Australian Politics Forum - Who might be an Aboriginal?

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: Who might be an Aboriginal?
Reply #45 - Apr 3^rd, 2024 at 9:07pm

AusGeoff wrote on Nov 28^th, 2023 at 8:56am:

Aussie wrote on Sep 18^th, 2023 at 12:49pm:

Quote:

'An Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander is a person of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander descent who identifies as an Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander and is accepted as such by the community in which he or she lives'

All bow to the mighty Aussie.

I coined that expression around 1972/73 at a Meeting of local Abos having a dispute about what an Abo was at the Civic Centre Bundaberg and it was recorded by an ABC Crew headed by a young journo turk called Kerry O'Brien.

Your evidence of this claim?

Definition of Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander person.
According to s51 (25) of the High Court of Australia (1983):
"An Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander person, is a person
of Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander descent who identifies
as an Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander and is accepted as
such by the community in which he or she lives".

Aye - and there be the rub - you still need to be of ATSI DESCENT ... not just claim it.... so Lord Pascoe fails.... no descent, no identification, no acceptance.....

Now then - about that DNA test......

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Frank

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Re: Who might be an Aboriginal?
Reply #46 - Jul 26^th, 2024 at 6:03pm

A Melbourne mum of four has had her bail revoked after blatantly lying about being Aboriginal.

In a bizarre judgment in the Victorian Supreme Court this week, Haley Terei, who is accused of stealing seven firearms, ammunition, $470,000 in cash, gold nuggets and other valuables from a home in Hastings, was outed for lying about her Indigenous heritage.

She claimed she inherited her Aboriginality from her Yorta Yorta mother, who died when she was three years old, and leveraged this background to get bail.

However, once enquiries were made, the court found Terei’s mother is from New Zealand, and is very much still alive.

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UnSubRocky

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Re: Who might be an Aboriginal?
Reply #47 - Jul 27^th, 2024 at 2:35am

Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 18^th, 2023 at 9:37am:

Now that we’ve been able to answer the question re what defines a woman .... let’s move on and at least ATTEMPT to define who might be an Aboriginal under Australia law.

Let’s start with something simple.

The person must be born in Australia? Yes/No?

My family did an ancestry trace, some years ago. They determined that my ancestry is essentially European, with the exception of ONE person. That person being my maternal great-great grandmother. She happened to be one-quarter indigenous Australian. The story I understand about her is that she was the product of having been fathered by settlers in the New South Wales region. Her mother was the result of a rape on a local indigenous lady.

Given the sociopolitical climate of the 1830s to the 1860s, my great-great grandmother basically married a German immigrant. They had a number of children together. One day, my great-great grandfather died in tragic circumstances. A few years later, my British great-great grandfather married my great-great grandmother, and adopted the children.

Therefore, unless my math is wrong, I would be 1.5% indigenous Australian. Ergo, I do not identify as indigenous Australia. Although my Darumbal language teacher said that I can definitely qualify as a Darumbal man (non-indigenous), with 1/64th indigenous heritage not qualifying me as racially indigenous. But, my cultural investigation and adoption of some indigenous cultures has allowed me the right to decide if I want to be called a Darumbal man.

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 87675 Always was always will be HOME Gender:	Re: Who might be an Aboriginal? Reply #48 - Jul 27^th, 2024 at 12:31pm These days anyone could be an Aborigine... might as well just put the whole country on the same level of citizenship, hand out land claims and such, and put everyone in line for special treatment...... that'll fix everything.
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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: Who might be an Aboriginal?
Reply #49 - Jul 27^th, 2024 at 12:33pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Jul 27^th, 2024 at 2:35am:

Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 18^th, 2023 at 9:37am:

Now that we’ve been able to answer the question re what defines a woman .... let’s move on and at least ATTEMPT to define who might be an Aboriginal under Australia law.

Let’s start with something simple.

The person must be born in Australia? Yes/No?

My family did an ancestry trace, some years ago. They determined that my ancestry is essentially European, with the exception of ONE person. That person being my maternal great-great grandmother. She happened to be one-quarter indigenous Australian. The story I understand about her is that she was the product of having been fathered by settlers in the New South Wales region. Her mother was the result of a rape on a local indigenous lady.

Given the sociopolitical climate of the 1830s to the 1860s, my great-great grandmother basically married a German immigrant. They had a number of children together. One day, my great-great grandfather died in tragic circumstances. A few years later, my British great-great grandfather married my great-great grandmother, and adopted the children.

Therefore, unless my math is wrong, I would be 1.5% indigenous Australian. Ergo, I do not identify as indigenous Australia. Although my Darumbal language teacher said that I can definitely qualify as a Darumbal man (non-indigenous), with 1/64th indigenous heritage not qualifying me as racially indigenous. But, my cultural investigation and adoption of some indigenous cultures has allowed me the right to decide if I want to be called a Darumbal man.

Don't know how you could guarantee that rape - considering she is in your family tree ... sounds a bit odd, don' cha think? Lots of these kinds of stories doing the rounds....

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Frank

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Re: Who might be an Aboriginal?
Reply #50 - Aug 4^th, 2024 at 9:33pm

Andrew Bolt: Academics claim to be Aboriginal when genealogical records suggest they’re not

Another two academics are claiming Aboriginal heritage and working in Aboriginal jobs without any evidence. Shouldn’t universities demand more proof?

“I have told you over the years of so many people who have claimed to be Aboriginal when their genealogical records suggest they don't have a single ancestor who's Aboriginal,” Mr Bolt said.

“But it's in academia especially, so it seems in my experience, academia where you particularly get people saying they're aboriginal when the evidence I have suggests they're not.

“Again, they won't show me evidence that I'm wrong.”

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: Who might be an Aboriginal?
Reply #51 - Aug 4^th, 2024 at 11:39pm

Anyone who Identifies... I don't and won't... wait a minute - did you say $500,000 for every Aborigine? I'm a proud Wattabugga man!!

Oh - rocky - just remember it's now trendy to say your Aboriginal ancestor was raped... no such thing as a decent White man taking up with an Aboriginal woman, you know..... like being a Jew in Nazi Germany was a crime, being a White man in Australian History with an Aboriginal spouse is a crime now. Them women was forced into it and so it was rape, yes?

Thing is - when women were in short supply, many men took up with Aboriginal women.... jeez, man - a man's gotta do what a man's gotta do, you know.... my 'brother's' ex-wife's family come from up here somewhere - I could show you their farm that her mother said her brother took from them all for himself - and they were a mixed White and Aboriginal family all the way. They are so well known up that way there is a tourism sign about the family.... in the bush near Johns River.

Don't believe everything you hear ... especially these days when it's trendy to speak ill of everyone...

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« Last Edit: Aug 4^th, 2024 at 11:48pm by Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM »

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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UnSubRocky

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Re: Who might be an Aboriginal?
Reply #52 - Aug 6^th, 2024 at 12:04pm

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Aug 4^th, 2024 at 11:39pm:

Oh - rocky - just remember it's now trendy to say your Aboriginal ancestor was raped... no such thing as a decent White man taking up with an Aboriginal woman, you know..... like being a Jew in Nazi Germany was a crime, being a White man in Australian History with an Aboriginal spouse is a crime now. Them women was forced into it and so it was rape, yes?

According to historians, indigenous Australians would let their wives sleep with other men, in exchange for trade. This is likely what happened with my "great-great-great-great grandmother". Great-great grandmother "M" would have been the result of two generations of 'settler interaction' bartering for these innovative new technologies.

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Frank

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Re: Who might be an Aboriginal?
Reply #53 - Aug 6^th, 2024 at 2:13pm

Professor Lisa Jackson Pulver is not your average Australian Jew. True, she is one of this country's 110,000 or so tribal members, but she is also a member of another tribe - an Aboriginal tribe called the Wiradjuri.

And yet, despite the seeming rarity of an Aboriginal Jew, Professor Jackson Pulver says she is not alone. "The first Jew came here on the First Fleet in 1788 and since then Jews have been marrying Aborigines because white women wouldn't marry them," she said this week. "There's a big mob of black Cohens out there and they've got Jewish ancestry."

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UnSubRocky Gold Member Offline Crocodile Hunter: Origins Posts: 25067 Rockhampton Gender:	Re: Who might be an Aboriginal? Reply #54 - Aug 6^th, 2024 at 5:05pm BS, Frank. Absolute BS. Thomas Kenneally would have pointed out that one of the arrivals on the first fleet to Sydney Cove was a Jew. Name the ship that the "Jew" travelled upon.
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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 87675 Always was always will be HOME Gender:	Re: Who might be an Aboriginal? Reply #55 - Aug 7^th, 2024 at 5:07am Anyone and no-one ... they are like a willow the wisp... like gold they are where you find them.....
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Frank

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Re: Who might be an Aboriginal?
Reply #56 - Aug 7^th, 2024 at 10:33am

UnSubRocky wrote on Aug 6^th, 2024 at 5:05pm:

BS, Frank. Absolute BS. Thomas Kenneally would have pointed out that one of the arrivals on the first fleet to Sydney Cove was a Jew. Name the ship that the "Jew" travelled upon.

Your research skills are shite-to-rudimentary, pal.

Esther Abrahams
Abrahams was transported to Australia with her baby daughter on the First Fleet, departing London in May 1787 on the convict transport Prince of Wales but transferring to Lady Penrhyn mid-voyage.[5] They reached Sydney with the Fleet in January 1788.

Peter Opley, an 18 year old Jewish labourer from Greenwich was sentenced on March 13 1786 for stealing a woman’s printed cotton gown, worth nine shillings. He was imprisoned in a ship’s hulk and then transferred to the Alexander for passage to Australia in January 1787

Daniel Daniels was sentenced to seven years at the Old Bailey for stealing “a copper pot, a pewter dish and a pair of shoes from Joseph Solomon”. David Jacobs, a lemon seller, was transported for stealing two livery greatcoats from a coach.

Henry Abrahams was convicted on three counts of highway robbery. Originally sentenced to death, he was sentenced to transportation for life ( on the Alexander). In Australia, he achieved infamy by informing on fellow convicts and testifying against them in court.
https://www.thejc.com/life-and-culture/australias-first-jews-thieves-who-became-heroes-u6an3qnt

See also
https://www.naa.gov.au/help-your-research/fact-sheets/jewish-experience-australi...

http://firstfleet.uow.edu.au/s_multi.html

https://www.sl.nsw.gov.au/stories/australian-jewish-community-and-culture/jewish...

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Jasin Gold Member Offline Posts: 52748 Gender:	Re: Who might be an Aboriginal? Reply #57 - Aug 7^th, 2024 at 11:23am If Yellows are Orcs. Then Blacks are surely Goblins.
Back to top	AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY. IP Logged

UnSubRocky

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Re: Who might be an Aboriginal?
Reply #58 - Aug 7^th, 2024 at 3:57pm

Frank wrote on Aug 7^th, 2024 at 10:33am:

UnSubRocky wrote on Aug 6^th, 2024 at 5:05pm:

BS, Frank. Absolute BS. Thomas Kenneally would have pointed out that one of the arrivals on the first fleet to Sydney Cove was a Jew. Name the ship that the "Jew" travelled upon.

Your research skills are shite-to-rudimentary, pal.

Esther Abrahams
Abrahams was transported to Australia with her baby daughter on the First Fleet, departing London in May 1787 on the convict transport Prince of Wales but transferring to Lady Penrhyn mid-voyage.[5] They reached Sydney with the Fleet in January 1788.

I will try to give "The Commonwealth of Thieves" another read tonight. And I might even research books I have here on the foundation of Sydney Cove. But, I have not heard of Esther Abrahams.

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UnSubRocky

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Re: Who might be an Aboriginal?
Reply #59 - Aug 7^th, 2024 at 3:59pm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esther_Abrahams

Within two months, Abrahams was transported to Australia with her baby daughter on the First Fleet, departing London in May 1787 on the convict transport Prince of Wales but transferring to Lady Penrhyn mid-voyage.[5] They reached Sydney with the Fleet in January 1788.
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My apologies, Frank.

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