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Vic

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Re: Immigration
Reply #15 - Sep 4^th, 2022 at 6:24pm

A couple of things worry me about this job summit. Firstly, regardless of Albo requesting participants put aside personal agendas and look at new solutions and thinking outside the box, it just seemed to boil down to more pay, free training, and all the old chestnuts that get dragged out whenever these talkfests take place. We never get a costing for any of this - bringing an extra 40,000 of skilled and unskilled people into Australia is going to cost a lot of money - does the return of investment of this outweigh the cost of the program? Of that 40,000, how many will be the stay at home party and how many will actually work and solve our problems? What sort of taxpayer funds are going to the Twiggys, Ginas, Clives etc to bring these workers in?

The thing that is never explored is that there is a huge pool of unemployed somewhere, and a huge amount of unfilled jobs somewhere else - the two neveer seem to overlap! Has the Government thought about what sort of contributions it would need to put in place to get those unemployed to jobs - rather than bringing in more people from overseas? How are these these immigrants going to be convinced to go where the jobs are - even if the location is in the middle of the Aussie desert! We are just going to end up with another swag of people wanting to live on the coasts and in the major cities.

Let's look at giving our pool of unemployed some form of financial or other incentives to overcome from within before we give that money to the Ginas and Twiggys to pay lower wages and pocket the rest

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Setanta

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Re: Immigration
Reply #16 - Sep 4^th, 2022 at 9:53pm

Vic wrote on Sep 4^th, 2022 at 6:24pm:

A couple of things worry me about this job summit. Firstly, regardless of Albo requesting participants put aside personal agendas and look at new solutions and thinking outside the box, it just seemed to boil down to more pay, free training, and all the old chestnuts that get dragged out whenever these talkfests take place. We never get a costing for any of this - bringing an extra 40,000 of skilled and unskilled people into Australia is going to cost a lot of money - does the return of investment of this outweigh the cost of the program? Of that 40,000, how many will be the stay at home party and how many will actually work and solve our problems? What sort of taxpayer funds are going to the Twiggys, Ginas, Clives etc to bring these workers in?

The thing that is never explored is that there is a huge pool of unemployed somewhere, and a huge amount of unfilled jobs somewhere else - the two neveer seem to overlap! Has the Government thought about what sort of contributions it would need to put in place to get those unemployed to jobs - rather than bringing in more people from overseas? How are these these immigrants going to be convinced to go where the jobs are - even if the location is in the middle of the Aussie desert! We are just going to end up with another swag of people wanting to live on the coasts and in the major cities.

Let's look at giving our pool of unemployed some form of financial or other incentives to overcome from within before we give that money to the Ginas and Twiggys to pay lower wages and pocket the rest

And where do we house them? Another 40,000 on top of the 135,000 we already import every year. Do we even build that many houses in a year?

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tickleandrose

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Re: Immigration
Reply #17 - Sep 4^th, 2022 at 11:17pm

The problems goes far beyond just immigration to fill in the job and skill shortages. We need to look at the reason why there is job and skill shortage in the first place.

Our previous governments, especially the liberal government have abandoned tertiary education in this country. They closed down vocational education all over the country, reduced university funding, increased HECs debts. At the same time, channelling money without proper regulation into 'private' institutions - to a stage where, people are getting 'degrees' that is not recognized anywhere.

The privatization of our important industries like electricity, water, gas and telecommunication, meant the private companies would not bother to train our younger generation through apprenticeships without government hand outs. Instead lobbying the politician to increase 'skilled' migration. Another attack at young people of today.

Then there is systematic favouring of property investments - like negative gearing and capital gains concession. Not only it artificially inflates property prices beyond reaches of many locally born Australians, it also created an adversarial environment for small business through higher rent and higher interest rates. A few years ago, I went to the bank. I wanted a loan for a small business idea. And the banks would only lend me 100k for the idea. However, at the end of the meeting, they were happy to offer me a loan of 800k to buy an investment property. This is madness! (Well... I bought an investment property instead....I know... my bad...)

Then adding to all this, an ageing demographic of Australia. The rest is history. Of the 200k migrants that they projected, will probably just barely scratch the surface. In the aged care sector alone, there is a shortage of 35k right now. With more than 110k anticipated in the next few years. It is a crisis.

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: Immigration
Reply #18 - Sep 5^th, 2022 at 12:37am

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Sep 3^rd, 2022 at 8:41pm:

Well the projected immigration (let's not quibble) of 200,000 p.a. will increase demand on housing thus raising the profitability of the banks and all the vultures in the negative gearing business.... will continue to put pressure on jobs and on incomes derived from jobs.... will continue to split our society and culture into more and more groups, which process will be exacerbated by stupid governments persisting with affirmative action etc ..... and will eventually produce a disaster of major proportions once things go bad....

Australia needs to determine what it is in reality - apart from the dumping ground for every rat racer social science idea. I notice that AlboCorp is always surrounded by mostly Whartes and a few - very few - others.

Clearly there is no intention that excessive and wrongfully advertised immigration and all its pending disasters for the many will not be shared by them in their ivory tower...... same as their opposition....

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: Immigration
Reply #19 - Sep 5^th, 2022 at 12:39am

Setanta wrote on Sep 4^th, 2022 at 9:53pm:

Vic wrote on Sep 4^th, 2022 at 6:24pm:

A couple of things worry me about this job summit. Firstly, regardless of Albo requesting participants put aside personal agendas and look at new solutions and thinking outside the box, it just seemed to boil down to more pay, free training, and all the old chestnuts that get dragged out whenever these talkfests take place. We never get a costing for any of this - bringing an extra 40,000 of skilled and unskilled people into Australia is going to cost a lot of money - does the return of investment of this outweigh the cost of the program? Of that 40,000, how many will be the stay at home party and how many will actually work and solve our problems? What sort of taxpayer funds are going to the Twiggys, Ginas, Clives etc to bring these workers in?

The thing that is never explored is that there is a huge pool of unemployed somewhere, and a huge amount of unfilled jobs somewhere else - the two neveer seem to overlap! Has the Government thought about what sort of contributions it would need to put in place to get those unemployed to jobs - rather than bringing in more people from overseas? How are these these immigrants going to be convinced to go where the jobs are - even if the location is in the middle of the Aussie desert! We are just going to end up with another swag of people wanting to live on the coasts and in the major cities.

Let's look at giving our pool of unemployed some form of financial or other incentives to overcome from within before we give that money to the Ginas and Twiggys to pay lower wages and pocket the rest

And where do we house them? Another 40,000 on top of the 135,000 we already import every year. Do we even build that many houses in a year?

Already addressed that one... and a few other things...

Nice to see you back. Floods finished or just a recess?

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Frank

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Re: Immigration
Reply #20 - Dec 9^th, 2022 at 10:08am

Rejected asylum seekers staying 'not right': O'Neil

Home Affairs Minister Clare O'Neil says allowing asylum seekers who have been rejected by immigration to remain in Australia is "not the right solution", despite thousands continuing to live and work in the country undocumented.

Ms O'Neil's National Press Club address on Thursday put a spotlight on the number of undocumented people living and working in Australia after she blasted the former government for passing almost one million unprocessed visas over to Labor.

Questioned by RN Breakfast as to what the government's plan is to address the 70,000 people working illegally in Australia, Ms O'Neil said awarding them permanent residency was not on the agenda.
"I don't think that's the right solution for this group of people," she said.

Ms O'Neil said the former government had left immigration in "an absolute mess", arguing that Australia has "actively avoided" dealing with the issue.

"We’ve got something we’ve actively avoided as a country, which is a group of undocumented workers who are vulnerable to exploitation," she said.

"We're not a country where you can just arrive without any reason to be here and stay permanently."

"If people are not refugees they're not owed permanent protection, we do need to provide a pathway for them to go back home."

Ms O'Neil said she was "very worried" about undocumented workers having an effect on wages, saying she is "pretty bloody annoyed" at the former government.

"Peter Dutton, while he was immigrration minister, who spent all his time striding around the country telling us what a tough guy he was on borders, and all the while, under his nose, this has been described as the biggest trafficking scam in Australian history," she said.

"Every rock I look under there is a mess there for me to clean up and we are working through them bit by bit."
https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/politics/politicsnow-tanya-pliberseks-gr...

I wonder what solution Labor will come up with to sort out the mess left by the previous Labor Lite government.
Will they have balls to deport them?

By way of comparison:
Bundaberg 70,826
Bunbury 68,248
Maitland 67,132
Rockhampton 61,724
Adelaide Hills 60,394
Melbourne City Centre 60,057
Hervey Bay 52,230
Reservoir 50,092
Craigieburn 50,069
Point Cook 49,436
Tamworth 47,597
Berwick 47,074
Blacktown 46,942
Pakenham 45,895
Port Macquarie 45,692
Glen Waverley 40,238
Werribee 40,143
Dubbo 39,863
Castle Hill 39,284
Orange 38,408

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« Last Edit: Dec 9^th, 2022 at 10:13am by Frank »

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Mattyfisk

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Re: Immigration
Reply #21 - Dec 11^th, 2022 at 1:10am

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Sep 3^rd, 2022 at 12:03am:

Have to agree with Frank here... educating our own is far more important than bringing in 'dilutees' with half the skills to fill the gaps artificially created.

I ask again - why are there so many nursing graduates who cannot get a job with NSW Health while they bring in Outlanders with 'skills'?

Why are universities permitted to bring in full fee paying Outlanders to study top grade disciplines to the detriment of local talent that often cannot afford the tuition?

Governments here have zero problem with establishing quotas for all those they love to love - what about quotas for our very own first?

I know, dear, but Frank's not our own, now is he?

He's a New Australian, otherwise known as an "immigrant".

If we educated our own, we wouldn't need graduates of the prestigious University of Balogney, now would we?

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Frank

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Re: Immigration
Reply #22 - Dec 11^th, 2022 at 6:44am

Mattyfisk wrote on Dec 11^th, 2022 at 1:10am:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Sep 3^rd, 2022 at 12:03am:

Have to agree with Frank here... educating our own is far more important than bringing in 'dilutees' with half the skills to fill the gaps artificially created.

I ask again - why are there so many nursing graduates who cannot get a job with NSW Health while they bring in Outlanders with 'skills'?

Why are universities permitted to bring in full fee paying Outlanders to study top grade disciplines to the detriment of local talent that often cannot afford the tuition?

Governments here have zero problem with establishing quotas for all those they love to love - what about quotas for our very own first?

I know, dear, but Frank's not our own, now is he?

He's a New Australian, otherwise known as an "immigrant".

If we educated our own, we wouldn't need graduates of the prestigious University of Balogney, now would we?

As always, Mustaphaken, you are missing the point. Deliberately, I am sure.

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Frank

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Re: Immigration
Reply #23 - Jan 4^th, 2023 at 5:06pm

Mortgage stress has some Australians bracing for a new year of budget pain

https://amp.abc.net.au/article/101754182

Mobaraka Mohammadi says she works 12 hours a day just to make ends meet and pay off her mortgage.

Mortgage broker Gracious Chidhakwa told the ABC some households had already started missing their repayments, and she warned the full effect of the rate rises would not be felt for some time yet.

Ali Kawser, mortgage broker and owner of AK Home Loans based in the west of Melbourne, told the ABC that some aspiring home owners who secured house and land packages last year did not want to proceed.

David Lin is anxiously watching Australia's mortgage rate rises and considering whether he will have to take up another job soon.

Mr Lin, a Melburnian in his 30s, had his mortgage rate fixed before the pandemic but that will expire next year, meaning if rates stay where they are, he could be forced to pay an extra $300 to $400 every month.

Founder and chief executive of Financially Empowered, Grace Mugabe, said the cost of living crisis and rising interest rates were hitting most people hard, particularly culturally and linguistically diverse (CALD) Australians and migrants.

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: Immigration
Reply #24 - Jan 4^th, 2023 at 6:14pm

We all know that continued immigration is intended to constantly raise the cost (not the value) of properties and benefit some to the detriment of the rest... been through it time and again. ....

I have no argument with parasite investors ruining the homes market for real people taking a hit - but that will not be the reality with rising interest rates ... the banks protect those vultures and throw the ordinary folk to the wolves.... and I equally have no problem with the banks taking a few hits for the team for a change....

What we don't need added to the mix is more and more people demanding homing in either rentals or purchased and also applying pressure on jobs and general incomes .... thus forever raising pressure on the COL/income balance and creating homelessness and poverty for the many.... all just to create a farce of some mythical 'growth in GDP'.

Sure more people means more spending etc... but creates of the actual product a joke by spreading available and always behind resources across a greater number. Sure they spend more to buy less... HTF is that a genuine 'product' of anything?

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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greggerypeccary

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Re: Immigration
Reply #25 - Jan 4^th, 2023 at 6:41pm

Frank wrote on Dec 9^th, 2022 at 10:08am:

Rejected asylum seekers staying 'not right': O'Neil

Home Affairs Minister Clare O'Neil says allowing asylum seekers who have been rejected by immigration to remain in Australia is "not the right solution", despite thousands continuing to live and work in the country undocumented.

Ms O'Neil's National Press Club address on Thursday put a spotlight on the number of undocumented people living and working in Australia after she blasted the former government for passing almost one million unprocessed visas over to Labor.

Questioned by RN Breakfast as to what the government's plan is to address the 70,000 people working illegally in Australia, Ms O'Neil said awarding them permanent residency was not on the agenda.
"I don't think that's the right solution for this group of people," she said.

Ms O'Neil said the former government had left immigration in "an absolute mess", arguing that Australia has "actively avoided" dealing with the issue.

"We’ve got something we’ve actively avoided as a country, which is a group of undocumented workers who are vulnerable to exploitation," she said.

"We're not a country where you can just arrive without any reason to be here and stay permanently."

"If people are not refugees they're not owed permanent protection, we do need to provide a pathway for them to go back home."

Ms O'Neil said she was "very worried" about undocumented workers having an effect on wages, saying she is "pretty bloody annoyed" at the former government.

"Peter Dutton, while he was immigrration minister, who spent all his time striding around the country telling us what a tough guy he was on borders, and all the while, under his nose, this has been described as the biggest trafficking scam in Australian history," she said.

"Every rock I look under there is a mess there for me to clean up and we are working through them bit by bit."
https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/politics/politicsnow-tanya-pliberseks-gr...

I wonder what solution Labor will come up with to sort out the mess left by the previous Labor Lite government.
Will they have balls to deport them?

By way of comparison:
Bundaberg 70,826
Bunbury 68,248
Maitland 67,132
Rockhampton 61,724
Adelaide Hills 60,394
Melbourne City Centre 60,057
Hervey Bay 52,230
Reservoir 50,092
Craigieburn 50,069
Point Cook 49,436
Tamworth 47,597
Berwick 47,074
Blacktown 46,942
Pakenham 45,895
Port Macquarie 45,692
Glen Waverley 40,238
Werribee 40,143
Dubbo 39,863
Castle Hill 39,284
Orange 38,408

They came by plane, Frank.

Visa over-stayers. Not asylum seekers.

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Frank

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Re: Immigration
Reply #26 - Jan 5^th, 2023 at 4:29pm

Ooooohhhhhh....... Cry

Ahmed and Danice fell in love when he was in prison. Neither expected the biggest test to come after his release

https://amp.abc.net.au/article/101782498
A few months before Ahmed was released from prison, he received a letter from immigration alluding to the possibility that his visa could be cancelled because of his criminal conviction.

A few months before Ahmed was released from prison, he received a letter from immigration alluding to the possibility that his visa could be cancelled because of his criminal conviction.

The other 37 family members got it,except little Ahmed. Cry

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Frank Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 42851 Gender:	Re: Immigration Reply #27 - Jan 5^th, 2023 at 9:00pm Busy morning in the Western Suburbs of Sydney with renters trying to get on a train to get to work in the more property affluent suburbs https://mobile.twitter.com/RBASHAGGER/status/1610743182559412245
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Mattyfisk

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Re: Immigration
Reply #28 - Jan 6^th, 2023 at 11:23am

Frank wrote on Sep 3^rd, 2022 at 11:25pm:

If large scale immigration - importing the population of Townsville EVERY year - is the answer then an awful lot of things, like education, regions, productivity etc are done wrong.

Just so, old boy. We could educate our best and brightest or import some dilutees after a stint at the pwestigious University of Balogney, no?

Either/or.

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Mattyfisk

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Re: Immigration
Reply #29 - Jan 6^th, 2023 at 11:28am

Frank wrote on Jan 5^th, 2023 at 9:00pm:

Busy morning in the Western Suburbs of Sydney with renters trying to get on a train to get to work in the more property affluent suburbs

https://mobile.twitter.com/RBASHAGGER/status/1610743182559412245

Mumbai, eh?

Bit of a laugh, old boy. It's the Muselman we need to watch - always absolutely never ever, no?

Your Curry Shitter's just a garden-variety tinted race/sorry - culture.

Correlation not causation, innit.

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« Last Edit: Jan 6^th, 2023 at 3:12pm by Mattyfisk »

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