Australian Politics Forum - Hamas, Israel, Gaza, Palestine and the Caliphate

MeisterEckhart

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Hamas, Israel, Gaza, Palestine and the Caliphate
Nov 4^th, 2024 at 9:06am

What Western liberals misunderstand about Hamas (and Hezbollah) is that, as Islamists, they don't fight and die for nation-states – not even for Palestine.

They fight and die for the hegemony of global Islam - an Islam-dominated world without borders - for all societies ruled by Sharia law under the governance of a singular, sovereign, global Islamic Caliphate.

Hamas Islamists do not fight and die for the cause of a Palestinian state, nor the Palestinian people.

In Gaza, they fight first for the destruction of Israel as a primary project, in the cause of their second objective: the reestablishment of an Islamic Caliphate in the region that will, as their third and final objective, govern all societies - like a medieval ‘Vatican’ projected into the present.

The fate of all Palestinians is irrelevant to Islamists – being anti-nation-state and anti-democratic, so endangering the lives of all of them does not stay their hand in pursuit of their final goal.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: Hamas, Israel, Gaza, Palestine and the Caliphate
Reply #1 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 12:46pm

While the Sunni-Shia divide is the fundamental and ancient schism that prevents even a remote semblance of Islamic monolithy, (and nevermind the myriad of other Islamic sects - e.g. Sufism), you will not hear Muslims in the non-Muslim sphere speak publicly of this fundamental split.

Concerning Gaza, for example, no Muslim public speaker will address the strong Sunni regimes' desire to have Gaza flattened.

A good outcome for Gaza to the Sunni regimes would be, on a clear day at its Egyptian southern border, that you can see, with the naked eye, its northern border with Israel.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: Hamas, Israel, Gaza, Palestine and the Caliphate
Reply #2 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 12:58pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 9:06am:

What Western liberals misunderstand about Hamas (and Hezbollah) is that, as Islamists, they don't fight and die for nation-states – not even for Palestine.

And what you don't understand is the UN was incapable of implementing UN res 181, the UN's very first resolution to establish two new states.

Quote:

In Gaza, (Hamas) fight first for the destruction of Israel as a primary project,

Again, because the UN failed to implement international law (in this case, UN res 181), and keep the peace between opposing fundamentalist ideologies.

The UNSC certainly has the resources/capability to keep the peace, just not the will....

Quote:

The fate of all Palestinians is irrelevant to Islamists – being anti-nation-state and anti-democratic, so endangering the lives of all of them does not stay their hand in pursuit of their final goal.

See above: international law ought not be beholden to ideological nut-jobs.

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« Last Edit: Nov 4^th, 2024 at 1:05pm by thegreatdivide »

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Frank

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Re: Hamas, Israel, Gaza, Palestine and the Caliphate
Reply #3 - Nov 15^th, 2024 at 7:50pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 9:06am:

What Western liberals misunderstand about Hamas (and Hezbollah) is that, as Islamists, they don't fight and die for nation-states – not even for Palestine.

They fight and die for the hegemony of global Islam - an Islam-dominated world without borders - for all societies ruled by Sharia law under the governance of a singular, sovereign, global Islamic Caliphate.

Hamas Islamists do not fight and die for the cause of a Palestinian state, nor the Palestinian people.

In Gaza, they fight first for the destruction of Israel as a primary project, in the cause of their second objective: the reestablishment of an Islamic Caliphate in the region that will, as their third and final objective, govern all societies - like a medieval ‘Vatican’ projected into the present.

The fate of all Palestinians is irrelevant to Islamists – being anti-nation-state and anti-democratic, so endangering the lives of all of them does not stay their hand in pursuit of their final goal.

And so the only correct response to that is outlined here

https://x.com/CherylWroteIt/status/1857191136973967650

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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.

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