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MeisterEckhart

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Re: DEI
Reply #75 - Aug 6^th, 2024 at 3:30pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Aug 6^th, 2024 at 2:55pm:

mothra wrote on Aug 6^th, 2024 at 2:50pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Aug 6^th, 2024 at 2:49pm:

mothra wrote on Aug 6^th, 2024 at 2:42pm:

So now we embrace difference. And it has enriched up monumentally.

You embrace differences only when they're the result of cluster C oddballery.

If that made any sense to me, i might know how to respond.

Cluster C - the so-called SAD personality disorders.

After the hiring of women and Muslims, The HR Gestapo has become fixated on eccentrics and the fearful and anxiety-prone - particularly women. Their 'special needs' must be met - such as needing to work from home up to 5 days a week, isolation from other staff, and other special needs as requested...

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thegreatdivide

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Re: DEI
Reply #76 - Aug 7^th, 2024 at 12:46pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Aug 6^th, 2024 at 1:17pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 6^th, 2024 at 12:05pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Aug 6^th, 2024 at 10:21am:

DEI, like all ideals, does not survive close scrutiny unscathed or unqualified.

'From each according to their ability, to each according to their need' - so how is ability and need measured? Who determines ability and need?

Ability: measured by educators during the education process, from early years to tertiary entrance exams.

Need: defined by poverty-levels applicable in a given society.

There you are: 'equity' survives unscathed.

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Diversity, equity and inclusion - Before skill, ability and merit?

No - rather, addressing equity, AS WELL AS skill, ability and merit.

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Who determines who is worthy of DEI consideration?

We are ALL worthy of DEI, including above poverty particpation in the economy.

See UNUDHR Article 23.

Interesting that I have exposed you as a survival of the fittest ideologue - "let them eat cake".....

An excellent example of the simplistic thinking that the blanket application of idealism evokes.

Well, yes: "from each according to ability" IS simple. You make it complicated by insisting on competition in neoliberal free-markets as the basis of human relations.

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For those of us who've had kids or even lived among humans, know that academic ability often does not result in practical ability or the ability to apply what has been taught and learned.

A diversion: all are worthy of, and need to participate in the economy, above poverty level. In a world of plenty, the obstacles are political, not economic.

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What you're passing for ability is perceived potential based on presumptions... i.e. not ability.

See above; your ignorance of the foundations of economic systems is crippling YOUR ability to analyze the problem.

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There are plenty of deadbeats who received high-quality education, then bummed out due to many possible causes.

Correct: many possible causes, not all due to 'personal responsibility'.

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The 'low hanging fruit' of: if you're starving in a ditch, like an Irishman during the potato famine, then your needs are obvious - you have 'need'.

Your error: we ALL obviously need to eat, preferably NOT relying on destructive welfare.

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If 'need' only referred to food, clothing and shelter, the ideal would be easily met.

1. Access to food, clothing and shelter is NOT an"ideal", it's a necessity.

2. the current cost of living crisis badly affecting half the population (while the other half are laughing all the way to the bank) is not easily solved, otherwise governments would have solved it.

3. Indeed, "need" also involves above-poverty, social participation in the community, not achievable through welfare dependency.

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DEI is measured quantitatively in only a precious few categories: the number of women employed - by far the most common category. (in Australia) how many overtly apparent Muslims are employed - the 2nd largest category, the third being 'gender-diverse'.

Your error: we ALL need to participate:

DEI is a misdirected attempt to deal with the egregious outcomes of a dysfunctional economic system; DEI attempts to treat the symptons rather than the cause (ie, dysfunctional neoliberal markets).

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Currently, DEI is crudely applied and accounted for if you've got breasts and/or wear a headcloth and/or are overtly 'gender-diverse'.

How's it feel to be agreeing with Frank?

DEI is crudely applied in that manner BECAUSE the current survival of the fittest, welfare dependency 'safety net', which is the necessary outcome of wholly competitive, neoliberal freemarkets, forces some people (often because of race, gender, religion) onto the unemployment (or low pay) scrap heap.

The solution is to fix the economic system, not the individuals - via DEI notions - who want to participate.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: DEI
Reply #77 - Aug 8^th, 2024 at 6:14am

The core problem with translating ideals into practical realities is the blind faith that the ideal's propositions can be objectively quantified, are good in the absolute, and are all-encompassing.

And, because they do not survive close scrutiny, they need to be perniciously defended.

DEI - calibrated to impose minority- gender bias, ethnic bias, religious bias, 'gender-diversity' bias and limited psycho-non-normative bias - all of which are not, in themselves, reprehensible except when at the cost of worth and merit.

I'd bet no parent would be forgiving of a DEI-hire healthcare professional who, through inexperience, harmed the health of their child.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: DEI
Reply #78 - Aug 8^th, 2024 at 12:25pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Aug 8^th, 2024 at 6:14am:

The core problem with translating ideals into practical realities is the blind faith that the ideal's propositions can be objectively quantified, are good in the absolute, and are all-encompassing.

Stop waffling.

We want above-poverty participation for all, in a world of plenty.

Your low IQ, or vicious 'survival of the fittest' ideology, is the reason you are waffling about "absolutes".

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And, because they do not survive close scrutiny, they need to be perniciously defended.

Perhaps showing your IQ is ok, given your cleverly devious crap about "pernciously defending" (DEI); it's just crippled by your vicuous, blind, survival of the fittest ideology.

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DEI - calibrated to impose minority- gender bias, ethnic bias, religious bias, 'gender-diversity' bias and limited psycho-non-normative bias - all of which are not, in themselves, reprehensible except when at the cost of worth and merit.

At the cost of worth and merit?

So the common man must accept what vicious flat-earth economists say the economy can afford, in a world of plenty?

(I take it back: your low IQ, AND vicious ideology are both confirmed).

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I'd bet no parent would be forgiving of a DEI-hire healthcare professional who, through inexperience, harmed the health of their child.

Low IQ: people should participate at the level of their competence, certainly, but no-one should be disadvantaged by that reality; no employment type should result in social exclusion and/or disadvantage.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: DEI
Reply #79 - Aug 8^th, 2024 at 1:20pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Aug 8^th, 2024 at 6:14am:

The core problem with translating ideals into practical realities is the blind faith that the ideal's propositions can be objectively quantified, are good in the absolute, and are all-encompassing.

And, because they do not survive close scrutiny, they need to be perniciously defended.

DEI - calibrated to impose minority- gender bias, ethnic bias, religious bias, 'gender-diversity' bias and limited psycho-non-normative bias - all of which are not, in themselves, reprehensible except when at the cost of worth and merit.

I'd bet no parent would be forgiving of a DEI-hire healthcare professional who, through inexperience, harmed the health of their child.

One of the most pernicious aspects of DEI hiring is its necessarily covert nature.

It'll never be stamped on an employee's HR file.

And no employer is likely to add to any desirable criteria:
- Must be a hijab-wearing Muslim woman
or
- must demonstrate gender diversity by being overtly fruity.

It's done via a covert nod and a wink from HR.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: DEI
Reply #80 - Aug 9^th, 2024 at 12:46pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Aug 8^th, 2024 at 1:20pm:

[quote author=MeisterEckhart link=1705198321/77#77 date=1723061658]
The core problem with translating ideals into practical realities is the blind faith that the ideal's propositions can be objectively quantified, are good in the absolute, and are all-encompassing.

And, because they do not survive close scrutiny, they need to be perniciously defended.

DEI - calibrated to impose minority- gender bias, ethnic bias, religious bias, 'gender-diversity' bias and limited psycho-non-normative bias - all of which are not, in themselves, reprehensible except when at the cost of worth and merit.

I'd bet no parent would be forgiving of a DEI-hire healthcare professional who, through inexperience, harmed the health of their child.

Your idea of debate: ignore the refutation, and just repeat your errors.

Anyway let's have a look at your new 'survival of the fittest' rhetoric....

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One of the most pernicious aspects of DEI hiring is its necessarily covert nature.

It'll never be stamped on an employee's HR file.

And no employer is likely to add to any desirable criteria:
- Must be a hijab-wearing Muslim woman
or
- must demonstrate gender diversity by being overtly fruity.

It's done via a covert nod and a wink from HR.

You ignored my explanation: employers are being asked to implement "pernicious" DEI policies BECAUSE of the dysfunctional 'scarcity' economics currently ruling the world - which relegates the less competitive (often minorities) to low paid service jobs, or the unemployment scrap heap.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: DEI
Reply #81 - Aug 9^th, 2024 at 12:48pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 7^th, 2024 at 12:46pm: