Australian Politics Forum - How One Tax Break Keeps Australia Unequal

thegreatdivide

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Re: How One Tax Break Keeps Australia Unequal
Reply #15 - Today at 1:53pm

lee wrote Today at 12:45pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 25^th, 2026 at 10:48am:

McKim correctly implied it's easier for people who already have sufficient equity in housing to buy another house, than for a first home buyer, in the current overpriced housing market, given NG (which The Greens also rightly condemn) and CGT discount rate which encourages investment in housing.

So the CGT discount, which operates when a property is sold, has nothing to do with having enough equity. That equity must be positive, their income must be positive to pay the loan, and not rely solely on rental income. Roll Eyes

Er....you are ignoring the fact equity of those already fortunate enough to have owned (or be buying) a house has increased remarkably over the last three
decades, courtesy of rising house prices during that period, outstripping average wages by a wide margin.

Hence the current intergenerational inequity which NG and CGT discount are making worse; indeed its easier for asset-rich rent-seekers to buy a 5th house, than for average wage earners who are not asset rich.

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: How One Tax Break Keeps Australia Unequal
Reply #16 - Today at 1:55pm

Labor is tackling generational inequality - they are making great strides at a a rapid pace in completing the restoration of neo-Fuedalism and the utter subjugation of the'masses'.

Every Single Policy Thrust is working towards that end....

It is not only the Parties that are the direct cause of this with their mass imigration, tax cuts and concessions every which way for 'investors' - the banks are complicit as well due to their lending policies and the travesty of somehow seeing 'equity' in a property just purchased ... REAL equity does not develop until such time as the market has actually given that property a rise in true value - what the banks are doing for investors - killing off the hope of a home for families and reducing Australia to an overwhelmingly renting group like some poor country - is viewing 'equity' as the FUTURE POSSIBLE RISE in value of that property.

It is frankly insane and a roller coaster runaway train that the banks and the governments have now tied themselves to and cannot let go of the tiger's tail ...... if they do collapse is the only future they have.

THAT is why they are enforcing mass immigration to keep their balls rolling (and they should be rolling on the scaffold) and are retaining the ludicrous policy idea that 'investment provides housing' when it clearly does not ... and still giving concession after concession to investors over home owners, who get nothing but bills.

A home owner doesn't get the cost of maintenance and upkeep and renos and interest etc off his tax - like everything else - Joe and Jo Bloggs pay for it all, and that is so wrong and clearly unbalanced in that it gives to one 'legal entity' one set of rules and to another a completely different set of rules.

Abolish concessions for property investment NOW!

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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thegreatdivide

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Re: How One Tax Break Keeps Australia Unequal
Reply #17 - Today at 2:30pm

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote Today at 1:55pm:

Labor is tackling generational inequality - they are making great strides at a a rapid pace in completing the restoration of neo-Fuedalism and the utter subjugation of the'masses'.

Labor isn't tackling intergenerational inequality, but at least Labor has legislated higher wages for low income workers, and made the stage-3 tax cuts more progressive (ie benefitting lower income groups).

Quote:

Every Single Policy Thrust is working towards that end....

But you refuse to acknowledge the Conservatives would increase inequity, with their usual 'don't tax the rich' taxation policies.

Quote:

It is not only the Parties that are the direct cause of this with their mass imigration, tax cuts and concessions every which way for 'investors'

Wow - a correct statement from you, let's see how far you can go before getting lost in 'sovereign citizen'/personal responsibility ideology...

Quote:

- the banks are complicit as well due to their lending policies and the travesty of somehow seeing 'equity' in a property just purchased ... REAL equity does not develop until such time as the market has actually given that property a rise in true value - what the banks are doing for investors - killing off the hope of a home for families and reducing Australia to an overwhelmingly renting group like some poor country - is viewing 'equity' as the FUTURE POSSIBLE RISE in value of that property.

Cor blimey, you are STILL analyzing the situation correctly...given goverments are committed to ever-rising house prices, to ensure house owners and mortgagees - 60% of the population - are able to maintain positive equity.

Quote:

It is frankly insane and a roller coaster runaway train that the banks and the governments have now tied themselves to and cannot let go of the tiger's tail ...... if they do collapse is the only future they have.

Yep.

Quote:

THAT is why they are enforcing mass immigration to keep their balls rolling (and they should be rolling on the scaffold) and are retaining the ludicrous policy idea that 'investment provides housing' when it clearly does not ... and still giving concession after concession to investors over home owners, who get nothing but bills.

Yep.

Quote:

A home owner doesn't get the cost of maintenance and upkeep and renos and interest etc off his tax - like everything else - Joe and Jo Bloggs pay for it all, and that is so wrong and clearly unbalanced in that it gives to one 'legal entity' one set of rules and to another a completely different set of rules.

Abolish concessions for property investment NOW!

Well blow me down, you managed it all the way to the end without error.

Well done.

But given the current overpriced housing market, what is your proposal to ensure housing for everyone in Oz, as Menzies achieved even in the high-immigration post-WW2 era?

(Hint: he presided over a period of large-scale public housing...courtesy of Keynesian deficit spending).

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« Last Edit: Today at 2:35pm by thegreatdivide »

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lee

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Re: How One Tax Break Keeps Australia Unequal
Reply #18 - Today at 3:31pm

thegreatdivide wrote Today at 1:53pm:

Er....you are ignoring the fact equity of those already fortunate enough to have owned (or be buying) a house has increased remarkably over the last three
decades, courtesy of rising house prices during that period, outstripping average wages by a wide margin.

No. You expected prices to go down, long-term? And nothing to do with CGT discount.

thegreatdivide wrote Today at 1:53pm:

Hence the current intergenerational inequity which NG and CGT discount are making worse; indeed its easier for asset-rich rent-seekers to buy a 5th house, than for average wage earners who are not asset rich.

You haven't even made a case for the effect of CGT. Roll Eyes

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thegreatdivide

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Re: How One Tax Break Keeps Australia Unequal
Reply #19 - Today at 4:42pm

lee wrote Today at 3:31pm:

thegreatdivide wrote Today at 1:53pm:

Er....you are ignoring the fact equity of those already fortunate enough to have owned (or be buying) a house has increased remarkably over the last three
decades, courtesy of rising house prices during that period, outstripping average wages by a wide margin.

No. You expected prices to go down, long-term?

Are you asking me a question?

The answer is no, it's obvious prices will only go down enough to make houses affordable for first-home buyers on average wages, either in a general economic crisis (like the GFC...but then unemployment will decapitate first home buyers), or if government rebuilds public housing, while discouraging high-equity, rent-seeking investors to buy multiple houses by removing NG and CGT discounts.

Quote:

And nothing to do with CGT discount.

That's not what bank lenders who want to lend as much money as possible think, they see the CGT discount as added insurance on the loan if the borrower has to sell a property.

Quote:

You haven't even made a case for the effect of CGT. Roll Eyes

See above; and meanwhile you are too incompetent to offer ANY polcies to solve the current housing crisis.

Looks like we will have to wait for some suggestions from grappler......

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Leroy

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Re: How One Tax Break Keeps Australia Unequal
Reply #20 - Today at 5:03pm

thegreatdivide wrote Today at 4:42pm:

lee wrote Today at 3:31pm:

thegreatdivide wrote Today at 1:53pm:

Er....you are ignoring the fact equity of those already fortunate enough to have owned (or be buying) a house has increased remarkably over the last three
decades, courtesy of rising house prices during that period, outstripping average wages by a wide margin.

No. You expected prices to go down, long-term?

Are you asking me a question?

The answer is no, it's obvious prices will only go down enough to make houses affordable for first-home buyers on average wages, either in a general economic crisis (like the GFC...but then unemployment will decapitate first home buyers), or if government rebuilds public housing, while discouraging high-equity, rent-seeking investors to buy multiple houses by removing NG and CGT discounts.

Quote:

And nothing to do with CGT discount.

That's not what bank lenders who want to lend as much money as possible think, they see the CGT discount as added insurance on the loan if the borrower has to sell a property.

Quote:

You haven't even made a case for the effect of CGT. Roll Eyes

See above; and meanwhile you are too incompetent to offer ANY polcies to solve the current housing crisis.

Looks like we will have to wait for some suggestions from grappler......

Banks do not, I REPEAT DO NOT take the CGT in to consideration for anything to do with the value of a home or acceptance of a loan. I don't know where you got that from but someone has given you false information.

The other important thing you are overlooking is that the cheapest way to buy a home is to build your own, taking the investor out of the market will not I REPEAT WILL NOT reduce the cost of housing in any way. It will cost the same to build a house if not more by taking out the investors.

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: How One Tax Break Keeps Australia Unequal
Reply #21 - Today at 5:24pm

Incredible evasion down there about how people cannot get into the market... maybe this will put a little chili on your posterior:-

https://www.msn.com/en-au/money/markets/great-aussie-home-ownership-dream-aging-...

Great Aussie home ownership dream aging as banks see more first-time buyers above 40

Despite saving for the best part of seven years, Maddy has given up on the prospect of buying a home in Australia.

The healthcare worker from Melbourne, who has asked to only share her first name, went to 70 inspections last year, and made three offers, only for the homes to sell for more than $100,000 above asking price.

"Even with a really healthy deposit, because the prices have increased so substantially so quickly, to put myself in that level of debt, I'd have to borrow, I guess the maximum that I'm allowed."

The average age to purchase your first home has risen as salaries struggle to keep up with soaring house prices — statistics compiled by the Australian Institute of Health and Welfare show a lower portion of young people owning homes.

Maddy, who is 30-years-old, told the ABC she isn't comfortable with taking out that amount of debt to service a mortgage, and has made the decision to instead move overseas in the coming years to start a family."

.... more.. read for yourself lazy-bones....

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Leroy

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Re: How One Tax Break Keeps Australia Unequal
Reply #22 - Today at 5:47pm

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote Today at 5:24pm:

Incredible evasion down there about how people cannot get into the market... maybe this will put a little chili on your posterior:-

https://www.msn.com/en-au/money/markets/great-aussie-home-ownership-dream-aging-...

Great Aussie home ownership dream aging as banks see more first-time buyers above 40

Despite saving for the best part of seven years, Maddy has given up on the prospect of buying a home in Australia.

The healthcare worker from Melbourne, who has asked to only share her first name, went to 70 inspections last year, and made three offers, only for the homes to sell for more than $100,000 above asking price.

"Even with a really healthy deposit, because the prices have increased so substantially so quickly, to put myself in that level of debt, I'd have to borrow, I guess the maximum that I'm allowed."

The average age to purchase your first home has risen as salaries struggle to keep up with soaring house prices — statistics compiled by the Australian Institute of Health and Welfare show a lower portion of young people owning homes.

Maddy, who is 30-years-old, told the ABC she isn't comfortable with taking out that amount of debt to service a mortgage, and has made the decision to instead move overseas in the coming years to start a family."

.... more.. read for yourself lazy-bones....

Yeah I don't know how that sits with most Australians, she is thirty and can't buy a home in the most expensive part of the most expensive city so she is going to move overseas.

Don't think that resonates with most young Australians. A bit of a beat up story to make news out of nothing.

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lee

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Re: How One Tax Break Keeps Australia Unequal
Reply #23 - Today at 7:26pm

thegreatdivide wrote Today at 4:42pm:

The answer is no, it's obvious prices will only go down enough to make houses affordable for first-home buyers on average wages, either in a general economic crisis (like the GFC...but then unemployment will decapitate first home buyers), or if government rebuilds public housing, while discouraging high-equity, rent-seeking investors to buy multiple houses by removing NG and CGT discounts.

Tradies are the workers that build the houses. Are you now saying they should not charge their going rate? Doesn't that make them third class citizens?

thegreatdivide wrote Today at 4:42pm:

That's not what bank lenders who want to lend as much money as possible think, they see the CGT discount as added insurance on the loan if the borrower has to sell a property.

Nope. you have your hand in your shorts as usual. Banks look at a person's tax return. There is not CGT in that, unless they have sold something. Banks prudently look at capacity to pay. A future mortgagee sale based on any supposed CGT discount would be disastrous. Roll Eyes

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