But, but.....

Where are the resonating WOKE cries of; "Cultural appropriation!!"

Or are such expressions of 'offence' and grievance, only applicable to white people, who do 'DOT' paintings
[and for 'white' actors, who, historically, have sometimes made a theatrical interpretation, of a historically 'tinted' individual] ?

https://youtu.be/Bnq7qFKkGU4

John Smith wrote on Dec 28^th, 2021 at 11:31am:





Like Ali G, innit, batty boy.  Booyakasha!



Macbeth wasnt black, nor Macduff, any more than the Montrefeltros, Borgias, Lodovesis or Farneses, batty boy.

Go, concrete over somefin'. That's your thing.

Frank wrote on Dec 28^th, 2021 at 2:19pm:



no one said he was ya moron. Your thread title wasn't about McBeth.

have you asked for your refund yet?

Frank wrote on Dec 28^th, 2021 at 6:24pm:


No, no mention of McBeth

Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude

Besides, McBeth is a fictional character so he can be whatever your imagination wants him to be.

you really should read more.

Anne Boleyn, the second wife of King Henry VIII and daughter of the Earl of Wiltshire,  was also a black African lady  because her daddy was also African, from the Irish-African branch of his mother's family, don't you know.

According to British network Channel 5 (wholly owned by ViacomCBC).

Saw the movie yesterday.

Casting black actors as medieval Scots adds absolutely nothing to the artistic value of the movie.  It is a complete distraction serving only to remind you as you watch that America and the West is infected with stupid political mania about race. 
Blacks fighting it out for the crown of Scotland with swords? It is as stupid, anachronistic and venal as casting, say, Brad Pitt as Desmond Tutu or Cate Blanchett as Barangaroo.

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 1^st, 2022 at 11:38am:





Sure it's true! Like Macbeth and Mcduff were blacks, it is the current truth!

And Beyonce is a natural blonde!

Yadda wrote on Dec 27^th, 2021 at 8:56pm:


*Racial

freediver wrote on Jan 1^st, 2022 at 7:36pm:


not clutching anything FD. It's a fact that blacks were not just slaves or peasants ... they sometimes made up the nobility

John Smith wrote on Jan 1^st, 2022 at 7:41pm:


Are you really gullible enough to believe Scotland had an African King in the 900s? Do you think the elves and dwarves put him on the throne?

John Smith wrote on Jan 1^st, 2022 at 7:41pm:

You are clutching your cazzo and agitating it in public, balatro.

Tsk, tsk.

John Smith wrote on Jan 1^st, 2022 at 8:23pm:


So you are not gullible because you read it on the internet?

freediver wrote on Jan 2^nd, 2022 at 7:50am:


No, I'm not gullible because my name isn't FD.

I suppose we should remember the White fellas who donned blackface to play Indigenous Australians.  Perhaps the most infamous was a Kiwi - James Laurenson he played Detective Inspector Napoleon Bonaparte in the TV series "Bony" in 1970-72.



Is he to be condemned?   

One of Orwell’s best ideas is a thing called the “Memory Hole” into which we may consign all the horrific elements of our society and wipe them from history. These could include: the Daily Mail, all the Harry Potter novels, non vegan meals, the Conservative party, Sunderland and Toby Young.

Over the past two years, brave activists have followed Orwell’s advice and targeted a number of historical monuments for demolition. One of these is the statue in Parliament Square of that repugnant racist Winston Churchill. This is the man who literally forced citizens to travel abroad and shoot at Germans. How can that be anything other than xenophobic?

It’s so typical of a white man to free some slaves and assume we should be grateful

I have been particularly impressed by calls from academics at Imperial College to remove the bust of slavery abolitionist Thomas Henry Huxley. As an evil white male, it’s clear that he was only ever campaigning to end the slave trade as a cynical ploy to disguise his inherent racism.

And last year protesters in the United States also called for the toppling of statues of Abraham Lincoln in Washington and Boston. Just because Lincoln signed that “Emancipation Proclamation” doesn’t mean he should get a free pass for his white privilege.

Anyway, it’s so typical of a white man to free some slaves and assume we should be grateful. In fact, I think we should reinstate slavery immediately so that it can be abolished by a queer woman of colour.

So let’s bulldoze Buckingham Palace, tear up the gardens at Kew, and incinerate all libraries that contain harmful words. I also think we should remove that so called “statue of justice” on top of the Old Bailey, because if you squint your eyes it looks a bit like a swastika.

As Orwell explained: “Who controls the past controls the future.” She knew what she was talking about.
https://thecritic.co.uk/issues/december-january-2022/orwell-shes-my-self-help-gu...

Anyone who has a problem with Denzel Washington playing MacBeth, should also have a problem with anyone playing MacBeth who is not speaking in Scottish (or in a Scottish accent) let alone Shakespeare's MacBeth having been translated into multiple languages and the character of MacBeth played by nearly every world ethnicity.

I think it was Richard Burton who quipped that no one had a problem when an English actor played a Roman, but when an American actor did the same, many people scoffed at their performance because Romans didn't speak with an American accent.

An African playing a Scotsman is not translation.

It's parochial American PC and pointless taking the fccn knee.
Absurd.

Africans, Asians, Arabs in the Midsummer Night's Dream, The Tempest - fine. Not mediaeval Scottish or English king's, queen's, nobles.
Moronic.

Ok for Black 'African' Americans (because Africa is for Black people only apparently) to play non-American historical roles of foreign nations.

...but not ok for White people to play 'Black' historical roles. That's racist!

UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 2^nd, 2022 at 10:15pm:

Yes. And we know the backlash that got eh?

mothra wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2022 at 7:56am:



We KNOW you are stupid, Mother Miffy, no need to emphasise it.  The play's full title is Othello, the Moor of Venice.

Would you cast Brad Pitt as Othello? Or Laurence Olivier, in blackface?

UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 2^nd, 2022 at 10:15pm:


It's called makeup.

The genius of Shakespeare's works is that they transcend ethnicity and culture by speaking to the universality of the human condition and it wouldn't matter that actors who played Shylock were not necessarily Jewish.

Beyond Shakespeare, there are many examples of productions disregarding ethnicity.

Like, Yul Brynner, who played a Siamese king and an Egyptian pharaoh.

Charlton Heston who played Moses.

Brad Pitt who played Achilles.

freediver wrote on Jan 2^nd, 2022 at 2:07pm:


I don't believe the crap you post.

UnSubRocky wrote on Jan 2^nd, 2022 at 10:15pm:


Robert Tudawali and Ngarla Kunoth were Aboriginal.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2022 at 12:18pm:


Both good actors. And I hear are both good people.

But, I was referring to the lady 'housemaid' that was supposed to represent an aboriginal woman. Played by a white actress in blackface. And I think (I forget who it was) "Joe" the biracial aboriginal station hand that went to rescue Jedda in the later part of the movie. He looked caucasian with some tanning.

The American Media & Warner Bros tried to 'spoil' LOTR and The Hobbit mostly because it was Pre-Christian-oppressed European and didn't have Token Black Men in it (though it did have a few 'non-white' extra's and more playing roles with make-up). It also didn't like how a Blonde male and Red-haired male was depicted in a positive tone as 'heroes', when most of the Media depict them as 'negative' roles and characters like villians.

A lot of Maori loved playing Orcs trying to kill white actors they laughed. The Maori could relate 'culturally' to the myths and legends of Pre-Christian Europe of the early First Age of Europe (Age of Fey).

Eventually, besides the Australian Actor's Union trying to rip the production off and sabotage it, Warner Bros had to capitulate after their tantrum of no 'Token Black Men' major roles.

Brian Ross wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2022 at 5:41pm:



White Man Can't Jump - Black Men Can't Act!! 

Why do white people have to put on black makeup when they play black characters, but not vice versa?

But wait, there's more...

BBC rancour over Black and White Minstrels
Jake Kanter, Media Correspondent
Tuesday January 04 2022, 12.01am GMT, The Times
Television
 
The BBC’s historical culture wars have been laid bare in an authorised biography of the corporation.

It reveals that a high-ranking executive demanded that black people “shut up” amid internal disquiet over The Black And White Minstrel Show.

The book by David Hendy, a professor of media and culture history at Sussex University, dedicates a chapter to how the BBC dealt with the rise of cultural diversity in Britain amid the Windrush wave of immigration.

The Black and White Minstrel Show survived until 1978

The Black And White Minstrel Show was a hugely popular variety programme that ran for 20 years from 1958 featuring white performers in black make-up.

In 1962 Barrie Thorne, the corporation’s chief accountant, privately complained that the show was “a disgrace and an insult to coloured people”. Five years later he voiced his misgivings to Oliver Whitley, assistant to Hugh Greene, the director-general. He received short shrift. “Coloured people,” replied Whitley, who died in 2005, should “for heaven’s sake shut up”.

Also in 1967, the show was the subject of a complaint from the Campaign Against Racial Discrimination. The BBC head of press turned to the Daily Mail to assess how viewers felt about the show. He concluded it was not “racially offensive” and that “no further action was necessary”.

When the show, which would later feature Sir Lenny Henry in one of his first TV appearances, was eventually cancelled in 1978, the decision “had come shockingly late”, Hendy observes in The BBC: A People’s History, which has been written to coincide with the corporation’s centenary this year.

Delving into the BBC’s vast archives, he also reveals that Una Marson, the broadcaster’s only black producer in 1939, experienced both racism and support from colleagues.

The BBC checked with the government to ensure it had no objection to the “appointment of a coloured British subject” before she was hired.

Hendy writes that the “constant hum of prejudice” contributed to Marson having a nervous breakdown in 1945 and she returned to Jamaica

Frank wrote on Dec 27^th, 2021 at 5:27pm:


Meh!

Achilles was also black.


Netflix: Troy - Fall of a city.

Let's not talk about cultural appropriation though.

Frank wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 5:55pm:


What can I say? All of a sudden I can speak and understand aboriginal! It's a miracle! Hallelujah!

edit: Laughed at this comment...

Quote:

Those who have met aboriginals out in dry desert communities know that they are generally naturally shy and laconic people.

Frank wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 9:44pm:

Somewhat true as most speak their local language and speak an English kriol as a second language.

Setanta wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 10:29pm:

Have you been to Warakurna and the neighbouring communities?

Setanta wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 10:50pm:

Given that English is generally not Ngaanyatjarra people’s first language

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/commentary/they-havent-the-remotest-idea/news-story/5fc1d9252180416c14356a126042883a

Go out there (seek and receive permission first) and you'll hear 'one' peppered throughout their English kriol and Anglicised names and descriptions taken directly from their language exactly as you heard the old woman using.

Setanta wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 10:58pm:

No. But given the general ignorance of remote communities in Western Australia, I thought it would help city folk if they read it from proper newspaper one.

Setanta wrote on Jan 12^th, 2022 at 11:06pm:

And you haven't been to Warakurna. Stephen King (the novelist) has been there.

Have you been to any remote Aboriginal community?

Vee haff vays off machin sie sprechen swartzfrau!

Another thing that would be good for many to know: Aboriginals from remote communities are very wary of being shamed (dishonoured) by mainstream Australians, and the tone of posts here and on twitter confirm they're right to be wary.

https://imightbewrong.substack.com/p/joel-coens-the-tragedy-of-macbeth?fbclid=Iw
AR0vjw799BoPXukl1tg7knjtm1F_iYtpsssEkHnOgzDMIGjq6mw-YzfTI08

Joel Coen's "The Tragedy of Macbeth", Reviewed by Ethan Coen

In The Tragedy of Macbeth, long-time Hollywood presence Joel Coen — who has 18 prior films to his credit — takes sole creative control of a project for the first time. The result, not unlike the tale of Macbeth itself, is a tragedy of epic proportions.

In the interest of full disclosure, my editor has requested that I mention that I was Mr. Coen’s writing partner, producer, and creative collaborator on the aforementioned 18 films. I am also his brother. We parted ways prior to Macbeth in a split that the press described as completely amicable. Despite my prior association with Mr. Coen, I feel that I am entirely capable of reviewing his work in a fair and objective way.

Macbeth is Joel Coen’s shittiest movie by several billion light years. If all the elephants in all the world crapped into the same canyon for 100 years, you would still not have a pile of poo half a large as Joel Coen’s dumb-as-a-dog-dick rendering of this classic tale. One can’t watch Macbeth without getting the sense that something is missing; some inspired element that gave Mr. Coen’s earlier work an aura of ebullient genius is absent this time. The wit, verve, and undeniable rugged machismo that characterized the other 18 films in which he happened to be involved are nowhere to be found here. Ultimately, one must conclude that what’s lacking is talent itself.

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 10:34am:




Very funny.




In other art news:



https://vimeo.com/370885984/535e745fe0

Belgarion wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 12:25pm:

No. The very bare bones are fact.

The rest was a propaganda piece by Shakespeare to secure patronage of James I of England and VI of Scotland.

James was obsessed with witches whom he thought were scheming with the devil to overthrow him.

His family (the Stuarts) were also, by tradition allied and related to Duncan and Malcolm - through Fleance (the child who is rescued at the end of Shakespeare's Macbeth).

MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 3:41pm:


An example of the dangers of a little Wiki knowledge.

500 years on, it's 'nuffin but propaganda'.  Shakespeare was the Goebbels to James's Hitler. 

Social media, like this forum, lets us realise just how eyewateringly stupid some of the people we pass on the street are.

Belgarion wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:07pm:

There is no history of witches informing Macbeth of his future. That was a Shakespearean fiction.

Duncan was not poisoned in Macbeth's castle by the scheming between Macbeth and his wife Gruoch. That was a Shakespearean fiction.

Duncan was killed in battle against Macbeth after Duncan had named his grandson Malcolm as his heir. According to Scottish tradition, the 2 main lines of the descendants of Kenneth McAlpine alternated as the ruling family of Scotland. After Duncan, Macbeth was the rightful heir.

There is no evidence that Gruoch went mad over guilt or committed suicide. That was a Shakespearean fiction.

Macbeth was not killed by Malcolm at the castle. Macbeth was overthrown by Malcolm with the help of the English. Malcolm soon after had himself enthroned as king of the Scots, which created a political crisis with two anointed kings living in Scotland.

Macbeth who had escaped into the highlands, fought a guerilla war for 3 years until he was overcome by Malcolm's English army.

Belgarion wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:29pm:

'Broadly' is generous.

Shakespeare was reinforcing James's right to rule (which was precarious anyway, given the Tudors themselves, before the Stuarts, were usurpers, the last of which, Elizabeth, had declared James her heir almost on her deathbed) by casting Macbeth as a weak schemer who took advice and was manipulated by women (even witches) into poisoning his rivals and enemies instead of taking the manly course of challenging him in battle (which is in fact what Macbeth did).

The agony of Gruoch with her guilt and suicide was to reinforce that Macbeth was not the rightful king of the Scots (which he was).

Given the Stewards, then Stewarts, then Stuarts were descended from Malcolm's family, it was a smart move by Shakespeare to cast Macbeth as weak, evil and craven.

Exactly what Shakespeare had done to the Plantagenets in favour of the Tudors by casting Richard III as weak, evil and craven and a child killer.

MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:51pm:



Aghhhh!!! Another EngLit undergraduate!!!!

Here we go - David Gulpillil for 13th century Scottish king!!!

Anything else is wacist oppwession!!  Shakespeare was a bastard for NEVER writing a part for an Abo!  So why should Abos pay ANY attention to Shakespeare??  Eh? Eh???

Belgarion wrote on Feb 6^th, 2022 at 10:44am:

Yes, true.

And his objective was more than just flattering monarchs, (particular the Tudor and Stuart monarchs through whose rule he lived), he did it mostly to secure their patronage and to ensure he assisted in augmenting their right to rule and, of course, avoid accusations of treason!

What is interesting is that he never wrote a play about Elizabeth I, likely because would have raised the issue of her ordering the execution of James's mother: Mary, Queen of Scots.

Just on the trans-ethno matter, some actors who played Othello:

Anthony Hopkins
Orson Welles
Patrick Stewart
Richard Burton
Laurence Olivier
John Gielgud
Raúl Juliá

MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 6^th, 2022 at 11:00am:

You could argue that and it would make you stupidest mong for miles.

Frank wrote on Feb 7^th, 2022 at 9:13pm:

Yes, of course. Shakespeare's Richard III is history as it happened, As is Macbeth.

'My horse, my horse my kingdom for a horse' or 'Treason, treason treason'.