Australian Politics Forum - Ukraine war update

thegreatdivide

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Re: Ukraine war update
Reply #1560 - Mar 28^th, 2025 at 5:57pm

ProudKangaroo wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 12:33pm:

None of this makes any sense unless you erase history entirely.

No, I'm remembering history entirely (eg linking to relevant google info, unlike you).

Quote:

Russia has never abided by any agreement it has made. It’s a serial violator of international law, and Ukraine is the latest, most blatant example.

You are biased, the US has also ignored UN resolutions, in fact everyone does when it suits them (because the UNSC wa neutered from the start by obsolete 'absolute national sovereignty' ideology).

Quote:

Russia doesn't negotiate in good faith, it advances, takes what it wants, and then demands more. The endgame isn’t peace, it’s the complete erasure of Ukraine from the map.

You think Trump would agree to that?

Quote:

And yet, rather than confronting this reality, you've done everything in your power to shift blame onto Ukraine, as if Russia's aggression was somehow invited rather than a calculated imperial ambition.

But even if Ukraine falls, it won’t end there. It never does.

And now Trump is openly musing about doing the same to Canada and Greenland. At first, it sounds like deranged ramblings, another dose of "filling the zone with sh

it

", but that’s precisely the problem. He’s testing the waters, seeing how far the Overton window can be shifted. And too many people are playing along.

Trump thinks it's his job to defend the "free" world, and he needs the vast artic land masses in Canada and Greenland to do it (given Russia's vast size).

Quote:

Bending the knee to Putin, handing over Ukraine’s resources, industries, and manpower, does not weaken Russia, it strengthens it. Anyone selling this as a means contribute to breaking the Russia-China axis is either delusional or lying.

Why do you think the US wanted to split the vast communist bloc in 1971, by recognizing the commies as the sole government of China? (which the US regrets, now that the USSR is defunct....now they want Russia as an ally against China).

Quote:

Trump isn’t controlling Putin, he’s doing Putin’s bidding.

Nonsense, Trump knows Russia is no more than a useful minnow; he will NEVER do Russia's (or Putin's) bidding.

Quote:

If Trump had any real leverage over Moscow, this war would be over.

Correct; but he apparently agreed with Putin (in his many phone calls) peace can be achieved "in a day", provided Putin didn't demand all of Ukraine - which even Trump would realize was unacceptable to anyone except Putin.

Quote:

The results are already clear. A preliminary agreement between Russia and Ukraine, brokered by the US, has been reached to halt maritime attacks in the Black Sea and cease strikes on energy targets. In exchange, the US pledged to lift some sanctions on Russian agricultural and fertilizer exports. But, predictably, Russia immediately demanded more, specifically, the restoration of banking connections to the international financial system before doing anything.

Yes, while Zelensky is still insisting he won't hand over an inch of Ukraine's Russian-speaking provinces; it takes 2 to tango, and Trump hasn't said what he regards as acceptable as part of the deal.

Quote:

And Trump will cave. He’s so desperate for a deal, any deal, that he'll hand Russia exactly what it wants, no questions asked.

Art of the deal!

You have to know Trump would accept Putin taking all of Ukraine as part of the deal, to say that, and you don't know it.

Quote:

All of this, ceding Ukraine’s land, resources, industries, and people, and now the prospect of easing banking sanctions, will directly fuel a resurgent Russia.

In what world is this a good thing?!

A world in which Ukraine cedes its Russian speaking provinces to Russia, to end the war, with the clear understanding that the combined might of Europe and the US - more than 20 times the size of Russia's crippled economy - will mobilize to take out Russia's defence system and more if the deal is violated.

Quote:

And for what? So Russia can pretend to play nice just long enough to regroup, rearm, and invade again?

How can you keep defending this? It’s madness.

See above.

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« Last Edit: Mar 28^th, 2025 at 6:02pm by thegreatdivide »

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ProudKangaroo Gold Member Offline The Sandstorm is coming 🎵Doo doo doo doo🎵 Posts: 21408 Meeanjin (Brisbane)	Re: Ukraine war update Reply #1561 - Mar 28^th, 2025 at 8:31pm Leroy wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:53am: Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:45am: He is bending over backwards to help the aggressor in the Ukraine war. Yeah its been proven that the more you insult and vilify Putin the better the outcome will be for Ukraine. He says on his knees, wiping his chin clean.
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greggerypeccary

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Re: Ukraine war update
Reply #1562 - Mar 28^th, 2025 at 8:33pm

ProudKangaroo wrote on Mar 28^th, 2025 at 8:31pm:

Leroy wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:53am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:45am:

He is bending over backwards to help the aggressor in the Ukraine war.

Yeah its been proven that the more you insult and vilify Putin the better the outcome will be for Ukraine.

He says on his knees, wiping his chin clean.

Oh, Leroy swallows.

He ain't wasting a drop.

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GOP = Guardians Of Paedophiles

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Frank

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Re: Ukraine war update
Reply #1563 - Mar 28^th, 2025 at 8:37pm

ProudKangaroo wrote on Mar 28^th, 2025 at 8:31pm:

Leroy wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:53am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:45am:

He is bending over backwards to help the aggressor in the Ukraine war.

Yeah its been proven that the more you insult and vilify Putin the better the outcome will be for Ukraine.

He says on his knees, wiping his chin clean.

Cheeses, you proggy maniacs are all butch homos, aren't you? What you are pleased to call your 'minds' invariably and instantly turn to gay rough trade at the slightest sign of someone not seeing things your way. It's uncanny. You, Bbwiyawn, eckhardt, creepy gweggy, paki arse sniffer - intant butch boy sex.

And you are the diverse, inclusive boys!!! Cheesy

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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.

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chimera

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Re: Ukraine war update
Reply #1564 - Mar 29^th, 2025 at 6:31am

The US diplomatic and bombing skills were on nightly TV in the Vietnam Victory Man on the Moon at about $555bill. in today's empires. The commies finally agreed to own South Vietnam by keeping all troops they needed there while Nixon dribbled away, dropping bombs. North Vietnam was willing for soldiers' deaths where the US wasn't.

Europeans are very determined to do something or other in Ukraine and have an unending series of diplomatic meetings. Putin agrees the West will lose and he keeps Ukraine. Russia is willing for soldiers' deaths . But Nixon had one illegal problem where Trump lives illegally on TV and could be the man on the moon.

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ProudKangaroo

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Re: Ukraine war update
Reply #1565 - Mar 29^th, 2025 at 7:08am

Frank wrote on Mar 28^th, 2025 at 8:37pm:

ProudKangaroo wrote on Mar 28^th, 2025 at 8:31pm:

Leroy wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:53am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:45am:

He is bending over backwards to help the aggressor in the Ukraine war.

Yeah its been proven that the more you insult and vilify Putin the better the outcome will be for Ukraine.

He says on his knees, wiping his chin clean.

Cheeses, you proggy maniacs are all butch homos, aren't you? What you are pleased to call your 'minds' invariably and instantly turn to gay rough trade at the slightest sign of someone not seeing things your way. It's uncanny. You, Bbwiyawn, eckhardt, creepy gweggy, paki arse sniffer - intant butch boy sex.

And you are the diverse, inclusive boys!!! Cheesy

I've spent to much time around you and Bobbi Fran, I think it's starting to show Shocked

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Frank

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Re: Ukraine war update
Reply #1566 - Mar 29^th, 2025 at 8:14am

ProudKangaroo wrote on Mar 29^th, 2025 at 7:08am:

Frank wrote on Mar 28^th, 2025 at 8:37pm:

ProudKangaroo wrote on Mar 28^th, 2025 at 8:31pm:

Leroy wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:53am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:45am:

He is bending over backwards to help the aggressor in the Ukraine war.

Yeah its been proven that the more you insult and vilify Putin the better the outcome will be for Ukraine.

He says on his knees, wiping his chin clean.

Cheeses, you proggy maniacs are all butch homos, aren't you? What you are pleased to call your 'minds' invariably and instantly turn to gay rough trade at the slightest sign of someone not seeing things your way. It's uncanny. You, Bbwiyawn, eckhardt, creepy gweggy, paki arse sniffer - intant butch boy sex.

And you are the diverse, inclusive boys!!! Cheesy

I've spent to much time around you and Bobbi Fran, I think it's starting to show Shocked

Not at all. Iits's the gweggy wanker/paki arse sniffer effect with lashings of Bbwianesque mincing and pouting.

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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.

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ProudKangaroo

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Re: Ukraine war update
Reply #1567 - Mar 29^th, 2025 at 9:30am

Frank wrote on Mar 29^th, 2025 at 8:14am:

ProudKangaroo wrote on Mar 29^th, 2025 at 7:08am:

Frank wrote on Mar 28^th, 2025 at 8:37pm:

ProudKangaroo wrote on Mar 28^th, 2025 at 8:31pm:

Leroy wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:53am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 27^th, 2025 at 10:45am:

He is bending over backwards to help the aggressor in the Ukraine war.

Yeah its been proven that the more you insult and vilify Putin the better the outcome will be for Ukraine.

He says on his knees, wiping his chin clean.

Cheeses, you proggy maniacs are all butch homos, aren't you? What you are pleased to call your 'minds' invariably and instantly turn to gay rough trade at the slightest sign of someone not seeing things your way. It's uncanny. You, Bbwiyawn, eckhardt, creepy gweggy, paki arse sniffer - intant butch boy sex.

And you are the diverse, inclusive boys!!! Cheesy

I've spent to much time around you and Bobbi Fran, I think it's starting to show Shocked

Not at all. Iits's the gweggy wanker/paki arse sniffer effect with lashings of Bbwianesque mincing and pouting.

Sure thing frannie, your masculinity is safe...

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 51474 Gender:	Re: Ukraine war update Reply #1568 - Mar 31^st, 2025 at 8:50am Resistance to the war is growing in ruzzia: Also, Vlad is starting to arrest oligarchs so high and low ruzzians are starting to protest!
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thegreatdivide

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Re: Ukraine war update
Reply #1569 - Mar 31^st, 2025 at 9:51am

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 31^st, 2025 at 8:50am:

Resistance to the war is growing in ruzzia:

Also, Vlad is starting to arrest oligarchs so high and low ruzzians are starting to protest!

Yes, Putin should have achieved the goals of his "special military operation" in 3 weeks max.

If he can't take the lifeline now on offer to end the war, on terms offered by Trump (who has/had some sympathy with Russia's stance for going into Ukraine, for all the reasons I explained to Kanganon), he deserves to lose the war AND the supposrt of his own people, proving himself to be as dense as Hitler.

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chimera Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 13635 Armidale Gender:	Re: Ukraine war update Reply #1570 - Mar 31^st, 2025 at 10:07am Nah it took Joe 3 years to get nazis away. Putin is winning territory and Trump is doing a Nixon to escape. Russians die when the boss says so.
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Jovial Monk

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Re: Ukraine war update
Reply #1571 - Mar 31^st, 2025 at 11:07am

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 31^st, 2025 at 9:51am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 31^st, 2025 at 8:50am:

Resistance to the war is growing in ruzzia:

Also, Vlad is starting to arrest oligarchs so high and low ruzzians are starting to protest!

Yes, Putin should have achieved the goals of his "special military operation" in 3 weeks max.

If he can't take the lifeline now on offer to end the war, on terms offered by Trump (who has/had some sympathy with Russia's stance for going into Ukraine, for all the reasons I explained to Kanganon), he deserves to lose the war AND the supposrt of his own people, proving himself to be as dense as Hitler.

Trump likes dictators far too much.

As to Putler—CAN he stop the war?

The economy—75% defence industry.

Wages, inflation—soaring.

Peace will see hundreds of thousands of armed, psychotic men flooding into ruzzia looking for jobs that don’t exist.

Putler—will look like a weak man giving in to Trumpy, shortly to be defenestrated by some “stronger” man.

OTOH—a new conscription will need to include the elites from Moscow and St Petersburg. Guess where protests are strongest? Moscow, St Petersburg and Volgograd.

Rock—hard place.

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OzPolitic needs a >real< Environment MRB now!
OzPolitic needs a >real< Food MRB now!
OzPolitic needs a >real< Health MRB now!
OzPolitic needs a >real< Economics MRB now!

Topics in the right MRB!

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thegreatdivide

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Re: Ukraine war update
Reply #1572 - Mar 31^st, 2025 at 4:15pm

chimera wrote on Mar 29^th, 2025 at 6:31am:

The US diplomatic and bombing skills were on nightly TV in the Vietnam Victory Man on the Moon at about $555bill. in today's empires. The commies finally agreed to own South Vietnam by keeping all troops they needed there while Nixon dribbled away, dropping bombs. North Vietnam was willing for soldiers' deaths where the US wasn't.

Europeans are very determined to do something or other in Ukraine and have an unending series of diplomatic meetings. Putin agrees the West will lose and he keeps Ukraine. Russia is willing for soldiers' deaths . But Nixon had one illegal problem where Trump lives illegally on TV and could be the man on the moon.

Your rambling drivel here is matched by Pete Hegseth's spectacular reversal of meaning, as noted by Global Times today:

"Recent remarks made by the US Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth at a memorial service (in Japan) commemorating the 80th anniversary of the Battle of Iwo Jima in World War II (WWII) have sparked intense controversy.

The US official claimed on Saturday that the "courage" of the two militaries in this battle needs to be "revered" and their "valor and sacrifice" should be "remembered," praising "shared warrior ethos." This equates the atrocities of the aggressors with the resistance of the defenders, thus erasing the heroic sacrifices made by American forces in repelling the Japanese during the battle.

er..."shared warrior ethos" - ie, shared by warriors bent on annihilating one-another.

Another egregious example of the delusional "freedom or death" ideology, while both were fighting for their respective "freedom".

Deplorable.

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chimera Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 13635 Armidale Gender:	Re: Ukraine war update Reply #1573 - Mar 31^st, 2025 at 4:24pm So now Hegseth as well as all Ozpol are fixated on 'freedom'. The word doesn't appear in the article and rarely in Ozpol posts . Only in tgd fevered mind.
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thegreatdivide

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Re: Ukraine war update
Reply #1574 - Mar 31^st, 2025 at 4:41pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 31^st, 2025 at 11:07am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 31^st, 2025 at 9:51am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 31^st, 2025 at 8:50am:

Resistance to the war is growing in ruzzia:

Also, Vlad is starting to arrest oligarchs so high and low ruzzians are starting to protest!

Yes, Putin should have achieved the goals of his "special military operation" in 3 weeks max.

If he can't take the lifeline now on offer to end the war, on terms offered by Trump (who has/had some sympathy with Russia's stance for going into Ukraine, for all the reasons I explained to Kanganon), he deserves to lose the war AND the supposrt of his own people, proving himself to be as dense as Hitler.

Trump likes dictators far too much.

As to Putler—CAN he stop the war?

The economy—75% defence industry.

Wages, inflation—soaring.

Peace will see hundreds of thousands of armed, psychotic men flooding into ruzzia looking for jobs that don’t exist.

Putler—will look like a weak man giving in to Trumpy, shortly to be defenestrated by some “stronger” man.

OTOH—a new conscription will need to include the elites from Moscow and St Petersburg. Guess where protests are strongest? Moscow, St Petersburg and Volgograd.

Rock—hard place.

Yes, and indeed (Nobel Peace Prize seeker) Trump is looking increasingly self-contradictory: he claimed Zelensky is a "dictator" (when Z is in fact merely another "freedom values" ideologue prepared to sacrifice his countrymen for "freedom"), while:

NBC News

President Donald Trump said he was “very angry” and “pissed off” when Russian President Vladimir Putin criticized the credibility of Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s leadership, adding that (Putin's) comments were “not going in the right location.”

ie not the direction Trump wants, so now Trumpy is pissed off with both of them ...though Putin's criticsm of Z's lack of "credibility" might be based on Trump's own incorrect assertion that "Z is a dictator".

Oops Vlad, you gotta be careful how you take Trump's criticisms of your enemy...

[Meanwhile I'm still hanging out, forlornly, for an agreement which Trump can enforce on both leaders, in lieu of the UNSC doing its job.... ]

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« Last Edit: Mar 31^st, 2025 at 4:47pm by thegreatdivide »

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