Australian Politics Forum - No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power

Gordon

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Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power
Reply #15 - May 31^st, 2022 at 6:14pm

Dnarever wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 3:40pm:

I do not think that Nuclear is still up to the standard that we need for it to be used in Australia.

How could we do it ?

We could never trust for it to be run as a private concern the risk would be much too great.

Do not see running it as a public enterprise would be any better. We are a far too casual people, I see no outcome that would not resemble Homer Simpson a bit too closely.

Anything private would be profit driven and corner cutting would be the practise, I see that as the for never option.

One day but not the current technology.

Why don't you trust Australian experts to run a facility like this?
Do you always talk our country down?

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Gordon Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21296 Gordon Gender:	Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power Reply #16 - May 31^st, 2022 at 6:17pm In the next 10 years most car companies will all have electric options and the cost will come down considerably. Now when they're plugged in at NIGHT to recharge, where will that power come from?
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Dnarever

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Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power
Reply #17 - May 31^st, 2022 at 7:01pm

Gordon wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 6:14pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 3:40pm:

I do not think that Nuclear is still up to the standard that we need for it to be used in Australia.

How could we do it ?

We could never trust for it to be run as a private concern the risk would be much too great.

Do not see running it as a public enterprise would be any better. We are a far too casual people, I see no outcome that would not resemble Homer Simpson a bit too closely.

Anything private would be profit driven and corner cutting would be the practise, I see that as the for never option.

One day but not the current technology.

Why don't you trust Australian experts to run a facility like this?
Do you always talk our country down?

There is nothing in the story to say that it would be run by experts or even Australians ?

There would be almost zero chance of an Australian company winning a contract to do this.

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Dnarever

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Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power
Reply #18 - May 31^st, 2022 at 7:04pm

Gordon wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 6:14pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 3:40pm:

I do not think that Nuclear is still up to the standard that we need for it to be used in Australia.

How could we do it ?

We could never trust for it to be run as a private concern the risk would be much too great.

Do not see running it as a public enterprise would be any better. We are a far too casual people, I see no outcome that would not resemble Homer Simpson a bit too closely.

Anything private would be profit driven and corner cutting would be the practise, I see that as the for never option.

One day but not the current technology.

Why don't you trust Australian experts to run a facility like this?
Do you always talk our country down?

It isn't talking the country down to recommend against dangerous technology being adopted.

And it is true that our she'll be right mate attitude is less than ideal for this type of industry. There are many things Australians are great at but I suspect this isn't near the top of that list.

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Belgarion

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Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power
Reply #19 - May 31^st, 2022 at 7:50pm

Dnarever wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 7:04pm:

Gordon wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 6:14pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 3:40pm:

I do not think that Nuclear is still up to the standard that we need for it to be used in Australia.

How could we do it ?

We could never trust for it to be run as a private concern the risk would be much too great.

Do not see running it as a public enterprise would be any better. We are a far too casual people, I see no outcome that would not resemble Homer Simpson a bit too closely.

Anything private would be profit driven and corner cutting would be the practise, I see that as the for never option.

One day but not the current technology.

Why don't you trust Australian experts to run a facility like this?
Do you always talk our country down?

It isn't talking the country down to recommend against dangerous technology being adopted.

And it is true that our she'll be right mate attitude is less than ideal for this type of industry. There are many things Australians are great at but I suspect this isn't near the top of that list.

You are a sad person indeed if you have no faith in the ability of your fellow countrymen to operate and maintain nuclear power plants effectively. There are 32 countries that operate nuclear power plants. These include such places as Mexico, Bangladesh, India and Pakistan.....You really think Australians cannot operate such plants when this lot can? And what of the Lucas Heights reactor? Operated for 60 years without mishap....You are allowing your irrational fear to take charge of you.

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"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 19312 Gender:	Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power Reply #20 - May 31^st, 2022 at 8:03pm Whoever said Dna was rational?
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Gordon Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21296 Gordon Gender:	Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power Reply #21 - May 31^st, 2022 at 8:12pm We found an Australia hater.
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Dnarever

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Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power
Reply #22 - May 31^st, 2022 at 9:43pm

Belgarion wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 7:50pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 7:04pm:

Gordon wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 6:14pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 3:40pm:

I do not think that Nuclear is still up to the standard that we need for it to be used in Australia.

How could we do it ?

We could never trust for it to be run as a private concern the risk would be much too great.

Do not see running it as a public enterprise would be any better. We are a far too casual people, I see no outcome that would not resemble Homer Simpson a bit too closely.

Anything private would be profit driven and corner cutting would be the practise, I see that as the for never option.

One day but not the current technology.

Why don't you trust Australian experts to run a facility like this?
Do you always talk our country down?

It isn't talking the country down to recommend against dangerous technology being adopted.

And it is true that our she'll be right mate attitude is less than ideal for this type of industry. There are many things Australians are great at but I suspect this isn't near the top of that list.

You are a sad person indeed if you have no faith in the ability of your fellow countrymen to operate and maintain nuclear power plants effectively. There are 32 countries that operate nuclear power plants. These include such places as Mexico, Bangladesh, India and Pakistan.....You really think Australians cannot operate such plants when this lot can? And what of the Lucas Heights reactor? Operated for 60 years without mishap....You are allowing your irrational fear to take charge of you.

Quote:

You are a sad person indeed if you have no faith in the ability of your fellow countrymen to operate and maintain nuclear power plants effectively.

As I said there is nothing in the story to say that this is the intention. It would be unlikely to be the case.

Quote:

There are 32 countries that operate nuclear power plants.

Most have narrowly averted disasters and a few haven't. Most have had human related failures and mostly cost cutting and maintenance standards have been brought into question when investigated. You know the same things that routinely happens in Australia would be an almost certainty over time.

Quote:

And what of the Lucas Heights reactor? Operated for 60 years without mishap

My view is partially based on the opinions of a few people I know who work there or have worked there. They do in fact know the difference between what they do and a commercial nuclear power plant.

I have in the past (late 1990's) worked (science unrelated) with CSIRO physicist and science people (specialising in radiation sciences) who could be called in on projects like this.

It isn't a lack of faith in the people it is that the technology is still basically the same as it was 50 years ago. Yes they made it safer over time but it is still basically the same and it is still not a safe enough option.

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LNP never again Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1663 Gender:	Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power Reply #23 - May 31^st, 2022 at 9:47pm It's a weight off your shoulders sitting on back bench Barnaby , maybe another baby and sell your story too new idea again as it's hard living on 180k Enjoy opposition Barnaby
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Bobby.

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Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power
Reply #24 - May 31^st, 2022 at 9:54pm

Johnnie wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 6:03pm:

Bobby. wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 5:30pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 5:22pm:

Nuclear takes far too long to build and is far too expensive.

Possible exception would be modular reactors.

A rigid NO! to nuclear is not right and not needed. If done right nuclear could be a back up to renewables.

One energy source not being used, tho available in the Cooper Basin—geothermal energy.
Cooper Basic could supply Qld-NSW–Vic-SA.

Will Albanese organise it?

https://arena.gov.au/projects/cooper-basin-enhanced-geothermal-systems-heat-and-...

This technology does not rely on volcanic systems but uses hot basement granite rocks to generate electricity. Hot granite rocks in South Australia’s Cooper Basin reach temperatures in excess of 280 degrees Celsius.

This geothermal energy resource is accessed by drilling wells 4-5 kilometres deep into the granite rock and pumping water at high pressure into the rock to open up its naturally occurring fracture systems. Water is then circulated down injection wells into the hot rocks, through the granite and back up the production wells.

The energy in the hot geothermal brine produced at the surface was used to drive a steam turbine and produced electricity. This project is the first demonstration of EGS geothermal electricity generation in Australia. The 1 MWe Habanero pilot plant operated for 160 days in 2013 and prior to closure of the trial, the plant was operating at 19kg/s and 215 degrees celsius production well head temperature.

Its not viable given the depth etc, especially when all they have to do is drill a hole just about anywhere in the Cooper Basin and extract gas and oil. Wind power would beat that hands down and then solar.

I don't know about gas and oil there.
The whole idea is to have renewable power.

Geothermal energy is great if technical problems can be overcome.

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Belgarion

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Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power
Reply #25 - Jun 1^st, 2022 at 12:15pm

Dnarever wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 9:43pm:

Belgarion wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 7:50pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 7:04pm:

Gordon wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 6:14pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 3:40pm:

I do not think that Nuclear is still up to the standard that we need for it to be used in Australia.

How could we do it ?

We could never trust for it to be run as a private concern the risk would be much too great.

Do not see running it as a public enterprise would be any better. We are a far too casual people, I see no outcome that would not resemble Homer Simpson a bit too closely.

Anything private would be profit driven and corner cutting would be the practise, I see that as the for never option.

One day but not the current technology.

Why don't you trust Australian experts to run a facility like this?
Do you always talk our country down?

It isn't talking the country down to recommend against dangerous technology being adopted.

And it is true that our she'll be right mate attitude is less than ideal for this type of industry. There are many things Australians are great at but I suspect this isn't near the top of that list.

You are a sad person indeed if you have no faith in the ability of your fellow countrymen to operate and maintain nuclear power plants effectively. There are 32 countries that operate nuclear power plants. These include such places as Mexico, Bangladesh, India and Pakistan.....You really think Australians cannot operate such plants when this lot can? And what of the Lucas Heights reactor? Operated for 60 years without mishap....You are allowing your irrational fear to take charge of you.

Quote:

You are a sad person indeed if you have no faith in the ability of your fellow countrymen to operate and maintain nuclear power plants effectively.

As I said there is nothing in the story to say that this is the intention. It would be unlikely to be the case.

Quote:

There are 32 countries that operate nuclear power plants.

Most have narrowly averted disasters and a few haven't. Most have had human related failures and mostly cost cutting and maintenance standards have been brought into question when investigated. You know the same things that routinely happens in Australia would be an almost certainty over time.

Quote:

And what of the Lucas Heights reactor? Operated for 60 years without mishap

My view is partially based on the opinions of a few people I know who work there or have worked there. They do in fact know the difference between what they do and a commercial nuclear power plant.

I have in the past (late 1990's) worked (science unrelated) with CSIRO physicist and science people (specialising in radiation sciences) who could be called in on projects like this.

It isn't a lack of faith in the people it is that the technology is still basically the same as it was 50 years ago. Yes they made it safer over time but it is still basically the same and it is still not a safe enough option.

"Narrowly averted disaster ' is just media senstionalism. Any issues have been of a minor nature and even with the trinity that the anti nuclear lobby always points to, Three Mile Island, Fukushima and Chernobyl the only deaths from radiation were at Chernobyl, and that disaster was due to political interference in the operation of the plant as well as design issues and operator error.

Reactor technology has come long way since then. To be afraid of nuclear power is like being afraid to fly in a modern jet airliner because of the problems with the Comet.

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"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."

Voltaire.....(possibly)

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Baronvonrort

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Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power
Reply #26 - Jun 3^rd, 2022 at 4:55pm

whiteknight wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 1:20pm:

The correct answer is yes we need renewable power. Sad

The Greens oppose the cleanest and cheapest forms of power which are Hydro and Nuclear.

Tasmania nearly runs on Hydro we can thank Bob Brown for stopping it everywhere else.

Hydro is the cheapest way to generate electricity it still works when sun doesn't shine and wind doesn't blow.

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AusGeoff

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Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power
Reply #27 - Jun 4^th, 2022 at 8:49am

Dnarever wrote on May 31^st, 2022 at 3:40pm:

I do not think that Nuclear is still up to the standard that we need for it to be used in Australia.

I reckon we are. We've operating the nuclear reactor(s) at Lucas Heights
without any untoward malfunctions for over sixty years.

Quote:

We could never trust for it to be run as a private concern the risk would be much too great.

Why not? Our electricity, gas, and petroleum industries are run by private concerns.

Quote:

Do not see running it as a public enterprise would be any better. We are a far too casual people, I see no outcome that would not resemble Homer Simpson a bit too closely.

Are you seriously comparing the possibility of Australian nuclear power generation
facilities as similar to a silly cartoon figure? Tell me you're kidding.

Quote:

Anything private would be profit driven and corner cutting would be the practice,
I see that as the for never option.

Uh... did you know that all our current wind and solar power generating facilities
are privately owned and operated and—ultimately—profit driven?

Quote:

One day but not the current technology.

What's wrong specifically with current nuclear technology? How would you suggest
improving it?

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 50198 Gender:	Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power Reply #28 - Jun 5^th, 2022 at 10:43am Fusion will be the game changer here.
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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 77787 Gender:	Re: No Thanks Mr Joyce, We Don't Want Nuclear Power Reply #29 - Jun 5^th, 2022 at 10:48am AusGeoff wrote on Jun 4^th, 2022 at 8:49am: Why not? Our electricity, gas, and petroleum industries are run by private concerns. and they are hounded by constant blackouts, supply issues, failing infrastructure and a lack of forward planning.
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