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What rights do you have? (Read 958 times)
MeisterEckhart
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #60 - Yesterday at 8:57am
 
chimera wrote Yesterday at 7:31am:
It's ironic that in the centre of US democracy, guns are banned in the Capitol.
In Oz parliament, speaking by spectators is forbidden and even taking notes is banned. 'Rights' is a wobbly word.

There are no absolute or inalienable rights.

That which is granted can be curbed, restricted or withdrawn.
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chimera
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #61 - Yesterday at 9:05am
 
The colony of 1788 began with no rights and they were gradually permitted by HM men. But land title can be lost by government resumption and conscription can force men into the army or be jailed. Just a signature will do it.
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #62 - Yesterday at 9:22am
 
chimera wrote Yesterday at 9:05am:
The colony of 1788 began with no rights and they were gradually permitted by HM men. But land title can be lost by government resumption and conscription can force men into the army or be jailed. Just a signature will do it.

Well, parliament is sovereign.

So-called freemen did not enter the colony without granted rights.

Arthur Phillip established the colony of NSW as a slave-free colony... "There can be no slavery in a free land, and consequently no slaves".

Of course, he didn't need the black kind; he had the white kind, deemed bonded into servitude by parliament.
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chimera
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #63 - Yesterday at 9:36am
 
Freemen were less free than in UK as the early governors did a yearly inspection of farms to ensure civic respectability. Convicts were assigned as slave labour.  Macquarie even flogged freemen for pinching his vegies.
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #64 - Yesterday at 9:51am
 
chimera wrote Yesterday at 9:36am:
Freemen were less free than in UK as the early governors did a yearly inspection of farms to ensure civic respectability. Convicts were assigned as slave labour.  Macquarie even flogged freemen for pinching his vegies.

Any harsh dealings by Phillip were not arbitrary or gratuitous on his part.

As had happened with the first English colonists in America over 150 years earlier, Parliament had grossly overestimated the land's capacity to support a colony of Europeans.

Phillip was granted the powers to govern the colony, enacting and enforcing whatever laws he deemed necessary to ensure the colony's survival.

In its first few years, the colony of NSW was more like a blueprint for 'Lord of the Flies' than the idyll that the likes of Sir Joseph Banks had envisoned and advised 20 years earlier.
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chimera
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #65 - Yesterday at 10:01am
 
Rabbit thieves were wrong until extensive "rabbit-proof" fencing (built 1901-1907), trapping, poisoning, and hunting. Rabbiting then was right.
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #66 - Yesterday at 10:19am
 
chimera wrote Yesterday at 10:01am:
Rabbit thieves were wrong until extensive "rabbit-proof" fencing (built 1901-1907), trapping, poisoning, and hunting. Rabbiting then was right.

Rabbit hunting in Australia was right from the get-go, 1859.
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chimera
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #67 - Yesterday at 10:29am
 
This was government rabbiting. 'Built by the WA Government it consisted fences spanning over 3,200 km.
In 1907, a staff of 35, including 25 "fence runners" and camel drivers, were employed to maintain the fences.'

There were fines for immigrant rabbits ('illegals') which can be $250,000 today or shooting.
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freediver
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #68 - Today at 2:52pm
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 8th, 2026 at 8:41am:
Rights are neither theory nor reality... they are assertions of principles that often run counter to theory and reality.

They can contradict, agree with both, or agree with neither.


Meister if rights do not exist in reality, how can you tell whether reality conflicts with the paperwork?

Is this question impossible for you answer: what rights do you have in reality?

How do you even talk about the rights that exist in reality if you insist on defining them out of existence? Have you invented an alternative lexicon to use when talking about reality, or do you simply refuse to acknowledge reality? I guess, based on your elaborate tapdancing, it is the latter.

Quote:
You ask questions like a child...

Define the reality whereby...


Are you seriously asking me to define reality for you? Have you never come across it before?
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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chimera
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #69 - Today at 3:21pm
 
My set square is just off a right angle but I still believe in 90 degrees. My spirit level also is slightly off but parliaments may one day give a true outcome. Right?
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thegreatdivide
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #70 - Today at 3:22pm
 
freediver wrote on Feb 8th, 2026 at 7:54am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 7th, 2026 at 9:26pm:
Rights are permissions to do, or protections against impositions.

They require an acknowledged authority to grant a right; an authority that commits to protecting those rights from those who would confront you when you exercise that right or impose on you where they must not.

In the myth of a state's right to exist, the myth's grantor, if not a nation-state, is usually a metaphysical being, as is the case with Israel.

That someone confronts you exercising that right is not an indication that the right doesn't exist.



Do you believe that you have the right to do something....


"Do something"?

Surely depends on what you are considering doing......


Quote:
...even if the consistent and predictable" result.....


Who says it will be "consistent and predictable?  You?

Quote:
...is someone trying to kill you - because pieces of paper trump reality?


Yes,  INDIVIDUAL human  behaviour (or individual nations led by psycopaths) can trump morality as delineated in the UN UDHR.
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freediver
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #71 - Today at 3:30pm
 
Quote:
"Do something"?

Surely depends on what you are considering doing......


Have you ever noticed that when you chop a sentence in half, you change the meaning, and get yourself all confused?
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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chimera
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #72 - Today at 3:54pm
 
'Some of the oldest cold case murders solved by police, largely through advancements in DNA, genetic genealogy, and fingerprint technology, date back over 50–60 years.'

A 58 year old murder was pinned onto the crim. They are still working on Tutankhamun of 1324 BC.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #73 - Today at 4:05pm
 
freediver wrote Today at 3:30pm:
Quote:
"Do something"?

Surely depends on what you are considering doing......


Have you ever noticed that when you chop a sentence in half, you change the meaning, and get yourself all confused?


Thanks for the chuckle....

Have you ever noticed how you attempt to prove your case, by stringing several individually-contestable ideas together?
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chimera
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Re: What rights do you have?
Reply #74 - Today at 4:21pm
 
Rights come in a variety:
right off it
half-right
righteo
alright
dead right
hard right
right? right? (with increasing belligerence)
and so on

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