Australian Politics Forum - expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly.

MeisterEckhart Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 16038 Gender:	Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly. Reply #270 - May 27^th, 2023 at 12:09pm Karnal wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 11:53am: In all the provinces it captured after 2022, Russia has emptied the populations, and for what? Why invade in the first place? Russia is openly offering for adoption, kidnapped Ukrainian children to adoptees who do not live near the Ukrainian border.
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Karnal

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Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly.
Reply #271 - May 27^th, 2023 at 1:54pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 12:09pm:

Karnal wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 11:53am:

In all the provinces it captured after 2022, Russia has emptied the populations, and for what? Why invade in the first place?

Russia is openly offering for adoption, kidnapped Ukrainian children to adoptees who do not live near the Ukrainian border.

Just so. This is the Putin model in a nutshell. Steal foreign kids, place them with Russian families, change their names, indoctrinate them and turn them into future cannon fodder.

This action alone - an indicted war crime - should be enough to turn any person with cognition off Vlad for good.

But, as ever, we just get more lies, doublethink and full blown cognitive dissonance.

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Laugh till you cry

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Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly.
Reply #272 - May 27^th, 2023 at 2:59pm

Karnal wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 1:54pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 12:09pm:

Karnal wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 11:53am:

In all the provinces it captured after 2022, Russia has emptied the populations, and for what? Why invade in the first place?

Russia is openly offering for adoption, kidnapped Ukrainian children to adoptees who do not live near the Ukrainian border.

Just so. This is the Putin model in a nutshell. Steal foreign kids, place them with Russian families, change their names, indoctrinate them and turn them into future cannon fodder.

This action alone - an indicted war crime - should be enough to turn any person with cognition off Vlad for good.

But, as ever, we just get more lies, doublethink and full blown cognitive dissonance.

Wasn't Australia one of the first to do that with Aboriginals?

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Please don't thank me. Effusive fawning and obeisance of disciples, mendicants, and foot-kissers embarrass me.

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Karnal

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Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly.
Reply #273 - May 27^th, 2023 at 4:53pm

Laugh till you cry wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 2:59pm:

Karnal wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 1:54pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 12:09pm:

Karnal wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 11:53am:

In all the provinces it captured after 2022, Russia has emptied the populations, and for what? Why invade in the first place?

Russia is openly offering for adoption, kidnapped Ukrainian children to adoptees who do not live near the Ukrainian border.

Just so. This is the Putin model in a nutshell. Steal foreign kids, place them with Russian families, change their names, indoctrinate them and turn them into future cannon fodder.

This action alone - an indicted war crime - should be enough to turn any person with cognition off Vlad for good.

But, as ever, we just get more lies, doublethink and full blown cognitive dissonance.

Wasn't Australia one of the first to do that with Aboriginals?

Good point, Laugh, just so. Australia also changed course and apologised. Just to make it clear, we apologised again only yesterday.

It's reconciliation week, you see.

It's true. We tried to root out the white-looking kids, made them speak English, hid their past and gave them nice English names. Once they realised this, many of them freaked out.

Some became wary, mistrustful and even hostile. Others became drunks or wife-beaters or got in trouble with the cops, so we blamed them. But do you know?

It wasn't their or their parents or their carers' fault, it was the government's. They should have left the kids where they were. Once it was all too late, the government said sorry, we did the wrong thing, we promise not to do it again.

That's just good manners, no?

Mr Putin can do the right thing right now. He can get on the phone and tell the generals to take all their soldiers, turn around and go home. He can then thank the Russian carers and send the kids home too, back to live with their parents.

Then, Mr Putin can say sorry, he did the wrong thing and promise not to do it again.

Mr Putin can do this, Laugh. He can then say sorry to all the people in Ukraine. They're neighbours, no? Mr Putin can say sorry for bombing their power stations to make it more cold in Winter. He can say sorry for blowing up their apartments and destroying all their things. He can say sorry for sending in drones to destroy their hospitals, schools and churches.

Mr Putin is a deeply religious man, did you know that? He even has a chapel in his house. No matter how busy he is, Mr Putin always takes time to pray to the saints.

Then, Mr Putin can retire and live the rest of his life in that billion dollar palace he has. Good idea, do you think?

Christians aren't perfect, Laugh, just forgiven, yes?

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Bobby.

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Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly.
Reply #274 - May 27^th, 2023 at 5:24pm

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-65725004

27th May 2023.

Ukraine is ready to launch its long-expected counter-offensive against Russian forces,

one of the country's most senior security officials has told the BBC.

Oleksiy Danilov would not name a date but said an assault to retake territory from President Vladimir Putin's occupying forces could begin "tomorrow, the day after tomorrow or in a week".

He warned that Ukraine's government had "no right to make a mistake" on the decision because this was an "historic opportunity" that "we cannot lose".

As secretary of the National Security and Defence Council of Ukraine, Mr Danilov is at the heart of President Volodymyr Zelensky's de facto war cabinet.

His rare interview with the BBC was interrupted by a phone message from President Zelensky summoning him to a meeting to discuss the counter-offensive.

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Karnal

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Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly.
Reply #275 - May 27^th, 2023 at 7:03pm

Bobby. wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 5:24pm:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-65725004

27th May 2023.

Ukraine is ready to launch its long-expected counter-offensive against Russian forces,

one of the country's most senior security officials has told the BBC.

Oleksiy Danilov would not name a date but said an assault to retake territory from President Vladimir Putin's occupying forces could begin "tomorrow, the day after tomorrow or in a week".

He warned that Ukraine's government had "no right to make a mistake" on the decision because this was an "historic opportunity" that "we cannot lose".

As secretary of the National Security and Defence Council of Ukraine, Mr Danilov is at the heart of President Volodymyr Zelensky's de facto war cabinet.

His rare interview with the BBC was interrupted by a phone message from President Zelensky summoning him to a meeting to discuss the counter-offensive.

That's BREAKING, Bobby.

It shows the impossible situation Russia is in, if it even survives the Spring offensive. Unless Putin captures Kiev, assassinates the government, bans the media and launches a total mass arrest of all anti-Russian Ukrainians, it can't possibly hope to win this war.

Without an all-out slaughter on such a scale, Russia can't prevail. Stories like this will continue, year after year. Ukraine has a population of 43 million. Its grain exports provide much of the Middle East, Africa and Central Asia their bread. Its oil and gas reserves have an effect on global supply. Even if the Kremlin could achieve its military objectives, it can't possibly maintain ongoing security.

The Diem regime held South Vietnam for 20 years, from 1955 to 1975, with Diem himself assassinated in 1963. Russia finds itself in the position of US forces from 1968 to 1975, after the Tet offensive, when a communist victory was clear to all. The North just had to wait Uncle out.

Russia faces the same threat in Ukraine. It hasn't applied the lessons of its own foreign debacle in Afghanistan. Ukraine is different: globally influential, flat, more ethnically homogeneous. And it's in Europe, next to the world's biggest military alliance.

Ethnicity is relevant. In Afghanistan, Russia - and the US - could play warlords off each other. Ukraine has the advantage of solidarity - Christian solidarity. Religion played an important role in the Polish revolution of 1989, and it could do so if Ukraine is ever occupied.

Ukraine has another advantage: its leader's charisma. Zalensky has wowed over the world. Zalensky fought off a Russian invasion with one hand. With the other, he's reached out to the West, galvanising Western leaders in a new crusade. Apart from the endurance of Ukrainians themselves, Zalensky is the Ukraine's biggest asset. If he wins, Zalensky will go down in history as a Winston Churchill. If he loses, he'll be Joan of Arc.

Russia had one chance to topple Zalensky. Instead, it showed how dysfunctional Russia under Putin has become. The only advances have been made by the Wagner group, a private contractor, using Russian prisoners. Nothing can highlight just how inefficient the Putin model is better than that.

The jig's up, leftards. Spring is here. Putin is out of options, he can't possibly secure a sustainable victory. No matter how long this war continues, we'll know: Putin, along with all he stands for, is finished. Brexit, Trump, Putin. The emperor is naked. When you buy into white populist nationalism, this is what you sign up for.

Ever get the feeling you've been bought, sold and paid?

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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 112877 Melbourne Gender:	Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly. Reply #276 - May 27^th, 2023 at 7:28pm Hi Matty, good luck to Ukraine. I hope they kick the Russians out - however it looks more like the stalemate of WW1 for 4 years.
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issuevoter Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 9200 The Great State of Mind Gender:	Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly. Reply #277 - May 27^th, 2023 at 9:35pm The Spring counter-offensive is about to become the summer/ autumn counter-offensive. Actually, most of the counter-offensive narrative is generated by the media as though the Ukraine high command are poring over maps and moving blocks around on it to plan a master stroke. I doubt any such scenario.
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JC Denton

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Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly.
Reply #278 - May 27^th, 2023 at 9:53pm

for any offensive carried out by eithe r side to achieve rapid success it has to attack somewhere where there's nothing around to stop it. only reason kharkov was successful is bc the front was empty, russia never had enough manpower at the time and even then they didn't really need to withdraw (reports are the ukrainians would have ran out of ammunition pretty quickly and the offensive would have stopped before it ever got to izyum or lyman where it ultimately terminated). ukraine's offensive in kherson, despite the geography not favouring russia at all, was miserable if you followed it from day to day. at the time of russia's departure from kherson city at the behest of surovikin the ukrainians weren't even close to the city. ukraine's offensive, if it happens, will most definitely fial, unless they find another place that has nothing in it like last time to attack. but even then, there's little chance of it being decisive.

the kinds of weapons needed to alleviate trench-style warfare, such as planes and tanks are of reduced value in this conflict. there are too many soviet model anti-air defense systems on either side, turns out they're highly effective (something the americans learned the hard way in serbia, when they had to face off against an actually competent anti-air defense corps i.e not an arab army's), and too many cheap effective anti-tank weapons. russia's missile campaigns have probably been purposed with depleting/degrading ukraine's anti-air defense capacities, which is why we've been seeing more glide bombs from russia in the past few months. positional/static warfare will characterise this conflict for the foreseeable future, and will favour the side with the greater manpower pool.

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« Last Edit: May 28^th, 2023 at 1:37am by JC Denton »

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Jasin

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Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly.
Reply #279 - May 28^th, 2023 at 12:49am

issuevoter wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 9:35pm:

The Spring counter-offensive is about to become the summer/ autumn counter-offensive. Actually, most of the counter-offensive narrative is generated by the media as though the Ukraine high command are poring over maps and moving blocks around on it to plan a master stroke. I doubt any such scenario.

You're right. It is a major Media 'counter-offensive' expectation of the Ukrainians as if the Media is running the war.
The Russians are very well dug in and it would be something akin to storming Gallipoli for the Ukrainians.
But hey, the Media loves the 'action' for ratings.

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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.

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aquascoot

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Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly.
Reply #280 - May 28^th, 2023 at 6:07am

Karnal wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 7:03pm:

Bobby. wrote on May 27^th, 2023 at 5:24pm:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-65725004

27th May 2023.

Ukraine is ready to launch its long-expected counter-offensive against Russian forces,

one of the country's most senior security officials has told the BBC.

Oleksiy Danilov would not name a date but said an assault to retake territory from President Vladimir Putin's occupying forces could begin "tomorrow, the day after tomorrow or in a week".

He warned that Ukraine's government had "no right to make a mistake" on the decision because this was an "historic opportunity" that "we cannot lose".

As secretary of the National Security and Defence Council of Ukraine, Mr Danilov is at the heart of President Volodymyr Zelensky's de facto war cabinet.

His rare interview with the BBC was interrupted by a phone message from President Zelensky summoning him to a meeting to discuss the counter-offensive.

That's BREAKING, Bobby.

It shows the impossible situation Russia is in, if it even survives the Spring offensive. Unless Putin captures Kiev, assassinates the government, bans the media and launches a total mass arrest of all anti-Russian Ukrainians, it can't possibly hope to win this war.

Without an all-out slaughter on such a scale, Russia can't prevail. Stories like this will continue, year after year. Ukraine has a population of 43 million. Its grain exports provide much of the Middle East, Africa and Central Asia their bread. Its oil and gas reserves have an effect on global supply. Even if the Kremlin could achieve its military objectives, it can't possibly maintain ongoing security.

The Diem regime held South Vietnam for 20 years, from 1955 to 1975, with Diem himself assassinated in 1963. Russia finds itself in the position of US forces from 1968 to 1975, after the Tet offensive, when a communist victory was clear to all. The North just had to wait Uncle out.

Russia faces the same threat in Ukraine. It hasn't applied the lessons of its own foreign debacle in Afghanistan. Ukraine is different: globally influential, flat, more ethnically homogeneous. And it's in Europe, next to the world's biggest military alliance.

Ukraine has another advantage: its leader's charisma. Zalensky has wowed over the world. Zalensky fought off a Russian invasion with one hand. With the other, he's reached out to the West, galvanising Western leaders in a new crusade. Apart from the endurance of Ukrainians themselves, Zalensky is the Ukraine's biggest asset. If he wins, Zalensky will go down in history as a Winston Churchill. If he loses, he'll be Joan of Arc.

Russia had one chance to topple Zalensky. Instead, it showed how dysfunctional Russia under Putin has become. The only advances have been made by the Wagner group, a private contractor, using Russian prisoners. Nothing can highlight just how inefficient the Putin model is better than that.

The jig's up, leftards. Spring is here. Putin is out of options, he can't possibly secure a sustainable victory. No matter how long this war continues, we'll know: Putin, along with all he stands for, is finished. Brexit, Trump, Putin. The emperor is naked. When you buy into white populist nationalism, this is what you sign up for.

Ever get the feeling you've been bought, sold and paid?

nice try goebels.

now heres the real facts on the ground.

populist nationalism is not only not finished , it is flourishing,

china, india, brazil, south africa, korea are all feircely nationalist and doing well.

energy security and food security IS economic security.

russia has enough natural resources and food to last forever.

europe can hardly keep the lights on.

you go on and on about how free people are in the west Roll Eyes

and how oppressed they are in russia .

in the west , people are so over regulated, they are free to do some chode job, sit in traffic all day , be told they are part of toxic masculinity, wank off to weed and be nothing.

8 million men with no health issues between the ages of 18 and 50 in america no longer participate in society. they arent looking for a job, they arent working, they arent at school. they have dropped out of your garbage society.

i cant move on my road because so many "off the grid ' types are starting to try to run away from the over governed cities which are havens of mediocre garabge existence.

my old neighbours were russians. they had family in vladivostock.

in the villages of russia, if you have family there, you ju7st go to the village council and build a house, much like the amich,

no council regualtions
no rates
no land tax
no interference from moscow.

just do your own thing

fish where you like
grow what you like

its nirvana

so keep selling your european model of paradise, people arent buying,
the italians have gone back to a fundamentalist catholic PM who is booting out all the woke wankers.

france as well

the dutch farmers are in revolt.

the proud nationalists are going to prevail

they have the resources.

america, my friend is 31 trillion in debt and teetering on the edge of defaulting
ever get the feeling you are kidding yourself

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Bobby.

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Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly.
Reply #281 - May 28^th, 2023 at 6:27am

A 2 hour 10 minute video proves that factories win wars:

The West has more factories so they should win in Ukraine.

2,877,935 views Aug 3, 2022

The Second World War was won not just on the battlefield.
From Vickers to Lancaster, here we examine the great war factories that powered Britain's production war.

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Jasin Gold Member Offline Posts: 53070 Gender:	Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly. Reply #282 - May 28^th, 2023 at 7:52am I wonder if the Unions called for strikes during war times?
Back to top	AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY. IP Logged

JC Denton

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Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly.
Reply #283 - May 28^th, 2023 at 9:24am

Bobby. wrote on May 28^th, 2023 at 6:27am:

A 2 hour 10 minute video proves that factories win wars:

The West has more factories so they should win in Ukraine.

2,877,935 views Aug 3, 2022

The Second World War was won not just on the battlefield.
From Vickers to Lancaster, here we examine the great war factories that powered Britain's production war.

a reall thinker here folks

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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 112877 Melbourne Gender:	Re: expert - says Ukraine is losing the war badly. Reply #284 - May 28^th, 2023 at 9:48am Jasin wrote on May 28^th, 2023 at 7:52am: I wonder if the Unions called for strikes during war times? That point is discussed in the video. The Govt. made deals with the unions but the Govt also gave themselves special war powers.
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