Australian Politics Forum - What is international law?

freediver

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #30 - Jan 11^th, 2026 at 1:45pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 10^th, 2026 at 2:16pm:

freediver wrote on Jan 10^th, 2026 at 12:01pm:

Quote:

Ok, fair point....but in fact the UN represents the COMMUNITY of nations; spot the difference?

The community of nations is still made up of specific nations, most of which are dictatorships that slaughter their own citizens and look to the UN to legitimise that mass murder.

Erroneous narrative as usual, blaming the UN for not enforcing international law which is informed by the principles of the UNUDHR.

Quote:

Like the CCP for example. Like you spineless apologetics for future mass murders by the CCP that you want them to commit.

Like I said, repeating that nonsense doen't make it true; China is tolerating the status quo in Taiwan, so long as the DPP backed by the US doesn't declare independence.

And if they did, what then? War?

This is why you are a two-faced hypocrite when you declare that the CCP wants peace. What they want is an easy victory, because they are a bunch of cowards. They ran and hid when the Japanese invaded and watched them rape and pillage their way across China. But they will kill millions if they can get away with it. They are up to about 100 million so far.

Why do you think that simply telling the truth - that Taiwan is indeed an independent nation from China - justifies the CCP going on another mindless killing rampage? And how do you make the mental leap from that to the CCP seeking peace?

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« Last Edit: Jan 11^th, 2026 at 3:10pm by freediver »

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thegreatdivide

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #31 - Jan 11^th, 2026 at 4:21pm

freediver wrote on Jan 11^th, 2026 at 1:45pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 10^th, 2026 at 2:16pm:

freediver wrote on Jan 10^th, 2026 at 12:01pm:

Quote:

Ok, fair point....but in fact the UN represents the COMMUNITY of nations; spot the difference?

The community of nations is still made up of specific nations, most of which are dictatorships that slaughter their own citizens and look to the UN to legitimise that mass murder.

Erroneous narrative as usual, blaming the UN for not enforcing international law which is informed by the principles of the UNUDHR.

Quote:

Like the CCP for example. Like you spineless apologetics for future mass murders by the CCP that you want them to commit.

Like I said, repeating that nonsense doen't make it true; China is tolerating the status quo in Taiwan, so long as the DPP backed by the US doesn't declare independence.

And if they did, what then? War?

You missed the point: the opposition KMT (a majority in Taiwan's parliament) would not support a war backed by the DPP and the US.

Quote:

This is why you are a two-faced hypocrite when you declare that the CCP wants peace.

Your error: the CCP wants peace AND sovereignty over Chinese territory.

Quote:

What they want is an easy victory, because they are a bunch of cowards.

No, the CCP wants to avoid another civil war with compatriots on the island.

As for 'armchair warriors' on the other side of the world, like yourself, talk of 'cowardice' is moot....

Quote:

They ran and hid when the Japanese invaded and watched them rape and pillage their way across China. But they will kill millions if they can get away with it. They are up to about 100 million so far.

Your error: China is no longer the weak, demoralized nation it was in the first half of the 20th century.

Quote:

Why do you think that simply telling the truth - that Taiwan is indeed an independent nation from China - justifies the CCP going on another mindless killing rampage?

1. The UN and most members support UN res 2758, and the 'One China ' principle.

2. Seeking national unity isn't mindless.

Quote:

And how do you make the mental leap from that to the CCP seeking peace?

Explained above.
........

This is a thread about 'international law'; perhaps it would be useful to consider how far concepts such as friendly competition between nations, instead of ideological conflict, might inform UN debates.

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freediver

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #32 - Jan 11^th, 2026 at 4:25pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 11^th, 2026 at 4:21pm:

freediver wrote on Jan 11^th, 2026 at 1:45pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 10^th, 2026 at 2:16pm:

freediver wrote on Jan 10^th, 2026 at 12:01pm:

Quote:

Ok, fair point....but in fact the UN represents the COMMUNITY of nations; spot the difference?

The community of nations is still made up of specific nations, most of which are dictatorships that slaughter their own citizens and look to the UN to legitimise that mass murder.

Erroneous narrative as usual, blaming the UN for not enforcing international law which is informed by the principles of the UNUDHR.

Quote:

Like the CCP for example. Like you spineless apologetics for future mass murders by the CCP that you want them to commit.

Like I said, repeating that nonsense doen't make it true; China is tolerating the status quo in Taiwan, so long as the DPP backed by the US doesn't declare independence.

And if they did, what then? War?

You missed the point: the opposition KMT (a majority in Taiwan's parliament) would not support a war backed by the DPP and the US.

The point is that the CCP are two-faced hypocrits. They, like you, say they want peace, but in the same breath threaten Taiwan with war for acknowledging the simple and obvious reality that Taiwan is a separate, independent country to China.

Also, they are already responsible for killing about 100 million Chinese people. Don't you think it's time they stopped?

This is the danger of international law in the hands of morons, cowards and dictators like the CCP.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #33 - Jan 11^th, 2026 at 5:44pm

freediver wrote on Jan 11^th, 2026 at 4:25pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 11^th, 2026 at 4:21pm:

freediver wrote on Jan 11^th, 2026 at 1:45pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 10^th, 2026 at 2:16pm:

freediver wrote on Jan 10^th, 2026 at 12:01pm:

Quote:

Ok, fair point....but in fact the UN represents the COMMUNITY of nations; spot the difference?

The community of nations is still made up of specific nations, most of which are dictatorships that slaughter their own citizens and look to the UN to legitimise that mass murder.

Erroneous narrative as usual, blaming the UN for not enforcing international law which is informed by the principles of the UNUDHR.

Quote:

Like the CCP for example. Like you spineless apologetics for future mass murders by the CCP that you want them to commit.

Like I said, repeating that nonsense doen't make it true; China is tolerating the status quo in Taiwan, so long as the DPP backed by the US doesn't declare independence.

And if they did, what then? War?

You missed the point: the opposition KMT (a majority in Taiwan's parliament) would not support a war backed by the DPP and the US.

The point is that the CCP are two-faced hypocrits.

No: the CCP combines the ideologies of the KMT and the DPP, unlike blind leading the blind adversarial 2-party democracies

Quote:

They, like you, say they want peace, but in the same breath threaten Taiwan with war for acknowledging the simple and obvious reality that Taiwan is a separate, independent country to China.

Your delusions render you incapable of grasping reality: the UN recognizes the 'One China' principle.

Quote:

Also, they are already responsible for killing about 100 million Chinese people. Don't you think it's time they stopped?

Given I now understand the depth of your delusions, and inability/refusal to defend them in a debate about individual versus universal rights, I will let that statement regarding Chinese history before the 'opening up' stand; life is too short to argue every point which a deluded person might come up with.

Quote:

This is the danger of international law in the hands of morons, cowards and dictators like the CCP.

Your error: international law involves defending the principles set out in the UNUDHR.

The CCP, seeking to establish 'common prosperity' in the nation before 2049 (the centenary of CCP government) is closer to achieving those principles than your 'survival of the fittest' capitalist free-market economies which tolerate entrenched economic disadvantage.

Regardless of Taiwan - a sovereignty issue - why are you incapable of accepting a friendly competition with China?

The Chinese people themselves are more satisfied with their government than most democracies enjoy.

You know the chaos of stop-go adversarial 2-party democracies will lose, in a friendly competition?

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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 116459 Melbourne Gender:	Re: What is international law? Reply #34 - Jan 11^th, 2026 at 6:07pm TGD, Quote: The Chinese people themselves are more satisfied with their government than most democracies enjoy. You know the chaos of stop-go adversarial 2-party democracies will lose, in a friendly competition? TGD, are you now or have you ever been a member of the communist party?
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freediver

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #35 - Jan 11^th, 2026 at 6:22pm

Quote:

Your delusions render you incapable of grasping reality: the UN recognizes the 'One China' principle.

No it doesn't. Any more than I do when I use the word China. That is, after all, your logic - they uttered the word China, therefor they support CCP slaughtering Taiwanese.

Were you trying to contradict anything I actually said? Sometimes I am not sure why you bother quoting when you post these off-topic respoonses. Here it is again: The point is that the CCP are two-faced hypocrits. They, like you, say they want peace, but in the same breath threaten Taiwan with war for acknowledging the simple and obvious reality that Taiwan is a separate, independent country to China.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #36 - Jan 12^th, 2026 at 10:10am

freediver wrote on Jan 11^th, 2026 at 6:22pm:

Quote:

Your delusions render you incapable of grasping reality: the UN recognizes the 'One China' principle.

No it doesn't. Any more than I do when I use the word China. That is, after all, your logic - they uttered the word China, therefor they support CCP slaughtering Taiwanese.

The reality: every leader who visits Beijing confirms the one China principle, the most recent example being South Korea's president Lee.

Do try to keep up.

Quote:

Were you trying to contradict anything I actually said?

Too funny coming from you: you ran away when your contradiction between struggling workers and struggling consumers was pointed out to you (in the 'price of a cuppa' thread); and now you are conflating debate with contradiction.

Quote:

Sometimes I am not sure why you bother quoting when you post these off-topic respoonses.

I bother because I'm using you to educate people who read these posts.

Today I realized you are like Iran's deluded leaders who are claiming the protestors in Iran are 'enemies of God'; the leaders genuinely believe the message of the Koran requires conversion of the world to Islam.

And likewise you claim an economy based on Western 'individual freedom' principles is the only possible desirable system, and must be entrenched around the whole world; note the CCP has repeatedly said they are not interested in exporting 'socialism' to any country.

That's why I want you to cease your delusional 'China threat' nonsense; the Chinese people are now quite capable of looking after themselves - while not threatening anyone other than delusional DPP ideolgues who want to tear the nation apart.

Re your passion re Taiwan: you insist the islanders must be free to decide to secede from the Motherland because some of them are likewise delduded by 'individual freedom/rights' ideology.

Saw the final of Ken Burns' 'The American Revolution" last night; the concluding words were "the revolution to create good government on earth is still ongoing"...no kidding - the tension between individual freedom and the need for for good governance and common prosperity aka the general welfare (mentioned in the preamble to the US Constitution) is exploding in the US as we speak.

Quote:

Here it is again: The point is that the CCP are two-faced hypocrits. They, like you, say they want peace, but in the same breath threaten Taiwan with war for acknowledging the simple and obvious reality that Taiwan is a separate, independent country to China.

Already addressed; it's time you examined your delusions re 'individual freedom' and the baleful consequences for good governance.

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freediver

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #37 - Jan 12^th, 2026 at 10:13am

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 12^th, 2026 at 10:10am:

[
Quote:

Here it is again: The point is that the CCP are two-faced hypocrits. They, like you, say they want peace, but in the same breath threaten Taiwan with war for acknowledging the simple and obvious reality that Taiwan is a separate, independent country to China.

Already addressed; it's time you examined your delusions re 'individual freedom' and the baleful consequences for good governance.

Do you consider killing 100 million Chinese people to be good governance?

If the Taiwanese dared to utter the simple truth - that they are a separate, independent nation from China - would you be prepared to kill them yourself?

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thegreatdivide

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #38 - Jan 12^th, 2026 at 10:48am

freediver wrote on Jan 12^th, 2026 at 10:13am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 12^th, 2026 at 10:10am:

[
Quote:

Here it is again: The point is that the CCP are two-faced hypocrits. They, like you, say they want peace, but in the same breath threaten Taiwan with war for acknowledging the simple and obvious reality that Taiwan is a separate, independent country to China.

Already addressed; it's time you examined your delusions re 'individual freedom' and the baleful consequences for good governance.

Do you consider killing 100 million Chinese people to be good governance?

Of course not: I'm interested in the Chinese miracle (according to the World Bank) achieved since 1990.

Naturally you ignored the rest of my post - a speciality of yours, owing to your intellectual incompetence resulting from blind 'individual freedom' ideology.

But I don't expect you to acknowledge it: you are the delusional fellow who claimed (a year or so ago) there isn't a (cost of) housing crisis in Oz.

Quote:

If the Taiwanese dared to utter the simple truth - that they are a separate, independent nation from China - would you be prepared to kill them yourself?

Of course not, unlike you I love life.

Nor would I support Oz resources defending delusional losers.

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freediver

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #39 - Jan 12^th, 2026 at 10:56am

Quote:

Of course not: I'm interested in the Chinese miracle (according to the World Bank) achieved since 1990.

It's a miracle that they came to their senses. Copying what everyone else had already done isn't something special but. And they had plenty of examples to copy. Furthermore, the median Chinese salary is still less than half of our unemployment benefits. All the CCP had to do was get out of the people's way and let them work. Foreign companies were lining up to take advantage of the cheap labour.

Do you consider the CCP's handling of covid to be good governance?

Quote:

Of course not, unlike you I love life.

But you would support the killing if the Taiwanese spoke the simple truth?

That does not say you love life. Merely that you don't like getting your own hands dirty.

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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 116459 Melbourne Gender:	Re: What is international law? Reply #40 - Jan 12^th, 2026 at 11:01am Dear TGD, are you a 5th column Chinese stooge?
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thegreatdivide

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #41 - Jan 12^th, 2026 at 11:36am

freediver wrote on Jan 12^th, 2026 at 10:56am:

Quote:

Of course not: I'm interested in the Chinese miracle (according to the World Bank) achieved since 1990.

It's a miracle that they came to their senses.

Your error: the miracle the WB referred to is lifting more people out of poverty, faster than any nation in history.

Quote:

Copying what everyone else had already done isn't something special but. And they had plenty of examples to copy.

Indeed; and some of the examples eg private sector real estate 'get rich quick' booms and busts have been a disaster in China as well.

Quote:

Furthermore, the median Chinese salary is still less than half of our unemployment benefits.

(google)

Less than half?

China's GDP per capita (PPP) varies slightly by source and year, but recent estimates for 2024-2026 hover around $23,800 - $31,000 USD, with figures like $23,846 (2024, TheGlobalEconomy), $27,105 (2024, World Bank), and projected $31,023 (2026, Wikipedia) indicating strong purchasing power parity compared to nominal figures, reflecting lower price levels in China.

Oz job seeker allowance c. $20,000 a year - below the poverty line, in Oz's high- cost economy.

Quote:

All the CCP had to do was get out of the people's way and let them work. Foreign companies were lining up to take advantage of the cheap labour.

Your error: the CCP is seeking common prosperity for its citizens, not Western- style cost of living calamities for low wage earners.

Quote:

Do you consider the CCP's handling of covid to be good governance?

Not entirely; but a developing nation with a large population had to face more severe challenges than developed nations with more established availablity of health care.

Quote:

But you would support the killing if the Taiwanese spoke the simple truth?

I would rather Xi continue to follow the principles set out in the 'Art of War' (a Chinese classic) ie, how to win without firing a shot; and what you refer to as "the simple truth" demonstrably violates the One China policy - just ask the new South Korean president (not the previous RW goon....)

Quote:

That does not say you love life. Merely that you don't like getting your own hands dirty.

Hey, I've often had to 'get my own hands dirty' (in honest work) while seeking to support myself.

Don't be squeamish, you armchair warrior: be more specific about what it is I don't like.

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freediver

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #42 - Jan 12^th, 2026 at 11:45am

Quote:

Your error: the miracle the WB referred to is lifting more people out of poverty, faster than any nation in history.

Easy to do. Simply refrain from starving them to death with idiotic policies as the CCP had been doing.

Quote:

Less than half?

Yes. Read the rest of it. Did you fail statistics?

Quote:

Not entirely

LOL. How many Chinese people died between the initial outbreak of covid and when the CCP stopped jailing journalists for trying to warn people about it?

Quote:

I would rather Xi continue to follow the principles set out in the 'Art of War' (a Chinese classic) ie, how to win without firing a shot; and what you refer to as "the simple truth" demonstrably violates the One China policy

Correct. The One China Policy does not reflect reality.

You are being evasive. Would you, or would you not, support the CCP killing yet more people, if that is what was needed to stop the Taiwanese from speaking the truth - that Taiwan is a separate and independent country from China?

Quote:

Hey, I've often had to 'get my own hands dirty' (in honest work) while seeking to support myself.

You also offer spineless apologetics and weasel words for mas slaughter of your fellow human beings. You have elevated the "one china policy" to a religion, on the altar of which you would sacrifice the truth, peace and the lives of your fellow human beings.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #43 - Jan 12^th, 2026 at 11:49am

Bobby. wrote on Jan 12^th, 2026 at 11:01am:

Dear TGD,
are you a 5th column Chinese stooge?

No, but notice how fd consistently ignores the majority of debating points in each of my posts, whereas I dutifully reply to his posts in full.

At the basis of this debate is the tension between individual liberty based on self-interest, and collective well-being or 'the general welfare' noted in the preamble to the US Constitutiton....have a look at the current riots in the US as Trump cruelly seeks to round up long-time residents of the US.

Do you have anything intelligent to say?

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Frank

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Re: What is international law?
Reply #44 - Jan 12^th, 2026 at 11:58am

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 12^th, 2026 at 11:49am:

Bobby. wrote on Jan 12^th, 2026 at 11:01am:

Dear TGD,
are you a 5th column Chinese stooge?

No, but notice how fd consistently ignores the majority of debating points in each of my posts, whereas I dutifully reply to his posts in full.

At the basis of this debate is the tension between individual liberty based on self-interest, and collective well-being or 'the general welfare' noted in the preamble to the US Constitutiton....have a look at the current riots in the US as Trump cruelly seeks to round up long-time residents of the US.

Do you have anything intelligent to say?

You are lying as fluently as skunk piggy, sadroo and the rest of the deranged mob.

Are they being rounded up for being "long-time residents of the US"?? No. They are rounded up because there is a warrant for their arrests.

Why do you mongs distort everything, lie about everything, misreresent everything?
Because you are congenitally dishonest in the service of your deranged ideology.

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