Australian Politics Forum - Trump really is deranged

Bobby.

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #15 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:46am

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:41am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:40am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:37am:

Russia signed the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances signed in 1994 that was supposed to ensure Ukraine's sovereignty, but Russia has not upheld their end of the deal and has invaded Ukraine twice since then. Only a fool would think Putin would uphold Trump's plan because it gives Russia everything they wanted and tells them that their aggression works. If for no other reason, this is the one reason that Zelensky cannot accept the plan put forth by Trump.

True but how many more millions of Ukrainians will die to prove that point?

Hopefully Putin falls out of a window soon.

To be replaced by another one of his henchmen?

Russians are natural crooks -
they have only ever had crooks running their country.
They could have been the world's only super power but
now their economy is smaller than Italy's. Roll Eyes

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Armchair_Politician

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #16 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:46am

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:41am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:40am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:37am:

Russia signed the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances signed in 1994 that was supposed to ensure Ukraine's sovereignty, but Russia has not upheld their end of the deal and has invaded Ukraine twice since then. Only a fool would think Putin would uphold Trump's plan because it gives Russia everything they wanted and tells them that their aggression works. If for no other reason, this is the one reason that Zelensky cannot accept the plan put forth by Trump.

True but how many more millions of Ukrainians will die to prove that point?

Hopefully Putin falls out of a window soon.

Yes, "falls"...

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #17 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:49am

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:46am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:41am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:40am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:37am:

Russia signed the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances signed in 1994 that was supposed to ensure Ukraine's sovereignty, but Russia has not upheld their end of the deal and has invaded Ukraine twice since then. Only a fool would think Putin would uphold Trump's plan because it gives Russia everything they wanted and tells them that their aggression works. If for no other reason, this is the one reason that Zelensky cannot accept the plan put forth by Trump.

True but how many more millions of Ukrainians will die to prove that point?

Hopefully Putin falls out of a window soon.

To be replaced by another one of his henchmen?

His henchmen won't continue the war.

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Armchair_Politician

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #18 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 12:22pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:49am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:46am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:41am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:40am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:37am:

Russia signed the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances signed in 1994 that was supposed to ensure Ukraine's sovereignty, but Russia has not upheld their end of the deal and has invaded Ukraine twice since then. Only a fool would think Putin would uphold Trump's plan because it gives Russia everything they wanted and tells them that their aggression works. If for no other reason, this is the one reason that Zelensky cannot accept the plan put forth by Trump.

True but how many more millions of Ukrainians will die to prove that point?

Hopefully Putin falls out of a window soon.

To be replaced by another one of his henchmen?

His henchmen won't continue the war.

I think the rich oligarchs have had enough of Putin's war and want their money and boats and planes back and would pressure whoever took over from Putin to end the war quickly.

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Bobby.

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #19 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 1:06pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:49am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:46am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:41am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:40am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:37am:

Russia signed the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances signed in 1994 that was supposed to ensure Ukraine's sovereignty, but Russia has not upheld their end of the deal and has invaded Ukraine twice since then. Only a fool would think Putin would uphold Trump's plan because it gives Russia everything they wanted and tells them that their aggression works. If for no other reason, this is the one reason that Zelensky cannot accept the plan put forth by Trump.

True but how many more millions of Ukrainians will die to prove that point?

Hopefully Putin falls out of a window soon.

To be replaced by another one of his henchmen?

His henchmen won't continue the war.

They will -

Many Ukrainians got out of Ukraine and many more were conscripted against their will
to fight and die when the final result is a surrender by Ukraine -
which is all the 28 point plan is.
The Russians get everything they wanted and a weakened Ukraine
which will be far easier to invade fully in 2 years time.

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Karnal

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #20 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 1:52pm

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:46am:

John Smith wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:43am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:37am:

My bet is that there would have been far more Ukrainians alive today
if Ukraine would have surrendered in 2022.

No, they'd be Russian by now if they had surrendered

Zelensky had more bargaining power in 2022 -

he could have told NATO -
you either come in here and defend Ukraine with massive air power and your own troops
or you'll face the massive Russian army anyway - after they take Ukraine.

Oh? So how do you get to this - after posting this?

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:37am:

My bet is that there would have been far more Ukrainians alive today
if Ukraine would have surrendered in 2022.
Ukraine was set up by the USA and the Europeans to shed their blood
when in fact there was no real commitment to help them -
just supply enough weapons to keep the war in a permanent stalemate
and bleed both the Ukrainians and Russians slowly for years -
except that the combined losses are over 1,000 dead per day
if you add up Ukrainian and Russian losses.

Trump has basically forced Ukraine into a surrender anyway -
the 28 point plan is close to an unconditional surrender and
none of the so called guarantees of security will ever be placed into law
in the USA or any NATO country -
they are not worth the paper they are written on -
same as the Budapest memorandum and the 2014 and 2015 Minsk agreements -
false promises by diplomats that meant nothing in reality.

Ukrainians have never wanted surrender. They're a post-Soviet country. They know all too well what Russians are capable of, and they will never surrender to Vlad, no matter what your DL says.

If you want to do a Neville Chamberlain, go back to Stormfront.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #21 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 1:52pm

Armchair_Politician wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 12:22pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:49am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:46am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:41am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:40am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:37am:

Russia signed the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances signed in 1994 that was supposed to ensure Ukraine's sovereignty, but Russia has not upheld their end of the deal and has invaded Ukraine twice since then. Only a fool would think Putin would uphold Trump's plan because it gives Russia everything they wanted and tells them that their aggression works. If for no other reason, this is the one reason that Zelensky cannot accept the plan put forth by Trump.

True but how many more millions of Ukrainians will die to prove that point?

Hopefully Putin falls out of a window soon.

To be replaced by another one of his henchmen?

His henchmen won't continue the war.

I think the rich oligarchs have had enough of Putin's war and want their money and boats and planes back and would pressure whoever took over from Putin to end the war quickly.

Yep, I agree.

This is Putin's personal war - other Russians aren't interested in it.

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Karnal

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #22 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:03pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:00am:

Trump will try to get Russia whatever they want.

"Trump’s businesses went bankrupt so many times in the 1990s that many legitimate banks wouldn’t lend to him anymore. He turned to Russian oligarchs — Putin’s ruling clique — to bankroll his projects, and launder their dirty money for them. This was, and continues to be, a huge part of his business. He’s a Russian money launderer."

Just so. This is why he's hiding the Epstein files. As ever, it all comes back to he.

Epstein Epstein Epstein, no?

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Bobby.

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #23 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:11pm

Karnal wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 1:52pm:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:46am:

John Smith wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:43am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:37am:

My bet is that there would have been far more Ukrainians alive today
if Ukraine would have surrendered in 2022.

No, they'd be Russian by now if they had surrendered

Zelensky had more bargaining power in 2022 -

he could have told NATO -
you either come in here and defend Ukraine with massive air power and your own troops
or you'll face the massive Russian army anyway - after they take Ukraine.

Oh? So how do you get to this - after posting this?

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:37am:

My bet is that there would have been far more Ukrainians alive today
if Ukraine would have surrendered in 2022.
Ukraine was set up by the USA and the Europeans to shed their blood
when in fact there was no real commitment to help them -
just supply enough weapons to keep the war in a permanent stalemate
and bleed both the Ukrainians and Russians slowly for years -
except that the combined losses are over 1,000 dead per day
if you add up Ukrainian and Russian losses.

Trump has basically forced Ukraine into a surrender anyway -
the 28 point plan is close to an unconditional surrender and
none of the so called guarantees of security will ever be placed into law
in the USA or any NATO country -
they are not worth the paper they are written on -
same as the Budapest memorandum and the 2014 and 2015 Minsk agreements -
false promises by diplomats that meant nothing in reality.

Ukrainians have never wanted surrender. They're a post-Soviet country. They know all too well what Russians are capable of, and they will never surrender to Vlad, no matter what your DL says.

If you want to do a Neville Chamberlain, go back to Stormfront.

You fool - Trump has just forced Ukraine to surrender.

They won't get anymore US arms or intelligence unless they do. Roll Eyes

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Karnal

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #24 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:12pm

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:46am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:41am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:40am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:37am:

Russia signed the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances signed in 1994 that was supposed to ensure Ukraine's sovereignty, but Russia has not upheld their end of the deal and has invaded Ukraine twice since then. Only a fool would think Putin would uphold Trump's plan because it gives Russia everything they wanted and tells them that their aggression works. If for no other reason, this is the one reason that Zelensky cannot accept the plan put forth by Trump.

True but how many more millions of Ukrainians will die to prove that point?

Hopefully Putin falls out of a window soon.

To be replaced by another one of his henchmen?

Russians are natural crooks -
they have only ever had crooks running their country.
They could have been the world's only super power but
now their economy is smaller than Italy's. Roll Eyes

Russia is pinned down. The price of oil's tanked, their reserves are running out, and there's nowhere to turn. It's a kleptocracy, a failed rogue state with no true friends.

If your DL wasn't being blackmailed, he'd be tearing Vlad a new one.

The only one trying to save Russia now is he.

You

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #25 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:12pm

Karnal wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:03pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 11:00am:

Trump will try to get Russia whatever they want.

"Trump’s businesses went bankrupt so many times in the 1990s that many legitimate banks wouldn’t lend to him anymore. He turned to Russian oligarchs — Putin’s ruling clique — to bankroll his projects, and launder their dirty money for them. This was, and continues to be, a huge part of his business. He’s a Russian money launderer."

Just so. This is why he's hiding the Epstein files. As ever, it all comes back to he.

Epstein Epstein Epstein, no?

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Karnal

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #26 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:15pm

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:11pm:

Karnal wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 1:52pm:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:46am:

John Smith wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:43am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:37am:

My bet is that there would have been far more Ukrainians alive today
if Ukraine would have surrendered in 2022.

No, they'd be Russian by now if they had surrendered

Zelensky had more bargaining power in 2022 -

he could have told NATO -
you either come in here and defend Ukraine with massive air power and your own troops
or you'll face the massive Russian army anyway - after they take Ukraine.

Oh? So how do you get to this - after posting this?

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 10:37am:

My bet is that there would have been far more Ukrainians alive today
if Ukraine would have surrendered in 2022.
Ukraine was set up by the USA and the Europeans to shed their blood
when in fact there was no real commitment to help them -
just supply enough weapons to keep the war in a permanent stalemate
and bleed both the Ukrainians and Russians slowly for years -
except that the combined losses are over 1,000 dead per day
if you add up Ukrainian and Russian losses.

Trump has basically forced Ukraine into a surrender anyway -
the 28 point plan is close to an unconditional surrender and
none of the so called guarantees of security will ever be placed into law
in the USA or any NATO country -
they are not worth the paper they are written on -
same as the Budapest memorandum and the 2014 and 2015 Minsk agreements -
false promises by diplomats that meant nothing in reality.

Ukrainians have never wanted surrender. They're a post-Soviet country. They know all too well what Russians are capable of, and they will never surrender to Vlad, no matter what your DL says.

If you want to do a Neville Chamberlain, go back to Stormfront.

You fool - Trump has just forced Ukraine to surrender.

They won't get anymore US arms or intelligence unless they do. Roll Eyes

They're getting US arms through Europe, you gimp. In two years time, your DL will be gone -

Poof! Back to where he came from.

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Bobby.

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #27 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:41pm

Karnal wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:15pm:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:11pm:

You fool - Trump has just forced Ukraine to surrender.

They won't get anymore US arms or intelligence unless they do. Roll Eyes

They're getting US arms through Europe, you gimp. In two years time, your DL will be gone -

Poof! Back to where he came from.

You fool - only enough to keep both sides bleeding forever
but Ukraine is losing territory as we speak.

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Karnal

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Re: Trump really is deranged
Reply #28 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 3:43pm

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:41pm:

Karnal wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:15pm:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 24^th, 2025 at 2:11pm:

You fool - Trump has just forced Ukraine to surrender.

They won't get anymore US arms or intelligence unless they do. Roll Eyes

They're getting US arms through Europe, you gimp. In two years time, your DL will be gone -

Poof! Back to where he came from.

You fool - only enough to keep both sides bleeding forever
but Ukraine is losing territory as we speak.

Ukraine is defending itself, you dullard. It's successfully held back Russia, who's economy is drowning. Vlad can't keep going forever, and you - yes you - want a free sovereign country to surrender.

I've never heard such spineless apologism in all the time I've been a member of this board. Not only do you worship he, you clot, you're now going for the hand in his puppet.

In two years time, he'll be gone, and you'll be left, just another bare bottom in the showers.

Feel it.

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aquascoot Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 37038 Gender:	Re: Trump really is deranged Reply #29 - Nov 24^th, 2025 at 4:40pm Karnal like most leftie keyboard warriors wants to fight to the last ukranian
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