Australian Politics Forum - Trump doing Putins' bidding

Armchair_Politician

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Trump doing Putins' bidding
Today at 5:04am

I doubt we'll ever see Ukraine agree to this ridiculous peace plan drafted by the Trump administration that would see Ukraine give up land to Russia and reduce its military size and equipment in order to appease Russia, the aggressor. Nor should they. Trump is just doing with his buddy Putin asks. Shameful.

https://edition.cnn.com/2025/11/20/politics/ukraine-russia-trump-peace-proposal

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SerialBrain9 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3355	Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding Reply #1 - Today at 5:50am Russia is not the aggressor - NATO and the west is and has been for the last 4 decades breaking agreements to keep NATO bases out of the east - they’ve been encircling Russia for years and years and now the bear has finally came out to fight - to protect itself
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SerialBrain9 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3355	Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding Reply #2 - Today at 5:52am .
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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 114355 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding Reply #3 - Today at 6:07am Ukraine won't accept those terms - US promises meant nothing before after the Budapest memorandum in 1994.
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Armchair_Politician

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Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding
Reply #4 - Today at 6:39am

SerialBrain9 wrote Today at 5:50am:

Russia is not the aggressor - NATO and the west is and has been for the last 4 decades breaking agreements to keep NATO bases out of the east - they’ve been encircling Russia for years and years and now the bear has finally came out to fight - to protect itself

You’re an idiot. You realise NATO is a purely defensive organisation, right? That’s unlike Russia, which has a history of aggression against neighbours.

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Armchair_Politician Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 27837 Gender:	Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding Reply #5 - Today at 6:39am Bobby. wrote Today at 6:07am: Ukraine won't accept those terms - US promises meant nothing before after the Budapest memorandum in 1994. US promises mean NOTHING with Trump as President.
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Bobby.

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Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding
Reply #6 - Today at 6:47am

Armchair_Politician wrote Today at 6:39am:

Bobby. wrote Today at 6:07am:

Ukraine won't accept those terms -

US promises meant nothing before after the Budapest memorandum in 1994.

US promises mean NOTHING with Trump as President.

History.

Google AI

The Budapest Memorandum was not converted into U.S. law and is considered a political agreement rather than a legally binding treaty. The U.S. and other signatories gave security assurances and pledged to consult in the event of a violation, but the agreement was deliberately structured to avoid a legally enforceable military commitment. The memorandum is best understood as a political document that provides security assurances, and its commitments were not incorporated into U.S. statute.

Political vs. Legal: The Budapest Memorandum was designed to be a political, not a legally binding, agreement. U.S. negotiators specifically used the term "assurances" instead of "guarantees" to emphasize its political nature.

No U.S. legislation: The commitments were not enacted into U.S. law. They were instead political pledges made through a memorandum.

Consultation, not military intervention: The memorandum included an obligation to consult if commitments were violated, but not a direct obligation to intervene militarily. The U.S. and the UK insisted on keeping their commitments political in nature.

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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 78039 Gender:	Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding Reply #7 - Today at 7:30am Bobby. wrote Today at 6:47am: The Budapest Memorandum was not converted into U.S. law so you agree with Armchair that US promises mean NOTHING?
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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 51150 Gender:	Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding Reply #8 - Today at 7:33am Yup, can’t rely on the US anymore. Well, not until and if a rational administratration is ever elected again.
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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 114355 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding Reply #9 - Today at 7:34am John Smith wrote Today at 7:30am: Bobby. wrote Today at 6:47am: The Budapest Memorandum was not converted into U.S. law so you agree with Armchair that US promises mean NOTHING? Yes - the USA is just a bag of wind - they always were after Roosevelt died.
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Karnal

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Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding
Reply #10 - Today at 7:51am

Bobby. wrote Today at 6:47am:

Armchair_Politician wrote Today at 6:39am:

Bobby. wrote Today at 6:07am:

Ukraine won't accept those terms -

US promises meant nothing before after the Budapest memorandum in 1994.

US promises mean NOTHING with Trump as President.

History.

Google AI

The Budapest Memorandum was not converted into U.S. law and is considered a political agreement rather than a legally binding treaty. The U.S. and other signatories gave security assurances and pledged to consult in the event of a violation, but the agreement was deliberately structured to avoid a legally enforceable military commitment. The memorandum is best understood as a political document that provides security assurances, and its commitments were not incorporated into U.S. statute.

Political vs. Legal: The Budapest Memorandum was designed to be a political, not a legally binding, agreement. U.S. negotiators specifically used the term "assurances" instead of "guarantees" to emphasize its political nature.

No U.S. legislation: The commitments were not enacted into U.S. law. They were instead political pledges made through a memorandum.

Consultation, not military intervention: The memorandum included an obligation to consult if commitments were violated, but not a direct obligation to intervene militarily. The U.S. and the UK insisted on keeping their commitments political in nature.

Your source?

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Karnal

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Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding
Reply #11 - Today at 8:00am

John Smith wrote Today at 7:30am:

Bobby. wrote Today at 6:47am:

The Budapest Memorandum was not converted into U.S. law

so you agree with Armchair that US promises mean NOTHING?

No. Sleepy Joe met with Johnson, Macron and, of course, Zalensky. He upheld his part of the memorandum absolutely. He often referenced it.

Having said that, the Budapest memorandum was more a commitment not to invade Ukraine and respect its borders. From that angle, DL's collusion with Vlad to seize Ukrainian land is indeed a broken promise.

DL, like Biden, is responsible for past US deals in his role of prez.

We all know what he thinks of deals, eh?

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Belgarion Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5963 Gender:	Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding Reply #12 - Today at 8:23am I find it rather amusing that Russia, for decades the enemy of the west, is now being hailed as the good guy because Trump has said so.
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Armchair_Politician

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Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding
Reply #13 - Today at 8:26am

John Smith wrote Today at 7:30am:

Bobby. wrote Today at 6:47am:

The Budapest Memorandum was not converted into U.S. law

so you agree with Armchair that US promises mean NOTHING?

If it were any other President, it wouldn't be an issue. If it were Clinton or Bush or Obama in the White House then they wouldn't hesitate. But now we have Trump and it's no secret how he admires Putin and other dictators and autocrats. That's why he has come up with a plan to have Ukraine cede sovereign territory to Russia, which Zelensky has already said is a non-starter. Could you imagine the US ceding Diego Garcia to China? Or Alaska to Russia? Why does Trump think Zelensky should give up his land when it was Putin who invaded Ukraine?

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Trump doing Putins' bidding
Reply #14 - Today at 9:39am

Armchair_Politician wrote Today at 8:26am:

John Smith wrote Today at 7:30am:

Bobby. wrote Today at 6:47am:

The Budapest Memorandum was not converted into U.S. law

so you agree with Armchair that US promises mean NOTHING?

If it were any other President, it wouldn't be an issue. If it were Clinton or Bush or Obama in the White House then they wouldn't hesitate. But now we have Trump and it's no secret how he admires Putin and other dictators and autocrats. That's why he has come up with a plan to have Ukraine cede sovereign territory to Russia, which Zelensky has already said is a non-starter. Could you imagine the US ceding Diego Garcia to China? Or Alaska to Russia? Why does Trump think Zelensky should give up his land when it was Putin who invaded Ukraine?

He'll do anything Putin wants.

He doesn't want to lose his Russian financial backers.

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