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Chinese car comparisons (Read 3215 times)
Sprintcyclist
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Chinese car comparisons
Apr 20th, 2026 at 3:55pm
 
We hired a BYD last year, Sealion
It was a bit big, heavy, hybrid, lots of tech, not a good driving feel.


Hiring a Chery now, Tiggo4. Smaller, better size. 1.5L turbo, CVT. Really good on fuel, better driving feel.
'Easier' to live with. Cameras not as good.
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #1 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 8:08am
 
I've been in a BYD shark. It is obviously cheap on fuel. Very powerful. But there were a few irritating things about it. Like if you stick a USB with music into it, it does not have a sensible browser. You cannot play all the music on one folder. It puts things in random order. It's like they got to the stage where they were able to play a song and decided, great, job's done. For such a high upfront price, a slick looking car, and a huge display screen that controls everything, you would expect them to have the little things like that figured out.
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #2 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 9:00am
 
freediver wrote on Apr 21st, 2026 at 8:08am:
It's like they got to the stage where they were able to play a song and decided, great, job's done.

It's the Chinese plague of 'cha bu duo'...

It refers to the concept: 'If it looks good (for the market), it is good'... i.e., time spent on attention to detail is time in market delayed.

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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #3 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 12:47pm
 
Don't have a problem with the concept itself. It is called common sense in engineering. The Chinese didn't invent it. They just draw the line in some strange places.
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #4 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 12:59pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 21st, 2026 at 12:47pm:
Don't have a problem with the concept itself. It is called common sense in engineering. The Chinese didn't invent it. They just draw the line in some strange places.

Cha bu duo is worse than that… it pervades all manufacturing in China not overseen by western manufacturers compromising safety to the point of risking death…

It’s why the Chinese crave many western made products even if they’re exponentially more expensive than the local competitors.

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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #5 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 1:30pm
 
Quote:
Cha bu duo is worse than that… it pervades all manufacturing in China


It pervades every business that manages to remain in business. The concept is no different in China. The Chinese just have different standards. They were starving to death by the tens of millions in 1960. They are not going to "get" the high expectations that we have. Not overnight, anyway.

The only thing that might differ in any fundamental way is that the Chinese are upfront about it. Microsoft is not going to announce to the market that the software they just released is fully of little bugs that are not going to be resolved until after this version is obsolete, but they are releasing it anyway to stay ahead of Apple and because people will buy it as-is. They will spin it the best way they can. But there is no shortage of programmers tearing their hair out in frustration at all the new problems microsoft has created. Many of them within microsoft itself. And despite being full of bugs, it is still high quality software.

And every other 'asian tiger' has been through the same thing.
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #6 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 1:54pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 21st, 2026 at 1:30pm:
Quote:
Cha bu duo is worse than that… it pervades all manufacturing in China


It pervades every business that manages to remain in business. The concept is no different in China. The Chinese just have different standards. They were starving to death by the tens of millions in 1960. They are not going to "get" the high expectations that we have. Not overnight, anyway.

The only thing that might differ in any fundamental way is that the Chinese are upfront about it. Microsoft is not going to announce to the market that the software they just released is fully of little bugs that are not going to be resolved until after this version is obsolete, but they are releasing it anyway to stay ahead of Apple and because people will buy it as-is. They will spin it the best way they can. But there is no shortage of programmers tearing their hair out in frustration at all the new problems microsoft has created. Many of them within microsoft itself. And despite being full of bugs, it is still high quality software.

And every other 'asian tiger' has been through the same thing.

Yes the ‘order a rocket ship, get a skateboard’ as v1.0 is a thing…

Cha bu duo is more pervasive than that and has plagued Chinese societies for many centuries… even Confucius is recorded as lamenting the practise.
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #7 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:04pm
 
I am pretty sure you can find a philosopher from every society that has had writing who lamented the practice. And probably a few who didn't have writing. It's hard to get good help these days.

If it is such a big problem in China, how have they managed to catch up to the word's leading car manufacturers in such a short time?
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #8 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:19pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:04pm:
If it is such a big problem in China, how have they managed to catch up to the word's leading car manufacturers in such a short time?

Copyright theft, mostly.

Then there's less attention to quality control. The local Chinese are so used to the concept of cha bu duo that they rarely complain about substandard manufacture.

Then there's governmental treating foreign competitors in China with extreme prejudice. except initially to make theft of technology easier.

You can find many 'horror' stories. many times greater in number than their western equivalents, of shoddy Chinese technology and manufacture.
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #9 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:28pm
 
We do not have a copyright on work ethic.

There is no need at all to go looking for a China-specific explanation. There is a far more obvious one staring you in the face: communism. Communism will create a half-arsed work ethic in any society where is takes hold. It happened every single time. And it doesn't need a convenient catch phrase to describe it. But communism can also be abandoned, far more easily than culture. Which is what is happening in China.

Can you give an example of any previously-communist country that now has higher manufacturing standards than China?
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #10 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:34pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:28pm:
We do not have a copyright on work ethic.

There is no need at all to go looking for a China-specific explanation. There is a far more obvious one staring you in the face: communism. Communism will create a half-arsed work ethic in any society where is takes hold. It happened every single time. And it doesn't need a convenient catch phrase to describe it. But communism can also be abandoned, far more easily than culture. Which is what is happening in China.

Can you give an example of any previously-communist country that now has higher manufacturing standards than China?

You're not up with modern Chinese 'communism'... It's now a wild and woolly authoritarian, corrupt capitalist society... Even the thought of rent control bewilders modern Chinese people.

Cha bu duo, on the other hand, is a societal plague that the Chinese have had a long time to learn to live with.
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #11 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:41pm
 
Quote:
You're not up with modern Chinese 'communism'... It's now a wild and woolly authoritarian, corrupt capitalist society...


Perhaps you should have read what I posted.

Can you give an example of any previously-communist country that now has higher manufacturing standards than China?
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #12 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:44pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:41pm:
Quote:
You're not up with modern Chinese 'communism'... It's now a wild and woolly authoritarian, corrupt capitalist society...


Perhaps you should have read what I posted.

Can you give an example of any previously-communist country that now has higher manufacturing standards than China?

Poland.
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #13 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:51pm
 
Is that the only example you can think of? Nearly every discussion of Poland I can see focusses on EU-imposed, legislated quality control rules, and the ease with which European countries can oversea production in Poland. I haven't seen anything credit any difference in Polish culture.

So again, the explanations are in the "bleeding obvious" category, without the need to try to hang an elaborate theory on an old catch phrase, or any nation-specific culture.
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Re: Chinese car comparisons
Reply #14 - Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:57pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 21st, 2026 at 7:51pm:
Is that the only example you can think of? Nearly every discussion of Poland I can see focusses on EU-imposed, legislated quality control rules, and the ease with which European countries can oversea production in Poland. I haven't seen anything credit any difference in Polish culture.

So again, the explanations are in the "bleeding obvious" category, without the need to try to hang an elaborate theory on an old catch phrase, or any nation-specific culture.

You asked for one example.

The Polish are European as well, so they're happy to impose the same standards as their European comrades impose on themselves, individually and collectively.

But you're defending something about the CCP... wait till thegreatdivide reads this!
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