Australian Politics Forum - Housing Now An Investors Playground

lee

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #45 - Feb 23^rd, 2026 at 7:36pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2026 at 5:55pm:

Primarily but not confined to...

Do you even understand the meaning of "unique"?

Even if we include "somewhat unique" which means unusual though not strictly true.

"unique(adj.)

c. 1600, "single, solitary," from French unique (16c.), from Latin unicus "only, single, sole, alone of its kind," from unus "one" (from PIE root *oi-no- "one, unique").

The meaning "forming the only one of its kind" is attested from 1610s; erroneous sense of "remarkable, uncommon" is attested from mid-19c. "

https://www.etymonline.com/word/unique

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2026 at 5:55pm:

Doesn't change the truth of the OP.; house prices in Oz are expensive because rent-seeking investors in private housing, incentivized by unique tax advantages (see above) have pushed up prices, in a high demand scenario supported by high immigration, cf the US.

So you do not understand Clapboard is a cheaper construction method than brick. Roll Eyes

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thegreatdivide

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #46 - Feb 24^th, 2026 at 11:55am

freediver wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2026 at 7:05pm:

Quote:

Incorrect. AI "knows" Oz investors have unique tax breaks

And so the circle continues.

Well ... only 2 ideologically crippled dummies are still commenting, so I'll be brief:

FD is too blind to even acknowledge the error of his "AI is convenient, and also BS" assertion, an oxymoron which AI exposed brilliantly, in my previous post.

Quote:

What are they?

You mindlessly reject AI which concisely listed them for you.

And the other dummy, lee: he has settled on rejecting the truth in OP because ...(drum role).... "Clapboard is a cheaper construction method than brick."

And speaking of "circles", lee's using a circular argument: he says there is no housing investor's playground in Oz (despite AI's confirmation of the OP) , because we could be building cheaper houses, ignoring the effect of other factors such as higher immigration causing 'demand pull' price inflation.

I rest my case.

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« Last Edit: Feb 24^th, 2026 at 12:18pm by thegreatdivide »

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lee

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #47 - Feb 24^th, 2026 at 12:48pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 24^th, 2026 at 11:55am:

And speaking of "circles", lee's using a circular argument: he says there is no housing investor's playground in Oz (despite AI's confirmation of the OP) , because we could be building cheaper houses, ignoring the effect of other factors such as higher immigration causing 'demand pull' price inflation.

No you ignore the cheaper option because it doesn't suit your argument. Even with higher immigration cheaper housing methods lead to lower prices.

You do know that AI has no actual Artificial Intelligence?

It merely follows your directions via you questions and trawls through available papers. Whether they are from someone like you at one end of the scale and someone with knowledge at the other end. BUT it still relies on the questions being posed.

So tell us - at what point does something lose its "unique" status, if it is more than one? Should it be 3, 5 105? Or is the answer along the lines "how long is a ball of string"

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 24^th, 2026 at 11:55am:

I rest my case.

Ah, so now you are a judge - Always sitting on a case. Not doing anything, just sitting. Roll Eyes

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« Last Edit: Feb 24^th, 2026 at 12:54pm by lee »

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freediver

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #48 - Feb 24^th, 2026 at 2:51pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 24^th, 2026 at 11:55am:

freediver wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2026 at 7:05pm:

Quote:

Incorrect. AI "knows" Oz investors have unique tax breaks

And so the circle continues.

Well ... only 2 ideologically crippled dummies are still commenting, so I'll be brief:

FD is too blind to even acknowledge the error of his "AI is convenient, and also BS" assertion, an oxymoron which AI exposed brilliantly, in my previous post.

Quote:

What are they?

You mindlessly reject AI which concisely listed them for you.

And the other dummy, lee: he has settled on rejecting the truth in OP because ...(drum role).... "Clapboard is a cheaper construction method than brick."

And speaking of "circles", lee's using a circular argument: he says there is no housing investor's playground in Oz (despite AI's confirmation of the OP) , because we could be building cheaper houses, ignoring the effect of other factors such as higher immigration causing 'demand pull' price inflation.

I rest my case.

What are the unique tax benefits, parrot?

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #49 - Feb 25^th, 2026 at 8:22am

lee wrote on Feb 24^th, 2026 at 12:48pm:

No you ignore the cheaper option because it doesn't suit your argument. Even with higher immigration cheaper housing methods lead to lower prices.

There are many reasons for unafforadable housing; and your claim that wooden US houses is why Oz housing is expensive falls on its face. Higher immigration rates are a factor.

Other reasons for Oz 's unafforadbake housing:

(ABC Business)

Former RBA governor Bernie Fraser calls for capital gains tax discount to be scrapped in 'toxic' property debate

He conceded that a "cartel" of vested interests in the economy, including politicians, home owners and investors, would like to keep the status quo.

"Despite that sort of toxic approach to tax changes, I think that a case can be made for doing away with the discount on the gains, capital gains tax, abolishing it altogether," Mr Fraser said in Canberra.

"I believe that that would be a useful step, one of many steps that are required to moving back to an affordable housing market for all Australians."

Mr Fraser acknowledged that scrapping the CGT discount would meet fierce resistance from certain groups.

"I believe it's true that there are some sectors of the community — there is, in fact, what Alan Kohler called a 'cartel' of people who are against changing the tax dealing with the tax changes," Mr Fraser said, referring to Mr Kohler's appearance before the same committee on Monday.

"This cartel, which comprises existing home owners, property developers and, not least, lots of politicians who like to see house prices rise and go on rising, because there are votes in it."

A cartel including lee and FD, for whom self-interest trumps social equity, and who offer no solutions to the widely acknowleded intergenerational inequity of the current tax arrangements.

Quote:

You do know that AI has no actual Artificial Intelligence?

lee being as dumb as FD, even after google explained it: AI "knows" topics via the mechanics of AI's chip "brain" ie constructing pattern formulation based on vast amounts of data.

Quote:

It merely follows your directions via you questions and trawls through available papers. Whether they are from someone like you at one end of the scale and someone with knowledge at the other end. BUT it still relies on the questions being posed.

Yes, and asking questions is the beginnning of knowledge. But I don't have time to answer FDs endless questions; AI can sort it out in a jiffy.

Quote:

So tell us - at what point does something lose its "unique" status, if it is more than one? Should it be 3, 5 105? Or is the answer along the lines "how long is a ball of string"

Ah - observe crippled brain lee having trouble coping with referring to Oz's known investor tax advantages (conveniently outlined by AI), as "unique", also addressed by Kohler and Fraser above....

Quote:

Ah, so now you are a judge - Always sitting on a case. Not doing anything, just sitting. Roll Eyes

Observe how blind, self-interested "free" market ideology - pushed by FD and lee - results in greedy 'cartels' which are wrecking social cohesion in our democracy.

Deplorable.

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lee

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #50 - Feb 25^th, 2026 at 12:52pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 8:22am:

There are many reasons for unafforadable housing; and your claim that wooden US houses is why Oz housing is expensive falls on its face. Higher immigration rates are a factor.

And I never said anything different. Cheaper build new house must lower the average price of new builds. Basic. So much for falling on its face. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 8:22am:

A cartel including lee and FD, for whom self-interest trumps social equity, and who offer no solutions to the widely acknowleded intergenerational inequity of the current tax arrangements.

So some academic makes a statement and you fall for it. You never explained how a CGT discount, which only occurs on sale, helps landlords buy more. And no the banks don't use CGT discount as some sort of proxy capital. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 8:22am:

lee being as dumb as FD, even after google explained it: AI "knows" topics via the mechanics of AI's chip "brain" ie constructing pattern formulation based on vast amounts of data.

Rubbish. It collects and distributes DATA, not necessarily of good quality. AI of itself knows exactly nothing. It merely regurgitates something based solely on the question asked. Wink

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 8:22am:

Yes, and asking questions is the beginnning of knowledge.

NOPE. Asking the RIGHT question is the beginning of knowledge. Wink

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 8:22am:

Ah - observe crippled brain lee having trouble coping with referring to Oz's known investor tax advantages (conveniently outlined by AI), as "unique", also addressed by Kohler and Fraser above....

Ah so you don't know what "unique" is and must defer to people who at best misuse the term. What a klutz. Grin

BTW - I can find no evidence of Fraser or Kohler using the expression "unique" in relation to taxes. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 8:22am:

Observe how blind, self-interested "free" market ideology - pushed by FD and lee - results in greedy 'cartels' which are wrecking social cohesion in our democracy.

Oh dear loses the argument and tries to deflect. Grin

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« Last Edit: Feb 25^th, 2026 at 12:59pm by lee »

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thegreatdivide

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #51 - Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:30pm

lee wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 12:52pm:

And I never said anything different. Cheaper build new house must lower the average price of new builds. Basic. So much for falling on its face. Roll Eyes

The issue is Oz's unaffordable housing, which tax-advantaged investors are treating as their playground.

As for buiding cheaper wooden houses: the cost of land is the primary driver of escalating housing costs in Australia, with residential land prices increasing by over 500% since 2000, far outpacing construction costs, ie building wooden houses won't stop investors hogging the housing market.

And along with Bernie Fraser and Alan Kohler - who have identified the greedy rent-seeking 'cartel' who are resisting changes to those those generous tax advantages,
also Ken Henry today: "Former Treasury chief Ken Henry says Australia's landlords are using the capital gains tax discount to avoid paying income tax"

https://thenightly.com.au/politics/landlords-using-capital-gains-tax-concessions...

It's time for government to eliminate the tax breaks incentivizing greedy tax-advantaged rent-seekers to buy more than one house, and for government to rebuild sufficient public housing to ensure housing for low income groups. Problem solved.

Then greedy rent seekers might have to invest in productive activity, instead of pushing up prices by competing with first home buyers.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 52592 At my desk.	Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground Reply #52 - Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:31pm What are the unique tax benefits, parrot?
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Bobby.

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #53 - Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:39pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:30pm:

lee wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 12:52pm:

And I never said anything different. Cheaper build new house must lower the average price of new builds. Basic. So much for falling on its face. Roll Eyes

The issue is Oz's unaffordable housing, which tax-advantaged investors are treating as their playground.

As for buiding cheaper wooden houses: the cost of land is the primary driver of escalating housing costs in Australia, with residential land prices increasing by over 500% since 2000, far outpacing construction costs, ie building wooden houses won't stop investors hogging the housing market.

And along with Bernie Fraser and Alan Kohler - who have identified the greedy rent-seeking 'cartel' who are resisting changes to those those generous tax advantages,
also Ken Henry today: "Former Treasury chief Ken Henry says Australia's landlords are using the capital gains tax discount to avoid paying income tax"

https://thenightly.com.au/politics/landlords-using-capital-gains-tax-concessions...

It's time for government to eliminate the tax breaks incentivizing greedy tax-advantaged rent-seekers to buy more than one house, and for government to rebuild sufficient public housing to ensure housing for low income groups. Problem solved.

Then greedy rent seekers might have to invest in productive activity, instead of pushing up prices by competing with first home buyers.

I my younger days I used to rent -
I never met a good landlord once.

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lee

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #54 - Feb 25^th, 2026 at 4:42pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:30pm:

The issue is Oz's unaffordable housing, which tax-advantaged investors are treating as their playground.

And yet ordinary Aussies are doing it. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:30pm:

As for buiding cheaper wooden houses: the cost of land is the primary driver of escalating housing costs in Australia, with residential land prices increasing by over 500% since 2000, far outpacing construction costs, ie building wooden houses won't stop investors hogging the housing market.

So vacant land - a increasingly limited asset is going up in price, But it is the landlords at fault. Grin

That still doesn't mean cheaper cost housing is not effective. Bur hey everybody wants 4 bedrooms, at least 2 bathrooms, 2 car space brick McHootchee. Wink

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:30pm:

And along with Bernie Fraser and Alan Kohler - who have identified the greedy rent-seeking 'cartel' who are resisting changes to those those generous tax advantages,
also Ken Henry today: "Former Treasury chief Ken Henry says Australia's landlords are using the capital gains tax discount to avoid paying income tax"

And still nothing about the uniqueness. Grin

And what method should Henry have used? His report on taxation didn't specify anything about CGT. Although he did recommend a $25k tax-free bracket and only 2 tax brackets. Wink

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:30pm:

It's time for government to eliminate the tax breaks incentivizing greedy tax-advantaged rent-seekers to buy more than one house, and for government to rebuild sufficient public housing to ensure housing for low income groups

So for a person to only own one house, there would be no rental houses at all.

So which tax breaks that are now, supposedly, not unique, be scrapped. Be specific. Wink

And where would the money come from? What house size, construction etc for low income earners? Shouldn't government try to keep rents low, but also enable them to have the funds to build more? Wink

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:30pm:

Then greedy rent seekers might have to invest in productive activity, instead of pushing up prices by competing with first home buyers.

So building homes is not a productive activity? On whom do you rely for that opinion? Wink

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #55 - Feb 25^th, 2026 at 4:44pm

Bobby. wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:39pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:30pm:

lee wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 12:52pm:

And I never said anything different. Cheaper build new house must lower the average price of new builds. Basic. So much for falling on its face. Roll Eyes

The issue is Oz's unaffordable housing, which tax-advantaged investors are treating as their playground.

As for buiding cheaper wooden houses: the cost of land is the primary driver of escalating housing costs in Australia, with residential land prices increasing by over 500% since 2000, far outpacing construction costs, ie building wooden houses won't stop investors hogging the housing market.

And along with Bernie Fraser and Alan Kohler - who have identified the greedy rent-seeking 'cartel' who are resisting changes to those those generous tax advantages,
also Ken Henry today: "Former Treasury chief Ken Henry says Australia's landlords are using the capital gains tax discount to avoid paying income tax"

https://thenightly.com.au/politics/landlords-using-capital-gains-tax-concessions...

It's time for government to eliminate the tax breaks incentivizing greedy tax-advantaged rent-seekers to buy more than one house, and for government to rebuild sufficient public housing to ensure housing for low income groups. Problem solved.

Then greedy rent seekers might have to invest in productive activity, instead of pushing up prices by competing with first home buyers.

I my younger days I used to rent -
I never met a good landlord once.

Is that because you were a bad tenant?

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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20005 Gender:	Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground Reply #56 - Feb 25^th, 2026 at 4:47pm Bobby. wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:39pm: I never met a good landlord once. You should not have gone on the rantan nightly.
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thegreatdivide

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #57 - Feb 25^th, 2026 at 5:22pm

lee wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 4:42pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:30pm:

The issue is Oz's unaffordable housing, which tax-advantaged investors are treating as their playground.

And yet ordinary Aussies are doing it. Roll Eyes

Are you deaf, blind and dumb? - the number one issue in politics today is the current generation of average-wage workers who are unable to afford housing, after prices relative to wages have quadrupled over the last 3 decades.

Hence Eslake joins the debate:

(ABC 'Mornings)

CGT discounts 'too generous' says independent economist Saul Eslake (google it, to listen to the segment)

He also notes Howard's tax arrangements incentivize cashed up, greedy rent-seekers to buy established houses which doesn't increase housing supply , but only increases competition with first home buyers, pushing up prices, and exposing Angus Tallor's contention that removing the tax benefits for investors will "reduce supply of houses to rent" - which, as Esalke says "is the point, we want young people to be able to afford established housing, not be forced into a permanent class of renters.

....

Re "productivity", it's "productive" for investors' wealth but not renters, especially in Oz where housing as an asset has risen mauch faster than other assets.

And the government wants to decrease the cost the age pension, without retired people reduced to living in poverty due to unafforable rents.

Poor crippled brain still thinks "ordinary" Aussies can buy homes, despite a host of well known economists saying otherwise ... and FD still wants to know what are 'generous tax concessions' (compared to other countries). The hopeless duo.

More from Ken Henry:

Australia's tax system is in a worse position than it was 15 years ago and young people are paying the price, former Treasury secretary Ken Henry has warned

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-02-15/ken-henry-australias-tax-system-in-worse-...

Joining the other well-known economists already mentioned in this debate.

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lee

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #58 - Feb 25^th, 2026 at 6:24pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 5:22pm:

the number one issue in politics today is the current generation of average-wage workers who are unable to afford housing, after prices relative to wages have quadrupled over the last 3 decades.

"Aussie Home Loans has examined tens of thousands of mortgage settlements between 2010 and 2024 and found that Australian homebuyers are increasingly saying “I do” to home ownership, with the number of home loans approved to unmarried couples having jumped by 80 per cent since 2015."

https://www.realestate.com.au/news/the-shocking-thing-aussie-buyers-are-going-wi...

Well that puts the lie to that. Wink

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 5:22pm:

buy established houses which doesn't increase housing supply

So why can't they build? it is generally cheaper, on all types of construction methods. Wink

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 5:22pm:

it's "productive" for investors' wealth but not renters, especially in Oz where housing as an asset has risen mauch faster than other assets.

But only on sale. Which is what you want. It still begs the question of "why can't they build"? Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 5:22pm:

And the government wants to decrease the cost the age pension, without retired people reduced to living in poverty due to unafforable rents.

And that's why super was brought in. Now of course some people don't want home ownership, they prefer to travel, so they are happy to rent. Of course later in life they may regret, but it is still a choice. Wink

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 5:22pm:

Australia's tax system is in a worse position than it was 15 years ago and young people are paying the price, former Treasury secretary Ken Henry has warned

And yet he had a hand in designing it, but Labor flubbed it.

"Rudd endorsed and implemented only three of the 138 recommendations."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Tax_Review

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 5:22pm:

Joining the other well-known economists already mentioned in this debate.

Ah yes. Well known economists. Wink

Steve Keen - "Should the wealthy get away with lower tax than workers. Shouldn't capital gains and income be taxed at the same rate. The answer isn't as straight forward as you might think."

https://profstevekeen.substack.com/p/should-the-wealthy-get-away-with

Or is your argument that he is not a "well known" economist? Wink

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Bobby.

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Re: Housing Now An Investors Playground
Reply #59 - Feb 26^th, 2026 at 6:48am

Jasin wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 4:44pm:

Bobby. wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:39pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 3:30pm:

lee wrote on Feb 25^th, 2026 at 12:52pm:

And I never said anything different. Cheaper build new house must lower the average price of new builds. Basic. So much for falling on its face. Roll Eyes

The issue is Oz's unaffordable housing, which tax-advantaged investors are treating as their playground.

As for buiding cheaper wooden houses: the cost of land is the primary driver of escalating housing costs in Australia, with residential land prices increasing by over 500% since 2000, far outpacing construction costs, ie building wooden houses won't stop investors hogging the housing market.

And along with Bernie Fraser and Alan Kohler - who have identified the greedy rent-seeking 'cartel' who are resisting changes to those those generous tax advantages,
also Ken Henry today: "Former Treasury chief Ken Henry says Australia's landlords are using the capital gains tax discount to avoid paying income tax"

https://thenightly.com.au/politics/landlords-using-capital-gains-tax-concessions...

It's time for government to eliminate the tax breaks incentivizing greedy tax-advantaged rent-seekers to buy more than one house, and for government to rebuild sufficient public housing to ensure housing for low income groups. Problem solved.

Then greedy rent seekers might have to invest in productive activity, instead of pushing up prices by competing with first home buyers.

I my younger days I used to rent -
I never met a good landlord once.

Is that because you were a bad tenant?

No - I always paid on time and looked after the place.

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