual rate of sex crimes in the country. It could for example just be that it is extremely low among Danes, and that English immigrants would appear just as bad by comparuison. None of the people engaged in the fearmongering seem interested in getting the full story out, which is always very suspicious, especially when it comes down to reporting statistics.





"Statistics, damned statistics, and lies...."




It doesn't really matter.

This struggle against ISLAM,
....we cannot win it.

Hmmmm....

Men, in a fight against SATAN, and his wiles.

I know who my money is on [winning]!



Look at the Western governments.

They feed on PR and polls, not TRUTH.

Look at how the Western governments of Europe are 'tackling' the problems posed by muslim communities.

Muslim communities complain, and the European governments capitulate.

Our leaders are deceived, by muslim apologists, because the muslim apologists understand that liars want to believe the sweet lies that muslim apologists will tell them.

It is all too easy.



...




...
'.....Just like in muslim countries.'


June 24, 2006
To allow Islamists to direct the post-7/7 debate was a disaster
Michael Gove
THE BRITISH State has come under severe criticism following the Forest Gate raid for its intelligence failures in the fight against terrorism. But the biggest failure of all in the battle against Islamist extremism has gone practically unnoticed.
...Proof of the British State’s institutional weakness came directly in the aftermath of the 7/7 bombings. At the Prime Minister’s behest the Home Office established a series of working groups to tackle the threat of Islamic extremism. A variety of individuals were appointed whose past statements or current affiliations made them very curious conscripts in the struggle against extremism.
Among those appointed was Ahmad Thomson, a convert to Islam who has argued in the past that....Muslims are obliged to want to live in an Islamic state.
...Given the presence of these and others with a similar perspective on the Home Office’s working groups, the conclusions were not that surprising. In so far as extremism was acknowledged as a danger it was attributed to the foreign policy of Blair and Bush. And in so far as remedial action was required, it seemed, again and again, to consist of more public money going to exclusively Islamic bodies that would be empowered to provide more Islamic solutions, in accordance with appropriate Islamic principles.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,8802-2240635,00.html



The day is coming when British Muslims form a state within a state
February 19, 2006
....Dr Sookhdeo's family emigrated to England when he was 10. In his early twenties, when he was at university, he converted to Christianity.
....."The Government, and Tony Blair, the Prime Minister, are fundamentally deluded about the nature of Islam," he insists. "Tony Blair unintentionally revealed his ignorance when he said, in an effort to conciliate Muslims, that he had 'read through the Koran twice' and that he kept it by his bedside.
.....The Prime Minister's ignorance of Islam, Dr Sookhdeo contends, is of a piece with his unsuccessful attempts to conciliate it. And it does indeed seem as if the Government's policy towards radical Islam is based on the hope that if it makes concessions to its leaders, they will reciprocate and relations between fundamentalist Muslims and Tony Blair's Government will then turn into something resembling an ecumenical prayer meeting.
....."The whole approach towards Muslim militants was based on appeasement. 7/7 proved that that approach does not work - yet it is still being followed.
http://www.virtueonline.org/portal/modules/news/article.php?storyid=3645


++++++++


Jeremiah 17:5
Thus saith the LORD; Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the LORD.

Revelation 12:9
And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

Revelation 12:12
Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.




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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #31 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 1:43pm
 
Quote:
The Muslim population in Denmark, constituting a mere 4% of the total, refuses to integrate, consumes 40% of the welfare


Where did they get that from?
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #32 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 2:22pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 27th, 2008 at 10:59am:
It sounds more like a problem with immigration rather than Islam. Remember, correlation does not equal causation.
...
None of the people engaged in the fearmongering seem interested in getting the full story out, which is always very suspicious, especially when it comes down to reporting statistics.


I agree that result of statistical analyses of the data provided are somewhat ambiguous. It is possible though with very low probability that out of 100% of total immigrants 25% who came from non Muslim countries are engaged in raping while Muslim immigrants have low libido.

Nevertheless to attribute the faults in data collection to "fearmongers" is wrong. The real cause of ambiguity is due to police reports not having religion attribute, which is in turn due to misguided and overblown policy of politcorrectness. I think that people who want unambiguous truth about correlation of events with religion and/or ethnicity should demand proper data collection procedures instead of political filtering.


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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #33 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 2:31pm
 
It would be a simple enough matter to survey inmates with rape convictions on their religious beliefs. I'm not sure if it is necessary or justified for it to be colelcted officially, at least not with any kind of compulsion. The police certainly shouldn't be collecting the information.

Even if the majority of rape convicts are Muslim, that doesn't mean that Islam is the problem. It could still be all about immigration. For example, if the rate was consistent between Muslim and non-Muslim immigratns, while local born Muslims and non-Muslims shared a low rate of conviction, then that would mean that it has nothing to do with Islam, even if most convicts are still Muslims.

Correlation does not equal causation.

Also, the claim that Muslims make up 4% of the population, yet collect 40% of welfare seems very dubious and makes me think the whole thing is made up.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #34 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 3:02pm
 
Since relevant data collection is politically suppressed  equating  the correlation with causation is natural trend. To refute it would be simple matter of authorisation by concerned ethnic leaders to collect relevant data and also have a "WHY?" questioner form to be filled by offenders.
Do you think that Muslim leaders would agree to that if they have nothing to hide?
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #35 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 3:04pm
 
Quote:
To refute it would be simple matter of authorisation by concerned ethnic leaders


No it wouldn't.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #36 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 3:21pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 27th, 2008 at 3:04pm:
Quote:
To refute it would be simple matter of authorisation by concerned ethnic leaders


No it wouldn't.


Yes it would assuming that preached morality of "raw meat" has nothing to do with rape.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #37 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 3:38pm
 
Since when do 'ethic leaders' get to authorise anything on behalf of ethnic groups?
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #38 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 3:48pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 27th, 2008 at 3:38pm:
Since when do 'ethic leaders' get to authorise anything on behalf of ethnic groups?


Since ethnic leaders took upon themselves to be ethic leaders.

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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #39 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 4:02pm
 
Wrong. They have no mandate authorise anything on behalf of a person merely because of ethnicity. They have no authority.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #40 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 4:06pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 27th, 2008 at 4:02pm:
Wrong. They have no mandate authorise anything on behalf of a person merely because of ethnicity. They have no authority.


Right. Why then did some democratic governments listen to these  charlatans?
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #41 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 4:08pm
 
Because they are citizens. Having a voice is not the same as having a mandate to authorise something on behalf of other people based on their ethnicity. And besides, this is about religion, not ethnicity, remember?
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #42 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 4:18pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 27th, 2008 at 4:08pm:
Because they are citizens. Having a voice is not the same as having a mandate to authorise something on behalf of other people based on their ethnicity. And besides, this is about religion, not ethnicity, remember?


That's why I called them charlatans. Don't you think that religion and politics should be kept separate? But is it the case with Islam?
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #43 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 4:33pm
 
There should not be an institutionalised link between religion and politics. Obviously it is not possibly to separate them beyond that.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #44 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 8:34pm
 
So till politicians stop fear the truth the closest to reality confirmed by available data we have is the statement:
"The Minister of Justice in Denmark reported that 76.5% of the rapes in Copenhagen were committed by non-native Danes, and over 3/4 of non-native Danes are Muslim."

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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #45 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 9:42pm
 
Quote:
So till politicians stop fear the truth the closest to reality confirmed by available data we have is the statement:


No. You just have to employ different methods to those you suggested. That doesn't mean giving up and relying instead on absurd conjecture. That statement is just a starting point. It's about as far from the reality as you can get.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #46 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 9:55pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 27th, 2008 at 9:42pm:
Quote:
So till politicians stop fear the truth the closest to reality confirmed by available data we have is the statement:


No. You just have to employ different methods to those you suggested. That doesn't mean giving up and relying instead on absurd conjecture. That statement is just a starting point. It's about as far from the reality as you can get.


No. It is you who have to employ different methods if you don't like  those I have suggested. Till then the truth closest to reality confirmed by available data we have is the statement:
"The Minister of Justice in Denmark reported that 76.5% of the rapes in Copenhagen were committed by non-native Danes, and over 3/4 of non-native Danes are Muslim."
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #47 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 10:03pm
 
So in other words we don't have a clue what is really going on, but you will assume Muslims are rapists until someone proves otherwise? Sort of like guilty until proven innocent?
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #48 - Nov 27th, 2008 at 10:07pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 27th, 2008 at 10:03pm:
So in other words we don't have a clue what is really going on, but you will assume Muslims are rapists until someone proves otherwise? Sort of like guilty until proven innocent?


You mean you don't have a clue what is really going on I use available data to make a high probability conclusion, which is:

Quote:
the truth closest to reality confirmed by available data we have is the statement:
"The Minister of Justice in Denmark reported that 76.5% of the rapes in Copenhagen were committed by non-native Danes, and over 3/4 of non-native Danes are Muslim."




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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #49 - Nov 28th, 2008 at 10:03am
 
That's not a conclusion. That's an admission that we can't get close to the reality - at least not based on the little info you have found. A 'high probability' implies that you actually have a position, not that you can't.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #50 - Nov 28th, 2008 at 10:41am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 27th, 2008 at 4:02pm:
Wrong. They have no mandate authorise anything on behalf of a person merely because of ethnicity. They have no authority.



FD,

Religious leaders within muslim communities, claim that they are 'properly guided', by Allah, to lead muslims.

So these leaders DO have, said mandate.



The Koran commands muslims to obey the clerics only.

Don't be disobedient to ISLAM, and the clerics....


"O ye who believe! Obey Allah and His Messenger, and turn not away from him when ye hear (him speak).
Nor be like those who say, "We hear," but listen not:
For the worst of beasts in the sight of Allah are the deaf and the dumb,- those who understand not."

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/008.qmt.html#008.020


ALWAYS BELIEVE THE CLERICS, ALWAYS BE OBEDIENT TO 'ALLAH' [i.e. the clerics].

"O ye who believe! Obey Allah, and obey the messenger," [i.e. obey the clerics]
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/004.qmt.html#047.033


BELIEVE NO ONE,
.....UNLESS HE IS A MUSLIM.

"And believe no one unless he follows your religion.......True guidance is the Guidance of Allah:....He knoweth all things."
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/003.qmt.html#003.73



Even secular press mirror this opinion...

'Turn the world to Islam'
March 11, 2007
The faithful are told to obey only Sharia law.
....One book, Man-Made Laws Vs. Shari'ah, urges Muslims not to "accept anything from their governments and rulers except sharia", stating any other system is heresy.
http://www.news.com.au/sundayheraldsun/story/0,21985,21359122-2862,00.html




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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #51 - Nov 28th, 2008 at 10:45am
 
Quote:
So these leaders DO have, said mandate.


No they don't, not even by their own standards.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #52 - Nov 28th, 2008 at 10:54am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 28th, 2008 at 10:03am:
That's not a conclusion. That's an admission that we can't get close to the reality - at least not based on the little info you have found. A 'high probability' implies that you actually have a position, not that you can't.


I repeat that it isn't me but you who can't get close to the reality.

As for myself I use available data to make a high probability conclusion, which is:


the truth closest to reality confirmed by available data we have is the statement:
"The Minister of Justice in Denmark reported that 76.5% of the rapes in Copenhagen were committed by non-native Danes, and over 3/4 of non-native Danes are Muslim."


That is GOOD ENOUGH because: "Remember, the politics is all about risk management, not proof.

It is irrational to demand proof in the face of risk. " (c) - freediver



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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #53 - Nov 28th, 2008 at 10:56am
 
I'm not asking for proof, I'm asking for a reasonable standard of evidence.

If this really is about risk management, what is the 'management solution' you have in mind? Do nothing? Find out more about the issue? Act in ignorance? Acting on a very small amount of dodgy, misinterpretted stats is hardly sound risk management.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #54 - Nov 28th, 2008 at 11:03am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 28th, 2008 at 10:56am:
I'm not asking for proof, I'm asking for a reasonable standard of evidence.

If this really is about risk management, what is the 'management solution' you have in mind? Do nothing? Find out more about the issue? Act in ignorance? Acting on a very small amount of dodgy, misinterpretted stats is hardly sound risk management.


I have provided the reasonable standard of evidence more so then you did in environment topic. So if it isn't good enough for you here then your posts about environment risks are useless.

Which one it is?




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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #55 - Nov 28th, 2008 at 11:06am
 
Quote:
Which one it is?


You are wrong.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #56 - Nov 28th, 2008 at 11:08am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 28th, 2008 at 11:06am:
Quote:
Which one it is?


You are wrong.


I am right, you are wrong.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #57 - Nov 28th, 2008 at 11:08am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 28th, 2008 at 10:45am:
Quote:
So these leaders DO have, said mandate.


No they don't, not even by their own standards
.



FD,

On what basis do you suggest this?




My take is.....

To avoid any 'collective' responsibility [for the unlawful actions of members of their community], muslim community leaders will claim,
......"We have no hierarchy within ISLAM. There is no overriding controlling body, or authority for muslims."

That is what they tell the dumb [ignorant] Kuffar - when it suits their purposes.



But within their own community, when speaking to their own, they use threats of Allah's hell, and threats of real corporeal violence against any muslim who acts in an un-ISLAMIC way.

And the clerics back those threats up, with those verses from the Koran, which clearly enforce and confirm their authority to make corporeal decisions which direct the lives of all devout muslims.




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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #58 - Dec 5th, 2008 at 7:10pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 26th, 2008 at 11:55am:
So you can't back it up?


http://fjordman.blogspot.com/2005/08/rape-nothing-to-do-with-islam.html

Rape: Nothing to do with Islam?

I got some comments, among others from Norwegian blogger Bjørn Stærk, to my posts about the Norwegian government covering up the number of rapes committed by immigrants. The Swedish government is probably even worse, but Sweden is in many ways collapsing. Although he agreed that the statistics should be published, he questioned whether these rapes have anything to do with Islam. It is true that mass rapes of "the enemy's women", in part to humiliate the enemy's men, is not unique to Islam. It has been done at times of war by the Vikings, the Mongols, the Germans and the Russians during WW2, and all the way up to the Balkans in the 1990s. That's also my point. The number of rapes committed by Muslim immigrants in Western nations are so extremely high that it is difficult to view them only as random acts of individuals. It resembles warfare. This happens in most Western European countries, as well as in other infidels countries such as India. In Bradford, England, Channel 4 pulled a documentary about Pakistani and other Muslim men sexually abusing white English girls, some as young as 11. Writer Theodore Dalrymple thinks that "thanks to their cultural inheritance, (Muslim) abuse of women is systematic rather than unsystematic as it is with the whites and blacks." In France, grotesque reports about systematic gang rapes of French or "too Western" Muslim girls keep coming in. At the same time, European jails are getting filled up with Muslims imprisoned for robberies and all kinds of violent crimes, and Muslims bomb European civilians. You can see the mainstream media are struggling to make sense of all of this. That's because they can't, or don't want to, see the obvious: This is exactly how an invading army would behave. Rape, pillage and bomb.

I disagree that this has nothing to do with Islam. Muhammad himself had forced sex (rape) with several of his slave girls/concubines. This is perfectly allowed, both in the sunna and in the Koran. If you postulate that many of the Muslims in Europe view themselves as a conquering army and that European women are simply war booty, it all makes perfect sense and is in full accordance with Islamic law. And Muslims do follow their medieval religious laws, even today:

Robert Spencer on rape and jihad

What does rape, then, have to do with these religious conflicts? Unfortunately, everything. The Islamic legal manual ‘Umdat al-Salik, which carries the endorsement of Al-Azhar University, the most respected authority in Sunni Islam, stipulates: “When a child or a woman is taken captive, they become slaves by the fact of capture, and the woman’s previous marriage is immediately annulled.” Why? So that they are free to become the concubines of their captors. The Qur’an permits Muslim men to have intercourse with their wives and their slave girls: “Forbidden to you are ... married women, except those whom you own as slaves” (Sura 4:23-24).

After one successful battle, Muhammad tells his men, “Go and take any slave girl.” He took one for himself also. After the notorious massacre of the Jewish Qurayzah tribe, he did it again. According to his earliest biographer, Ibn Ishaq, Muhammad “went out to the market of Medina (which is still its market today) and dug trenches in it. Then he sent for [the men of Banu Qurayza] and struck off their heads in those trenches as they were brought out to him in batches.” After killing “600 or 700 in all, though some put the figure as high as 800 or 900,” the Prophet of Islam took one of the widows he had just made, Rayhana bint Amr, as another concubine.

Emerging victorious in another battle, according to a generally accepted Islamic tradition, Muhammad’s men present him with an ethical question: “We took women captives, and we wanted to do ‘azl [coitus interruptus] with them.” Muhammad told them: “It is better that you should not do it, for Allah has written whom He is going to create till the Day of Resurrection.’” When Muhammad says “it is better that you should not do it,” he’s referring to coitus interruptus, not to raping their captives. He takes that for granted.

Here's what Vice Director of Jihad Watch, Hugh Fitzgerald, whom I rate in league with Ali Sina and Ibn Warraq as among the best commentators of Islam in this age, has to say about the issue (scroll down):

'For her to be absolved from guilt, a raped woman must have shown good conduct'

For non-Muslim women, they are in every respect -- the way they walk, the way they talk, those bedroom eyes we all know so well -- simply asking for it, and Muslim men have every right to do what they wish.

It is not understood that Western women are not so much regarded by most Muslims as individuals, but as "their women," the women who "belong" to hostile Infidels. They are booty, to be taken, just as the land of the Infidels someday will drop, it is believed, into Muslim hands -- by demographic conquest rather than military conquest. It has worked in many parts of Africa; and if Muslims fail to reproduce even faster than they do, there is always the expedient of killing the remaining Infidels.

Article continues at link.
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Quote:
ISLAM is a vicious [un-reformable] political tyranny, which has always murdered its critics, and it continues that practice even today.
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #59 - Dec 6th, 2008 at 2:42pm
 
Calanen wrote on Dec 5th, 2008 at 7:10pm:
......In France, grotesque reports about systematic gang rapes of French or "too Western" Muslim girls keep coming in. At the same time, European jails are getting filled up with Muslims imprisoned for robberies and all kinds of violent crimes, and Muslims bomb European civilians. You can see the mainstream media are struggling to make sense of all of this. That's because they can't, or don't want to, see the obvious: This is exactly how an invading army would behave. Rape, pillage and bomb.




Calanen,

Good post!



And, we are in denial.

As bizarre as it sounds, our culture is willingly, 'accommodating' those who wish to destroy our culture, and wish to kill us,
....because we are not them.

Our leaders insanely look to PR consultants in forming government policy [instead of TRUTH].
....well, this approach has worked for decades!

Our community leaders view ISLAM as a 'religion', and therefore view it, and muslims as benign,
....or at worst misunderstood.

And after decades of muslim migration into the West, the TRUTH about nature of ISLAM / devout muslims is in our face, but we still refuse to acknowledge it.

Its all very surreal.




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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Re: 100's of muslim apostates, murdered in the 'West'
Reply #60 - Mar 16th, 2009 at 11:33am
 


abu said,

"......few honour killing threads have arisen here, because it's been conclusively proven it's got nothing to do with Islam."


"Christian beheads son at Jesus' request"
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1237096596/23#23


Rubbish.

These young muslim women [honour killing victims] are being brutalised and murdered because the are resisting the patriarchal control over their lives, which ISLAM sanctifies and demands.

These young muslim women are being murdered, because their families can justify the murder, on the basis that these young women have become apostates.

Which is demonstrated, by their rejection of the authority of ISLAM over their lives.





+++++++++





From ISLAMIC law texts....


"Ibn 'Abbas reported that the Prophet said: "The bare essence of Islam and the basics of the religion are three [acts], upon which Islam has been established. Whoever leaves one of them BECOMES AN UNBELIEVER and HIS BLOOD MAY LEGALLY BE SPILLED. [The acts are:] Testifying that there is no God except Allah, the obligatory prayers, and the fast of Ramadan."...."
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/law/fiqhussunnah/fus3_50.html#3.110

Paraphrasing the meaning...
"Whoever.....becomes an unbeliever.....his blood may legally be spilled."






'SANE' MUSLIMS ALL AGREE - KILL THE APOSTATE....


APOSTASY IN ISLAM
"Apostasy in Islam is commonly defined as the rejection of Islam in word or deed by a person who has been a Muslim.
The FOUR MAJOR SUNNI AND THE ONE MAJOR SHIA MADH'HAB (SCHOOLS OF ISLAMIC JURISPRUDENCE) AGREE that a sane adult male apostate must be executed......"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostasy_in_Islam







THE SHAME OF MUSLIM DAUGHTERS MARRYING 'KUFFAR', IS NOT TO BE TOLERATED WITHIN ISLAM.


ISLAM's highest authority, Allah, in the Koran, instructs muslims not to allow their muslim daughters to engage with Kuffar society, in 'multicultural' tolerance [marriage to unbelievers].....

Koran...

".....Nor marry (your girls) to unbelievers until they believe: A man slave who believes is better than an unbeliever, even though he allures you. Unbelievers do (but) beckon you to the Fire. But Allah beckons by His Grace to the Garden (of bliss) and forgiveness, and makes His Signs clear to mankind: That they may celebrate His praise."

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/002.qmt.html#002.221




ISLAM is responsible for honour killings, ISLAM 'sanctifies' the murder's.



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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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