Australian Politics Forum - The question about a voice will be asked...

John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 77052 Gender:	Re: The question about a voice will be asked... Reply #195 - Jul 31^st, 2022 at 7:02pm Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 5:59pm: You're a great argument for Australia being far more selective about who it imports.... I was born here you moron
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John Smith

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Re: The question about a voice will be asked...
Reply #196 - Jul 31^st, 2022 at 7:03pm

Gnads wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 6:25pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 3:11pm:

Gnads wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 2:55pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 2:54pm:

Gnads wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 2:50pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 2:43pm:

Gnads wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 2:40pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 1:59pm:

I wonder why the bigots don't cry so much about mining companies and other big businesses having a voice in parliament.

Roll Eyes

Because they don't have a voice in Parliament.

They have their associations(Unions) who lobby to govt on their behalf.

You know that.

and as best as I can tell at this stage, the most likely scenarios is that's all this 'voice' is in effect expected to be. A 'lobby group' who will advise on matters affecting aboriginal policy

the biggest difference to an actual lobby group is they won't have to bribe politicians to be heard.

Yeah just like ATSIC

no, unlike ATSIC, parliament won't be able to dissolve it. It can only change it's make up.

Yeah well that's no good if it ended up another failure.

because one person was found to be corrupt? Cheesy

When was the last time they dissolved parliament because someone was corrupt?

Ohhh....which one was that?

There have been more than one & at many different levels.

no where near as many as we've found corrupt liberal party members, and yet they still exist whilst ATSIC is gone Roll Eyes

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: The question about a voice will be asked...
Reply #197 - Jul 31^st, 2022 at 7:09pm

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 6:40pm:

Well - I'm glad to be part of that problem....

There you go, indifferent to all the pain....

Quote:

far better than having a despotic government controlling everything...

The 'despotic government' is in fact the evil global cabal of central bankers who demand all national governments must borrow from them alone, rather than allowing governments to respond to the desire of the people by funding themselves with debt-free money created in national central banks.

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that's what is behind Labor support for all these fringe things -

Labor is as constrained by the evil cabal of private financiers as the Libs.

Quote:

special rules binding on all the rest mean that every little one of these is a piece of the continent gone forever.. the continent of your legal and civil rights and even your personal prerogatives.

Just so you know, "rights" are delusions created by men. That's why law is changeable; we all desire to be free, but since we are all self-interested twits, rule of law is necessary to avoid anarchy - like abos smashing things in the Alice. It would be intelligent to make sure all those abos are gainfully employed, instead of locking them up and then letting them out ...repeat cycle.

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I despise the current setup and all the lies that hold it in place, not to mention the abuse - but I will not replace it with either a Stalinist or a Fascist government of dictators who will be the same only worse in that there are zero constraints on their power, since they will hold the reins of government with all its powers.

Addressed above, you are looking in the wrong place for "the despots". The central bankers' cabal is laughing at you all the way to the bank.

Quote:

THAT is why we must never permit any government bent on those things to take place here. Fools have already offered Labor as it now is a free shot to wreck the joint and off they go with this nonsense ... no choice really - but I told yez not to vote them in, but to vote for Independents

Examined, addressed, and refuted above. The despots are the central bankers, not the government.

Quote:

You remind me of a student jerk I met when I was wearing the green over fifty years ago now - he said that when their great revolution came along, I would be one of the first to go... I said - they can try it any time.

I'm still standing...

You are still standing, but those being murdered or incarcerated - by police, for protesting their poverty aren't.

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: The question about a voice will be asked...
Reply #198 - Jul 31^st, 2022 at 7:25pm

No indifference to all the pain - just not permitting greater pain for all. You need to understand the difference. You admit that this nonsense will do nothing - yet you whine at others about not caring for the problems of people and the suffering.... I support the Aboriginal Senator who stands for what is needed - protection of those in need and real improvements to the life of Aborigines - not nonsense like this.

As for 'not caring' - again - what would you like me to do? Go out there and wave a magic wand? Instead you propose just giving this path a try knowing it will not work but will remain forever a horror stuck in the side of Australia - and say that a good result would be if governments suddenly somehow woke up to what they are doing wrong.

You are amazing in your utter naivety. I told you - they will do no such thing - they themselves benefit mightily from the way things are - they live off the fattest in the land - why would anything make them change that, let alone some sudden epiphany?

As for discussion of this thing - Albo came right out and said they were not going to discuss the way this would be set up - we the people are to accept a pig in a poke - HUH! Every time one of these advocates for this thing discusses it, all they talk about is 'recognition' - well that's been addressed - they are recognised as Australian citizens and have been fully such since 1967.

The ABC News had an Aboriginal pollie on and asked her about details asked for by Peter Dutton - she didn't once address the question asked, but waffled on about Albo's statement of nothing and 'recognition'. The ABC made no attempt to bring her back to the question but let her waffle.

NO DETAILS - NO DEAL!!

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« Last Edit: Jul 31^st, 2022 at 7:32pm by Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM »

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Frank

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Re: The question about a voice will be asked...
Reply #199 - Jul 31^st, 2022 at 8:44pm

John Smith wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 7:02pm:

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 5:59pm:

You're a great argument for Australia being far more selective about who it imports....

I was born here you moron Roll Eyes

Yet you are like a resentful blowin.
Why?

Er.... because you IDENTIFY as a resentful blow in. Resentful being your operative word.

I bet ANYTHING that your first generation parents are not resentful. It takes your kind of prick, having everything handed to him, to be resentful.

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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: The question about a voice will be asked...
Reply #200 - Jul 31^st, 2022 at 10:45pm

Frank wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 8:44pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 7:02pm:

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 5:59pm:

You're a great argument for Australia being far more selective about who it imports....

I was born here you moron Roll Eyes

Yet you are like a resentful blowin.
Why?

Er.... because you IDENTIFY as a resentful blow in. Resentful being your operative word.

I bet ANYTHING that your first generation parents are not resentful. It takes your kind of prick, having everything handed to him, to be resentful.

Ya got that, brother.... his parents would be ashamed of his attitudes.

And... Slowsmith.. I did mention that it was your parents who came here seeking a better life - and got it.... you moron. Appreciate it for a change like your parents who know much better than you do how life can be and DO appreciate it here.

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

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Brian Ross Gold Member Offline Representative of me Posts: 44327	Re: The question about a voice will be asked... Reply #201 - Jul 31^st, 2022 at 10:51pm It seems the Racists are as usual, running round like chooks with their heads cut off simply at the idea of a question being asked of the Australian people. Shame on you, that you would distrust the Australian people so much. You really are despicable. Tsk, tsk, tsk...
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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: The question about a voice will be asked...
Reply #202 - Jul 31^st, 2022 at 11:32pm

Brian Ross wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 10:51pm:

It seems the Racists are as usual, running round like chooks with their heads cut off simply at the idea of a question being asked of the Australian people. Shame on you, that you would distrust the Australian people so much. You really are despicable. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

No Details - No Deal.... we're not going to buy a pig in a poke, and AlboCo (Albocorp?) know that.... Wake Up, Brian.... they don't really want this - they are fully aware that it is political death.

Pharken Corporals.... Roll Eyes

stick to ministering to the bruvvas up north .. try to stop them killing and kidnapping kids and such, willya? Politics, tactics and strategy are not your game...

There will be no Voice - and a Voice is NOT Recognition!

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Gnads

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Re: The question about a voice will be asked...
Reply #203 - Aug 1^st, 2022 at 8:58am

John Smith wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 7:03pm:

Gnads wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 6:25pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 3:11pm:

Gnads wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 2:55pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 2:54pm:

Gnads wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 2:50pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 2:43pm:

Gnads wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 2:40pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 1:59pm:

I wonder why the bigots don't cry so much about mining companies and other big businesses having a voice in parliament.

Roll Eyes

Because they don't have a voice in Parliament.

They have their associations(Unions) who lobby to govt on their behalf.

You know that.

and as best as I can tell at this stage, the most likely scenarios is that's all this 'voice' is in effect expected to be. A 'lobby group' who will advise on matters affecting aboriginal policy

the biggest difference to an actual lobby group is they won't have to bribe politicians to be heard.

Yeah just like ATSIC

no, unlike ATSIC, parliament won't be able to dissolve it. It can only change it's make up.

Yeah well that's no good if it ended up another failure.

because one person was found to be corrupt? Cheesy

When was the last time they dissolved parliament because someone was corrupt?

Ohhh....which one was that?

There have been more than one & at many different levels.

no where near as many as we've found corrupt liberal party members, and yet they still exist whilst ATSIC is gone Roll Eyes

Yeah & none of the corrupt ATSIC officials did any time either.

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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: The question about a voice will be asked...
Reply #204 - Aug 1^st, 2022 at 9:02am

Here we go again with the 'national park' end run around equalities and the rules:-

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-07-31/wa-government-announces-new-marine-parks-...

This one claims to provide the details, but I haven't read it yet - honest broker that I am I put it out here for you sight unseen:-

https://voice.niaa.gov.au/final-report

Doesn't give much and this is not the Final solution, and Albo will not tell us what that is, but:-

It APPEARS that the idea is that there will be such "Voices" at the local and Regional level according to THIS plan, and that the members of the Federal Voice will be elected from among them by Aborigines only and overseen by an 'ethics committee'. So this is intended to pervade all levels of government throughout the nation - and without an equal representative voice from any other group.

Of course this theory is like the feminist theory that men already have all the running etc, and so require no special voice in their issues, even when those directly affect men, often adversely. Apparently the lobby groups already in existence and the land councils and special departments in government etc are not enough.

Of course, IF this gets up, those will all have to be abolished as superfluous. How many layers of shadow government does one group actually need, when they are 3.3% of the population?

The consultation phase had no input from any other social group.

Read carefully people... there is more there for you to digest...... and now we come to the important question given that this lays out the 'final report' concept for this proposal:-

Why is Albo being so coy about detailing the final solution? According to this and Langton it's right in front of him..... where is he on this?

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« Last Edit: Aug 1^st, 2022 at 9:16am by Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM »

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

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Gnads

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Re: The question about a voice will be asked...
Reply #205 - Aug 1^st, 2022 at 9:04am

Brian Ross wrote on Jul 31^st, 2022 at 10:51pm:

It seems the Racists are as usual, running round like chooks with their heads cut off simply at the idea of a question being asked of the Australian people. Shame on you, that you would distrust the Australian people so much. You really are despicable. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

There's much more to it than just wasting $millions on a simple question Dickhead.

There are not enough details to be asking the question.

It is in fact an idea with far too much fine print that is conveniently disguised as to be
illegible.

In other words they don't know either.

Why should that be put to a referendum without any clarity?

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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: The question about a voice will be asked...
Reply #206 - Aug 1^st, 2022 at 9:17am

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Aug 1^st, 2022 at 9:02am:

Here we go again with the 'national park' end run around equalities and the rules:-

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-07-31/wa-government-announces-new-marine-parks-...

This one claims to provide the details, but I haven't read it yet - honest broker that I am I put it out here for you sight unseen:-

https://voice.niaa.gov.au/final-report

Doesn't give much and this is not the Final solution, and Albo will not tell us what that is, but:-

It APPEARS that the idea is that there will be such "Voices" at the local and Regional level according to THIS plan, and that the members of the Federal Voice will be elected from among them by Aborigines only and overseen by an 'ethics committee'. So this is intended to pervade all levels of government throughout the nation - and without an equal representative voice from any other group.

Of course this theory is like the feminist theory that men already have all the running etc, and so require no special voice in their issues, even when those directly affect men, often adversely. Apparently the lobby groups already in existence and the land councils and special departments in government etc are not enough.

Of course, IF this gets up, those will all have to be abolished as superfluous. How many layers of shadow government does one group actually need, when they are 3.3% of the population?

The consultation phase had no input from any other social group.

Read carefully people... there is more there for you to digest...... and now we come to the important question given that this lays out the 'final report' concept for this proposal:-

Why is Albo being so coy about detailing the final solution? According to this and Langton it's right in front of him..... where is he on this?

P.S. If there were opportunities for all Australians to discuss at these pre-meetings - why did I never hear of it? Give me the hard data on the actual attendance.

A bit more meat for the mill:-

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2022/07/28/canadian-universities-tackle-fals...

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« Last Edit: Aug 1^st, 2022 at 9:26am by Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM »

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

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Belgarion Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5681 Gender:	Re: The question about a voice will be asked... Reply #207 - Aug 1^st, 2022 at 9:37am Let's see what a real Aboriginal has to say about it. She understands that this 'voice' will be nothing but a gravy train for activists with no help whatsoever for the marginalised. https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/indigenous-voice-could-drive-a-wedge-bet...
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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: The question about a voice will be asked...
Reply #208 - Aug 1^st, 2022 at 9:57am

Belgarion wrote on Aug 1^st, 2022 at 9:37am:

Let's see what a real Aboriginal has to say about it. She understands that this 'voice' will be nothing but a gravy train for activists with no help whatsoever for the marginalised.

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/indigenous-voice-could-drive-a-wedge-bet...

Sounds like it is a job creation scheme where there are no jobs and only for the 'right type' (usually meaning the local silverback and the 'activist') - and special jobs doing nothing but chat at huge salary and perks.

As I said - a shadow government within government...... and a typical Labor end run.

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

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Brian Ross Gold Member Offline Representative of me Posts: 44327	Re: The question about a voice will be asked... Reply #209 - Aug 1^st, 2022 at 12:02pm Voice to Parliament referendum must be kept simple to succeed, says Indigenous Australians Minister Why does the government need a referendum on Indigenous Voice to Parliament? What if it fails?
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Poll
Question: Will you vote for a separate Aboriginal Voice in Parliament?
YES 11 (28.9%) NO 27 (71.1%) Total votes: 38 « Created by: Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM on: Jul 30^th, 2022 at 7:27pm »